And when only the police have guns....and decide the cartels pay better..they kill innocent people..

[JoeB131]

no....we don't keep violent criminals locked up....we let them out and they attack other people........if we have more criminals we have more criminals...they still have to be locked up.....we have to stop letting the violent ones back out...especially ones with weapon charges.....that is how you stop gun crime....

No, the problem is a lot of people we lock up aren't violent, and we do a shit poor job of rehabbing them. And then we make it really easy for them to get guns.

Because then guys like you get all scared and you want guns, too.

 

[2aguy]

Yes...allowing parent's who care to get their kids out of the schools controlled by democrat unions and gangs....and give them a chance at a real education....I can see how that would be a bad thing.......right?

no....we don't keep violent criminals locked up....we let them out and they attack other people........if we have more criminals we have more criminals...they still have to be locked up.....we have to stop letting the violent ones back out...especially ones with weapon charges.....that is how you stop gun crime....

No, the problem is a lot of people we lock up aren't violent, and we do a shit poor job of rehabbing them. And then we make it really easy for them to get guns.

Because then guys like you get all scared and you want guns, too.

I want guns because people like you keep letting out the killers.....and the rapists....and the other bad guys.......

 

[Brain357]

Yes...allowing parent's who care to get their kids out of the schools controlled by democrat unions and gangs....and give them a chance at a real education....I can see how that would be a bad thing.......right?

no....we don't keep violent criminals locked up....we let them out and they attack other people........if we have more criminals we have more criminals...they still have to be locked up.....we have to stop letting the violent ones back out...especially ones with weapon charges.....that is how you stop gun crime....

No, the problem is a lot of people we lock up aren't violent, and we do a shit poor job of rehabbing them. And then we make it really easy for them to get guns.

Because then guys like you get all scared and you want guns, too.

I want guns because people like you keep letting out the killers.....and the rapists....and the other bad guys.......

Ah you come clean, get kids out of democrat Union schools. Vouchers are designed to hurt teachers, not help education. Pretty low move given the importance of education.

 

[2aguy]

Yes...allowing parent's who care to get their kids out of the schools controlled by democrat unions and gangs....and give them a chance at a real education....I can see how that would be a bad thing.......right?

no....we don't keep violent criminals locked up....we let them out and they attack other people........if we have more criminals we have more criminals...they still have to be locked up.....we have to stop letting the violent ones back out...especially ones with weapon charges.....that is how you stop gun crime....

No, the problem is a lot of people we lock up aren't violent, and we do a shit poor job of rehabbing them. And then we make it really easy for them to get guns.

Because then guys like you get all scared and you want guns, too.

I want guns because people like you keep letting out the killers.....and the rapists....and the other bad guys.......

Ah you come clean, get kids out of democrat Union schools. Vouchers are designed to hurt teachers, not help education. Pretty low move given the importance of education.

So...you want to save teachers who don't teach kids....you want to keep them trapped in schools simply because they have no money to go to better schools....vouchers help all kids.....all schools will have to compete for those dollars and the only way to get those dollars is to actually teach kids.....public schools will have to actually get better at what they do...they won't get to keep their jobs with a 50% success rate and kids graduating who can't read, write or understand simple math....we are talking about the lives of millions of children diminished simply to keep the money flowing to teacher's unions and their politicians.....

I prefer to save the lives of those children....you just want to save teacher unions, and corrupt, greedy politicians....

 

[Brain357]

Yes...allowing parent's who care to get their kids out of the schools controlled by democrat unions and gangs....and give them a chance at a real education....I can see how that would be a bad thing.......right?

no....we don't keep violent criminals locked up....we let them out and they attack other people........if we have more criminals we have more criminals...they still have to be locked up.....we have to stop letting the violent ones back out...especially ones with weapon charges.....that is how you stop gun crime....

No, the problem is a lot of people we lock up aren't violent, and we do a shit poor job of rehabbing them. And then we make it really easy for them to get guns.

Because then guys like you get all scared and you want guns, too.

I want guns because people like you keep letting out the killers.....and the rapists....and the other bad guys.......

Ah you come clean, get kids out of democrat Union schools. Vouchers are designed to hurt teachers, not help education. Pretty low move given the importance of education.

So...you want to save teachers who don't teach kids....you want to keep them trapped in schools simply because they have no money to go to better schools....vouchers help all kids.....all schools will have to compete for those dollars and the only way to get those dollars is to actually teach kids.....public schools will have to actually get better at what they do...they won't get to keep their jobs with a 50% success rate and kids graduating who can't read, write or understand simple math....we are talking about the lives of millions of children diminished simply to keep the money flowing to teacher's unions and their politicians.....

I prefer to save the lives of those children....you just want to save teacher unions, and corrupt, greedy politicians....

I showed you a study where they don't actually help kids. Do you know something I don't?

Taking funding from public schools isn't going to help and there is no evidence vouchers help anyone. My children are in public schools and I'm quite happy with the teachers and school.

Where are you getting this 50% number from anyhow? Schools are a whole lot more successful around here than that.

