Arctic Sea Ice – Ten Years Past The Tipping Point

[Crick]

 

[Sunsettommy]

 

[mamooth]

Try for more civility and debate and less bile, or I will report you for trolling.

This isn't WUWT, little Stalinist. You don't get to auto-censor anyone who interrupts the discussion with facts and reason. And speaking of board rules, this board frowns on mods from other forums pushing their own forum here. You know, what you're doing.

Now, let's get back to what you hate most, and keep talking about the science.

article I posted named a lot more than two, but just like Frigidweirdo and Old Rocks, you need to read in the link to find out.

No, your link presented two saying "could", and then the author Seth Borenstein made a summary about what Hansen said, without providing an actual quote. So, you've actually got zero. So long, thanks for playing.

there has been NO MORE DECLINE SINCE 2007there has been NO MORE DECLINE SINCE 2007

A totally absurd claim. Anyone making it is either too stupid to understand the concept of noise on a declining mean, or they're just lying. In either case, it means that person shouldn't be bothering the grownups.

 

[Crick]

The word "may" is a weasel word since he made it clear it was for THAT year.

You're not familiar with natural science, are you.

Since he was WAAAAAY off on it and the later 2015 prediction was also WAAAAAY off on. Why should YOU continue to take him seriously when he is continually WAAAAAY off?

I have never heard of Dave Barber before and I have certainly never knowingly used him as a reference for anything nor have I supported his claim that the Arctic would be ice free ten years ago. Try addressing my arguments instead of the those you find wandering the internet. If you want my best estimate of when the Arctic will be ice free, simply extend the PIOMAS graph to the x-intercept. A simple linear extrapolation suggests we will have an ice-free Arctic in the summer of 2030 or so.

[QUOTE="Sunsettommy, post: 21283277, member: 69549"
Surely you already knew I accept that it has been warming since the late 1600's, that the increase in CO2 in the atmosphere is GOOD for the planet and that there is no evidence that the current warming trend is a concern to us since it was a LOT warmer early in the interglacial period and even warmer in the previous interglacial period.
[/quote]

Surely I did not. You are not someone to whom I pay any significant attention. But now that I know these things, I find that my initial estimate of your working knowledge re science and the climate issues in particular was correct. I'll make two points in response: 1) It is not the temperatures we are attaining that threatens us all, it is the RATE at which we are warming and 2) What was the human population in the previous interglacial period and 2.5) What was the maximum rate of warming back in the last interglacial period? Looks like 20,000 years to rise 12C. That's 0.06C/century. What's our current rate? 2C/century or over 33 TIMES the rate back then. Don't you think that might matter?

 

[Sunsettommy]

Mamooth never stops with the over the top flaming and personal attacks:

"This isn't WUWT, little Stalinist. You don't get to auto-censor anyone who interrupts the discussion with facts and reason. And speaking of board rules, this board frowns on mods from other forums pushing their own forum here. You know, what you're doing."

• In Zone2 -- EVERY reply must have some NEW perspective on that specific thread topic that advances the discussion, clarifies a point, responds to on-topic questions.
• Before you hit the "Reply Button" check your post to guarantee that it is not just repetition or pure personal flame and that you've included something that advances the SPECIFIC topic of that thread.

Edited- meister

 

[Sunsettommy]

The word "may" is a weasel word since he made it clear it was for THAT year.

You're not familiar with natural science, are you.

Since he was WAAAAAY off on it and the later 2015 prediction was also WAAAAAY off on. Why should YOU continue to take him seriously when he is continually WAAAAAY off?

I have never heard of Dave Barber before and I have certainly never knowingly used him as a reference for anything nor have I supported his claim that the Arctic would be ice free ten years ago. Try addressing my arguments instead of the those you find wandering the internet. If you want my best estimate of when the Arctic will be ice free, simply extend the PIOMAS graph to the x-intercept. A simple linear extrapolation suggests we will have an ice-free Arctic in the summer of 2030 or so.

