An Open Letter to my Fellow Democrats

[CrusaderFrank]

My friends, we are at a crossroads. The challenge we face in 2010 are both unprecedented and without precedent.

Repubs have made gains this past year because we lost our way as a Party. I say this as a proud lifelong democratic member of the Democrat Party

We let the nutburger Bluedogs have too much of a say in our party and we paid dearly.

It's time to say Adios to the lunatic Bluedog fringe and stay the course with our leaders: Pelosi, Reid and the man who is still too moderate for my Democrat tastes, Barry Obama

Let's pass universal healthcare, lets pass cap & trade, lets tax the rich, we had a 90% tax rate before maybe its time to go back to what's always worked for us as Democrats

To Jake, Bfgrn and righwinger I say, Bring it!! My Democratic Party is ready to do battle with you teabagging pubs any day of the week!!

 

[Gunny]

My friends, we are at a crossroads. The challenge we face in 2010 are both unprecedented and without precedent.

Repubs have made gains this past year because we lost our way as a Party. I say this as a proud lifelong democratic member of the Democrat Party

We let the nutburger Bluedogs have too much of a say in our party and we paid dearly.

It's time to say Adios to the lunatic Bluedog fringe and stay the course with our leaders: Pelosi, Reid and the man who is still too moderate for my Democrat tastes, Barry Obama

Let's pass universal healthcare, lets pass cap & trade, lets tax the rich, we had a 90% tax rate before maybe its time to go back to what's always worked for us as Democrats

To Jake, Bfgrn and righwinger I say, Bring it!! My Democratic Party is ready to do battle with you teabagging pubs any day of the week!!

Dude ... really ....

 

[noose4]

What is this Democrat party?

 

[CrusaderFrank]

What is this Democrat party?

It's the proud party that kept the depression going longer than the 7 Biblical lean years, that Democrat Party.

Let Jake come at me with his crazy Republican "ideas" on how to grow the economy, we're back at 17% unemployment like it was under the glory days of FDR, the Greatest Democrat President ever. We rule!

 

[noose4]

What is this Democrat party?

It's the proud party that kept the depression going longer than the 7 Biblical lean years, that Democrat Party.

Let Jake come at me with his crazy Republican "ideas" on how to grow the economy, we're back at 17% unemployment like it was under the glory days of FDR, the Greatest Democrat President ever. We rule!

It is? What country do they exist in? since no party by that name operates in the U.S.A.

 

[midcan5]

"He who knows does not speak, he who speaks does not know." Lao-Tzu

CrusaderFrank, see above, fits you perfectly.

What Is Conservatism and What Is Wrong with It?

 

[CrusaderFrank]

"He who knows does not speak, he who speaks does not know." Lao-Tzu

CrusaderFrank, see above, fits you perfectly.

What Is Conservatism and What Is Wrong with It?

LOL. Note you're speaking to me.

maybe you can get that Home Lobotomy Kit from Lowe's?

 

[kwc57]

My friends, we are at a crossroads. The challenge we face in 2010 are both unprecedented and without precedent.

Repubs have made gains this past year because we lost our way as a Party. I say this as a proud lifelong democratic member of the Democrat Party

We let the nutburger Bluedogs have too much of a say in our party and we paid dearly.

It's time to say Adios to the lunatic Bluedog fringe and stay the course with our leaders: Pelosi, Reid and the man who is still too moderate for my Democrat tastes, Barry Obama

Let's pass universal healthcare, lets pass cap & trade, lets tax the rich, we had a 90% tax rate before maybe its time to go back to what's always worked for us as Democrats

To Jake, Bfgrn and righwinger I say, Bring it!! My Democratic Party is ready to do battle with you teabagging pubs any day of the week!!

Dude ... really ....

While I don't understand it, I totally admire your ability to tolerate the resident troll population.

 

[Harry Dresden]

"He who knows does not speak, he who speaks does not know." Lao-Tzu

CrusaderFrank, see above, fits you perfectly.

What Is Conservatism and What Is Wrong with It?

your always TALKING dipshit.....so i guess it applies to you also.....

 

[Liability]

"He who knows does not speak, he who speaks does not know." Lao-Tzu

CrusaderFrank, see above, fits you perfectly.

What Is Conservatism and What Is Wrong with It?

LOL. Note you're speaking to me.

maybe you can get that Home Lobotomy Kit from Lowe's?

You think he can have TWO lobotomies?

 

[Oddball]

"He who knows does not speak, he who speaks does not know." Lao-Tzu

CrusaderFrank, see above, fits you perfectly.

What Is Conservatism and What Is Wrong with It?

"A bigger heap of steaming, self-serving and self-congratulatory manure, I've not ever seen."

~The Dude

 

[Harry Dresden]

"He who knows does not speak, he who speaks does not know." Lao-Tzu

CrusaderFrank, see above, fits you perfectly.

What Is Conservatism and What Is Wrong with It?

"A bigger heap of steaming, self-serving and self-congratulatory manure, I've not ever seen."

~The Dude

he takes after his mentor....Pelosi...

 

[midcan5]

My friends, we are at the usual crossroad. The challenge we face in 2010 is the same challenge progress has always faced. How do we move forward when invested interests stand in the way?

A few democrats and moderate republicans have made gains this past year, changing the tone of politics to hope, and away from the despair and hubris of the past. I say this as a proud American who wants nothing more than to see America succeed.

But we have let the nuts on the far right go unchallenged too long. Americans suffer as the debate becomes about peripheral issues and not the critical ones of honest paid jobs, more creative uses of energy, and universal healthcare for those Americans in need.

It's time to say adieu to the lunatic fringe and move the nation forward as FDR did, and as progressive politics has always done, starting with our founding as a nation.