 

[2aguy]

And kids who got vouchers in D.C. Increased their graduation rates....

Jason Riley The Evidence Is In School Vouchers Work - WSJ

 

[JoeB131]

Yes...allowing parent's who care to get their kids out of the schools controlled by democrat unions and gangs....and give them a chance at a real education....I can see how that would be a bad thing.......right?

If they care, they can spend their own money. Or they can try the novel approach of sitting down with their kids and making sure they do their homework, asking what they learned today. You know, things involved parents do.

Throwing money at shady corporations, meh, not so much.

I want guns because people like you keep letting out the killers.....and the rapists....and the other bad guys.......

Again, we lock up more people than any country in the world.

You want guns because you are "compensating" for other inadequacies.

 

[Brain357]

And kids who got vouchers in D.C. Increased their graduation rates....

Jason Riley The Evidence Is In School Vouchers Work - WSJ

What is the quality of the education?
Quality controls lacking for D.C. schools accepting federal vouchers - The Washington Post
But a Washington Post review found that hundreds of students use their voucher dollars to attend schools that are unaccredited or are in unconventional settings, such as a family-run K-12 school operating out of a storefront, a Nation of Islam school based in a converted Deanwood residence, and a school built around the philosophy of a Bulgarian psychotherap

 

[2aguy]

Brain....I'll give parents control over the education of their children over trapping them in schools that don't educate their children......each parent has that responsiblity and they are the ones who care the most about their child. Public education sucks in too many places, and forcing parents to keep their kids in failing schools, where the future of their child is left to union protected hacks is not an option....

You want to protect bad teachers and bad schools....I want to give good parents the ability to save their children......we just differ in that respect...you choose the collective, I choose the human being.......

 

[2aguy]

Yes...allowing parent's who care to get their kids out of the schools controlled by democrat unions and gangs....and give them a chance at a real education....I can see how that would be a bad thing.......right?

If they care, they can spend their own money. Or they can try the novel approach of sitting down with their kids and making sure they do their homework, asking what they learned today. You know, things involved parents do.

Throwing money at shady corporations, meh, not so much.

I want guns because people like you keep letting out the killers.....and the rapists....and the other bad guys.......

Again, we lock up more people than any country in the world.

You want guns because you are "compensating" for other inadequacies.

Yes...I am compensating for fools like you who have no concept of reality, and believe that the problem we have with violence is not violent sociopaths who attack as individuals or in groups....but normal, law abiding people who commit no crimes..........

 

[Brain357]

And kids who got vouchers in D.C. Increased their graduation rates....

Jason Riley The Evidence Is In School Vouchers

Brain....I'll give parents control over the education of their children over trapping them in schools that don't educate their children......each parent has that responsiblity and they are the ones who care the most about their child. Public education sucks in too many places, and forcing parents to keep their kids in failing schools, where the future of their child is left to union protected hacks is not an option....

You want to protect bad teachers and bad schools....I want to give good parents the ability to save their children......we just differ in that respect...you choose the collective, I choose the human being.......

Well be aware it's not equalling a better education. I don't think tax dollars should go to private schools. They should go to improve public schools. The parents who care can get their children a great education at public schools. The bad students have parents who don't care. Even the best teachers can't work with a student and parents who don't care. Private schools don't have that problem.

 

[2aguy]

And kids who got vouchers in D.C. Increased their graduation rates....

Jason Riley The Evidence Is In School Vouchers

Brain....I'll give parents control over the education of their children over trapping them in schools that don't educate their children......each parent has that responsiblity and they are the ones who care the most about their child. Public education sucks in too many places, and forcing parents to keep their kids in failing schools, where the future of their child is left to union protected hacks is not an option....

You want to protect bad teachers and bad schools....I want to give good parents the ability to save their children......we just differ in that respect...you choose the collective, I choose the human being.......

Well be aware it's not equalling a better education. I don't think tax dollars should go to private schools. They should go to improve public schools. The parents who care can get their children a great education at public schools. The bad students have parents who don't care. Even the best teachers can't work with a student and parents who don't care. Private schools don't have that problem.

You mean like colleges and Universities........where we outclass the world........because people use tax money to go to the best college they can.......so you are for ending all tax money subsidizing private universities...under the G.I. Bill even.....

Kids with bad parents are not going to have as good a chance wether you have vouchers or not.....the parents who can and do take care of their children...giving them control over where they send their kids to school is a win win for them and for society....forcing them to stay in gang infested schools with horrible teachers, when all they lack is the money and the choice is a crime........

 

[danielpalos]

And kids who got vouchers in D.C. Increased their graduation rates....

Jason Riley The Evidence Is In School Vouchers Work - WSJ

When has bearing true witness to our own laws ever been tried?

 

[Brain357]

And kids who got vouchers in D.C. Increased their graduation rates....

Jason Riley The Evidence Is In School Vouchers

Brain....I'll give parents control over the education of their children over trapping them in schools that don't educate their children......each parent has that responsiblity and they are the ones who care the most about their child. Public education sucks in too many places, and forcing parents to keep their kids in failing schools, where the future of their child is left to union protected hacks is not an option....

