ANd here is the problem

[Shogun]

First you have to grasp the concept of judicial review. Then perhaps we can go on from there. I know your smoking is the only fundamental right you believe exists, but that isn't quite the case.

I understand judical review. Perhaps you need to understand why we have a system of checks and balances rather than a judicial tyranny.

 

[Ravi]

lol. Where in the constitution does it say Shog can smoke?

 

[jillian]

I understand judical review. Perhaps you need to understand why we have a system of checks and balances rather than a judicial tyranny.

No. You don't understand judicial review or you wouldn't still be demanding to be shown how marriage is one of the fundamental rights protected by the constitution.

 

[Shogun]

First you have to grasp the concept of judicial review. Then perhaps we can go on from there. I know your smoking is the only fundamental right you believe exists, but that isn't quite the case.

Hey, abortions aren't a civil right either, Jill, even if you think the umbrella of loving encompasses every behaviour possible.

 

[Shogun]

No. You don't understand judicial review or you wouldn't still be demanding to be shown how marriage is one of the fundamental rights protected by the constitution.

HA!

fundemental rights my ass. Loving struck down SPECIFICALLY the racial element to the ban on interracial unions. NO where did it bleed over to include homosexuality. You don't have a right to marry a woman if the state you live in votes otherwise. I hate to get all scalia on you but you are simply wrong.

 

[jillian]

Hey, abortions aren't a civil right either, Jill, even if you think the umbrella of loving encompasses every behaviour possible.

Actually, love, until the court says otherwise, they are. or do you think in some delusional shogie world... that you can unilaterally overturn laws you don't like?

I don't like the way the court decided Bush v Gore. It's still the law...

oh wait. it isn't... the court said it had no precedential value.

 

[Shogun]

lol. Where in the constitution does it say Shog can smoke?

the ninth. And, given that STATES ALLOW LEGAL SMOKING i'd love to see you explain how the specific legislative act of a gay marriage ban is even remotely comparable.


then again, it's probably STRAWMAN time since you can't prove your opinion otherwise.

 

[jillian]

HA!

fundemental rights my ass. Loving struck down SPECIFICALLY the racial element to the ban on interracial unions. NO where did it bleed over to include homosexuality. You don't have a right to marry a woman if the state you live in votes otherwise. I hate to get all scalia on you but you are simply wrong.

yes it did... BECAUSE IT IS A FUNDAMENTAL RIGHT. lol...

better go back and read it again because no matter how you contort things, it IS a fundamental right which is subject to strict scrutiny before it can be infringed (which means govt better have a freaking good reason for any limitation).

And guess what... smoking isn't a fundamental right except in shogie-world.

 

[Shogun]

Actually, love, until the court says otherwise, they are. or do you think in some delusional shogie world... that you can unilaterally overturn laws you don't like?

I don't like the way the court decided Bush v Gore. It's still the law...

oh wait. it isn't... the court said it had no precedential value.

which is exactly the problem. by using judical review in place of legislation you diminish the purpose of the the will of the people. It's the same reason why we find so much bullshit being judged using the interstate commerce clause. You know damn well what im talking about even if it's not in your best interest to admit it. Indeed, it's exactly why abortion is no more settled than the next wave of judge packing and is sure as hell the reason that 04 was such a resounding republican victory. You can thank Mass for that year just like we'll be thanking Cali this year.


but, tell me all about overturning laws that you simply don't like some more. It's probably not ironic as fuck given the topic of this thread.

 

[jillian]

which is exactly the problem. by using judical review in place of legislation you diminish the purpose of the the will of the people. It's the same reason why we find so much bullshit being judged using the interstate commerce clause. You know damn well what im talking about even if it's not in your best interest to admit it. Indeed, it's exactly why abortion is no more settled than the next wave of judge packing and is sure as hell the reason that 04 was such a resounding republican victory. You can thank Mass for that year just like we'll be thanking Cali this year.


but, tell me all about overturning laws that you simply don't like some more. It's probably not ironic as fuck given the topic of this thread.

you have a problem with common law, take it up with the brits from whence it comes.

 

[Shogun]

yes it did... BECAUSE IT IS A FUNDAMENTAL RIGHT. lol...

better go back and read it again because no matter how you contort things, it IS a fundamental right which is subject to strict scrutiny before it can be infringed (which means govt better have a freaking good reason for any limitation).

And guess what... smoking isn't a fundamental right except in shogie-world.

Loving was judged because of the RACIAL ELEMENT, jill. NOT to clarify that marriage is a fundemental right.

for crying the fuck out loud, Jill. You DO realize that over a third of the states have gay marriage bans in their constitutions, right? You SO realize that this will be on the ballot come the fall, yes? Do you think lionizing a court decision will keep Cali from repeating it's 2000 choice?


Marriage is not a fundemental right. And, outside of your opinion, PLENTY of people have ideas why restrictions are necessary. Thus, we vote. Until, of course, Jill wants to rationalize a pendelum swinging her way..

 

[Shogun]

you have a problem with common law, take it up with the brits from whence it comes.

yea.. 'cause I sure can see colonial brits legalizing gay marriage, jillian.






hey, make a farce out of the constitution. It's gonna bite you in the ass. When it does, I hope you and I are still around the board to share a laugh about packed courts overturning pet precedence. Until then, lets see how your cavalier approach to muting legislation splays out this fall.



BY the way... speaking of British legal roots.. care to admit anything about British Judicial Review over Legislation... or, the lack thereof?

 

[Ravi]

But it did clarify that marriage is a fundamental right. So you've either got to overturn Loving or make a federal constitutional amendment against gay marriage.

good luck

 

[jillian]

stuff changes... and guess what... women can vote now, too.

 

[Shogun]

But it did clarify that marriage is a fundamental right. So you've either got to overturn Loving or make a federal constitutional amendment against gay marriage.

good luck

no, it really didn't. sorry to burst your bubble. You still can't marry a duck or your car either just in case you were wondering.


and, given how many states have already passed a marriage ban you probably shouldn't be so whimsical about a federal gay marriage ban. I garentfuckingtee that, if the legislation is allowed to even matter, you lose that one all day long.


Ask Jill. She should know how easy a ban could become a fed amendment these days.

 

[Shogun]

stuff changes... and guess what... women can vote now, too.

profound, jill.

say, would you like to tell me if it was the LEGISLATIVE or the JUDICIAL BRANCH that VOTED on womens suffrage...


check mate, jillian.

 

[Ravi]

And they get challenged and struck down.

doh!

 

[Ravi]

profound, jill.

say, would you like to tell me if it was the LEGISLATIVE or the JUDICIAL BRANCH that VOTED on womens suffrage...


check mate, jillian.

It wasn't the people, doofus.

 

[manifold]

Jebus folks! It's friday afternoon, lighten up a bit would ya?

I have personalized prescriptions for each of you.

Jill: Go take a bubble-bath and lose yourself in a chick-porn romance novel.

Shog: smoke a fatty

Ravi: Have a couple glasses of wine and fire-up your electric lover.

 

[Ravi]

Sigh, the batteries died.