[QUOTE="Sunsettommy, post: 21283277, member: 69549"
Surely you already knew I accept that it has been warming since the late 1600's, that the increase in CO2 in the atmosphere is GOOD for the planet and that there is no evidence that the current warming trend is a concern to us since it was a LOT warmer early in the interglacial period and even warmer in the previous interglacial period.

Crick writes,

"Surely I did not. You are not someone to whom I pay any significant attention. But now that I know these things, I find that my initial estimate of your working knowledge re science and the climate issues in particular was correct. I'll make two points in response: 1) It is not the temperatures we are attaining that threatens us all, it is the RATE at which we are warming and 2) What was the human population in the previous interglacial period and 2.5) What was the maximum rate of warming back in the last interglacial period? Looks like 20,000 years to rise 12C. That's 0.06C/century. What's our current rate? 2C/century or over 33 TIMES the rate back then. Don't you think that might matter?"

Well Gee Crick, he made that statement just THREE MONTH earlier that year, yet he still thought it might be free of sea ice THAT Summer, when it was obviously going to be higher than a year earlier. He also said it would be the first time in history too:

"“We’re actually projecting this year that the North Pole may be free of ice for the first time [in history].”

 

[Crick]

I guess I should speak more clearly. Who the fuck cares? Arctic ice extents are shrinking. The PIOMAS volume data predicts a 2030 ice-free summer. The world is going to shit due to fools like you.

 

[Sunsettommy]

I guess I should speak more clearly. Who the fuck cares? Arctic ice extents are shrinking. The PIOMAS volume data predicts a 2030 ice-free summer. The world is going to shit due to fools like you.

I care about being accurate and credible.

You keep ignoring a lot of published research showing that for a centuries in the early Holocene there were little to no Summer ice in the Arctic region, yet no indication of disaster for the planet, Polar Bears, Eskimos, Humans and many other critters that still lives in the Arctic region today.

You also keep ignoring the well established fact that since 2007, there has been NO further decline, you chart showed it so did mine, why fight reality? Maybe it will decline some more later on or increase, who knows for sure.

 

[Crick]

I guess I should speak more clearly. Who the fuck cares? Arctic ice extents are shrinking. The PIOMAS volume data predicts a 2030 ice-free summer. The world is going to shit due to fools like you.

I care about being accurate and credible.

Bullshit.

You keep ignoring a lot of published research showing that for a centuries in the early Holocene there were little to no Summer ice in the Arctic region, yet no indication of disaster for the planet, Polar Bears, Eskimos, Humans and many other critters that still lives in the Arctic region today.

Warming in the early Holocene took place 30 or more times as slowly as it is taking place today. The Earth's population was a tiny fraction of what it is today and infrastructure simply did not exist. How many times do you have to be told that it is NOT the absolute temperatures we are achieving, it isTHE FUCKING RATE AT WHICH WE'RE DOING SO.

You also keep ignoring the well established fact that since 2007, there has been NO further decline, you chart showed it so did mine, why fight reality? Maybe it will decline some more later on or increase, who knows for sure.

The scientists of the world have a pretty good idea. Since virtually every single one of them accepts the greenhouse theory and accepts the measurements that show CO2 levels are still increasing, they conclude that the world is going to continue to get warmer and that will generally just fuck the lot of us.

 

[mamooth]

Mamooth never stops with the over the top flaming and personal attacks:

If you want to keep screaming insults at me instead of discussing Arctic sea ice, you shouldn't have made a thread here about Arctic sea ice. You should have made an "I HATE YOU MAMOOTH" thread in the rubber room or something. Take a lesson from my good example. Unlike your tirades, my posts always include discussion relevant to the thread topic.

Now, let's get back again to those points you keep trying to run from.

Why did you make the crazy claim that Arctic Ice decline stopped in 2007? This little graphic sums up the absurdity of that claim.

Why did you fake a story about many scientists predicting an end to Arctic sea ice by now? Because they didn't.

What does IPCC AR5 say about the consensus on the issue? That would be the honest thing to do, talk about the actual consensus, instead of dishonestly cherrypicking your own version of reality.

This illustrates why it's so good to be part of the reason-based side. We never have to cherrypick or make things up, so we never have to explain why we used such tactics. To win, we simply have to point at the facts.