You want to protect bad teachers and bad schools....I want to give good parents the ability to save their children......we just differ in that respect...you choose the collective, I choose the human being.......

Well be aware it's not equalling a better education. I don't think tax dollars should go to private schools. They should go to improve public schools. The parents who care can get their children a great education at public schools. The bad students have parents who don't care. Even the best teachers can't work with a student and parents who don't care. Private schools don't have that problem.

You mean like colleges and Universities........where we outclass the world........because people use tax money to go to the best college they can.......so you are for ending all tax money subsidizing private universities...under the G.I. Bill even.....

Kids with bad parents are not going to have as good a chance wether you have vouchers or not.....the parents who can and do take care of their children...giving them control over where they send their kids to school is a win win for them and for society....forcing them to stay in gang infested schools with horrible teachers, when all they lack is the money and the choice is a crime........

There is no evidence kids using vouchers get a better education. The quality of voucher schools is very questionable and they are not held to any standards. Your voucher system will just create more gang members as those most likely to turn to gangs will have underfunded schools.

 

[JoeB131]

Brain....I'll give parents control over the education of their children over trapping them in schools that don't educate their children......each parent has that responsiblity and they are the ones who care the most about their child. Public education sucks in too many places, and forcing parents to keep their kids in failing schools, where the future of their child is left to union protected hacks is not an option....

You want to protect bad teachers and bad schools....I want to give good parents the ability to save their children......we just differ in that respect...you choose the collective, I choose the human being.......

Naw, guy, the problem is you've bought the voucher snake-oil, when in fact, vouchers don't improve education. they tried it in Wisconsin, it failed miserably.

 

[JoeB131]

Yes...I am compensating for fools like you who have no concept of reality, and believe that the problem we have with violence is not violent sociopaths who attack as individuals or in groups....but normal, law abiding people who commit no crimes....

Again, guy, most of your psychopaths like Loughner and Lanza and Cho were able to walk into a gun store and buy a guy, just like you can.

 

[2aguy]

Yes...I am compensating for fools like you who have no concept of reality, and believe that the problem we have with violence is not violent sociopaths who attack as individuals or in groups....but normal, law abiding people who commit no crimes....

Again, guy, most of your psychopaths like Loughner and Lanza and Cho were able to walk into a gun store and buy a guy, just like you can.

Yes...they all by passed the wonderful background checks......but they did buy their guns legally...at least cho and loughner..Lanza murdered his mother to get his......criminals will always get guns.....the only laws that work are the ones after you catch them breaking the law with the gun. Then you lock them up for a long time....and leave normal, law abiding citizens alone....glad we agree..

 

[JoeB131]

Yes...they all by passed the wonderful background checks......but they did buy their guns legally...at least cho and loughner..Lanza murdered his mother to get his......criminals will always get guns.....the only laws that work are the ones after you catch them breaking the law with the gun. Then you lock them up for a long time....and leave normal, law abiding citizens alone....glad we agree..

Except that they weren't "wonderful" background checks. That's the point. they were inadequate background checks. If they had talked to anyone at Loughner or Cho's schools, they'd have found these guys were serious problems. I'd put Holmes in the same category.

Every time one of these guys goes off, you have everyone in their life saying, "Yup, we all knew he was crazy". Yet the gun sellers can't be bothered to find that out?

Here's how you fix "background checks". If your store sold a gun that was used in a crime, you go to jail.

Problem. Fucking. Solved.

 

[2aguy]

Yes...they all by passed the wonderful background checks......but they did buy their guns legally...at least cho and loughner..Lanza murdered his mother to get his......criminals will always get guns.....the only laws that work are the ones after you catch them breaking the law with the gun. Then you lock them up for a long time....and leave normal, law abiding citizens alone....glad we agree..

Except that they weren't "wonderful" background checks. That's the point. they were inadequate background checks. If they had talked to anyone at Loughner or Cho's schools, they'd have found these guys were serious problems. I'd put Holmes in the same category.

Every time one of these guys goes off, you have everyone in their life saying, "Yup, we all knew he was crazy". Yet the gun sellers can't be bothered to find that out?

Here's how you fix "background checks". If your store sold a gun that was used in a crime, you go to jail.

Problem. Fucking. Solved.

and if you sold the gas that they used to drive their car to the crime scene...lock them up...or if you sold them the car...lock them up.......hey...this is fun......if we,keep this up we will have a nice police state...and we know how much you guys love the police...

 

[JoeB131]

and if you sold the gas that they used to drive their car to the crime scene...lock them up...or if you sold them the car...lock them up.......hey...this is fun......if we,keep this up we will have a nice police state...and we know how much you guys love the police...

Uh, no. But if you want to regulate guns like cars, I'm all for that.

We'd have licences, mandatory insurance for gun owners, mandatory registration, mandetory testing and we can take away your gun when you abuse it, just like we can take away your car now.

I'm totally good with that.

But I still think that if we started holding gun sellers responsible for the carnage they inflict on the country, we'd have a lot less of it.