Let's bring back the golden rule and consider all Americans, not just the wealthy or the corporate interests. Let clean up the air we all breath, let's tax those who benefit so much from our freedoms fairly for a change, and let's care more for nature, as this is something we will leave to our grandchildren.

To those Americans who care about America, and not just the shrill politics of fear, greed and self interest, let's move forward and get it done. Keep working, we've done it before, we'll do it again.

 

[Harry Dresden]

My friends, we are at the usual crossroad. The challenge we face in 2010 is the same challenge progress has always faced. How do we move forward when invested interests stand in the way?

A few democrats and moderate republicans have made gains this past year, changing the tone of politics to hope, and away from the despair and hubris of the past. I say this as a proud American who wants nothing more than to see America succeed.

But we have let the nuts on the far right go unchallenged too long. Americans suffer as the debate becomes about peripheral issues and not the critical ones of honest paid jobs, more creative uses of energy, and universal healthcare for those Americans in need.

It's time to say adieu to the lunatic fringe and move the nation forward as FDR did, and as progressive politics has always done, starting with our founding as a nation.

Let's bring back the golden rule and consider all Americans, not just the wealthy or the corporate interests. Let clean up the air we all breath, let's tax those who benefit so much from our freedoms fairly for a change, and let's care more for nature, as this is something we will leave to our grandchildren.

To those Americans who care about America, and not just the shrill politics of fear, greed and self interest, let's move forward and get it done. Keep working, we've done it before, we'll do it again.

but nothing to say about you and your FAR leftist friends?......who are also fucking up this country.....until you include them in your little speeches Midcant....YOUR NOTHING BUT A HYPERCRITICAL ....PHONY AMERICAN.....and i use the word AMERICAN lightly here....

 

[CrusaderFrank]

My friends, we are at the usual crossroad. The challenge we face in 2010 is the same challenge progress has always faced. How do we move forward when invested interests stand in the way?

A few democrats and moderate republicans have made gains this past year, changing the tone of politics to hope, and away from the despair and hubris of the past. I say this as a proud American who wants nothing more than to see America succeed.

But we have let the nuts on the far right go unchallenged too long. Americans suffer as the debate becomes about peripheral issues and not the critical ones of honest paid jobs, more creative uses of energy, and universal healthcare for those Americans in need.

It's time to say adieu to the lunatic fringe and move the nation forward as FDR did, and as progressive politics has always done, starting with our founding as a nation.

Let's bring back the golden rule and consider all Americans, not just the wealthy or the corporate interests. Let clean up the air we all breath, let's tax those who benefit so much from our freedoms fairly for a change, and let's care more for nature, as this is something we will leave to our grandchildren.

To those Americans who care about America, and not just the shrill politics of fear, greed and self interest, let's move forward and get it done. Keep working, we've done it before, we'll do it again.

Amen! Obama is on that FDR Glidepath!

Under the sage leadership of Obama and our Democrat Congress we too now have a 17% unemployment rate, just like Democrat Demigod FDR, praise be his holy name

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gqsT4xnKZPg]YouTube - "Happy Days are Here Again!" (Ben Selvin and the Crooners, 1930)[/ame]

If we are to eclipse the record of FDR we must hold this economy steady for the next 7 years. Can you imagine that?! How glorious! Can you imagine this economy for 7 more years? Those were our best days as Democratics!

We're Democrats and we Rule!!

Note that the Republican cowards Jake Starkey, Rightwinger and center-right Bfgrn have avoided this thread. Grow a pair, fellow, bring your radical right-wing ideas here.

 

[Bfgrn]

"He who knows does not speak, he who speaks does not know." Lao-Tzu

CrusaderFrank, see above, fits you perfectly.

What Is Conservatism and What Is Wrong with It?

"A bigger heap of steaming, self-serving and self-congratulatory manure, I've not ever seen."

~The Dude

Really The DUD...e? This is the bigger heap of steaming, self-serving and self-congratulatory manure, you've not ever seen?

What Is Conservatism and What Is Wrong with It?

Philip E. Agre
August 2004

Liberals in the United States have been losing political debates to conservatives for a quarter century. In order to start winning again, liberals must answer two simple questions: what is conservatism, and what is wrong with it? As it happens, the answers to these questions are also simple:

Q: What is conservatism?
A: Conservatism is the domination of society by an aristocracy.

Q: What is wrong with conservatism?
A: Conservatism is incompatible with democracy, prosperity, and civilization in general. It is a destructive system of inequality and prejudice that is founded on deception and has no place in the modern world.

--------------------------------------------------------------

Then THIS must ALSO be the bigger heap of steaming, self-serving and self-congratulatory manure, you've not ever seen. And the author of THIS must be the bigger heap of steaming, self-serving and self-congratulatory manure, you've not ever seen.

Why I Am Not a Conservative

By Nobel laureate F. A. Hayek


In the last resort, the conservative position rests on the belief that in any society there are recognizably superior persons whose inherited standards and values and position ought to be protected and who should have a greater influence on public affairs than others.

Let me return, however, to the main point, which is the characteristic complacency of the conservative toward the action of established authority and his prime concern that this authority be not weakened rather than that its power be kept within bounds. This is difficult to reconcile with the preservation of liberty. In general, it can probably be said that the conservative does not object to coercion or arbitrary power so long as it is used for what he regards as the right purposes. He believes that if government is in the hands of decent men, it ought not to be too much restricted by rigid rules. Since he is essentially opportunist and lacks principles, his main hope must be that the wise and the good will rule - not merely by example, as we all must wish, but by authority given to them and enforced by them.[7] Like the socialist, he is less concerned with the problem of how the powers of government should be limited than with that of who wields them; and, like the socialist, he regards himself as entitled to force the value he holds on other people.

When I say that the conservative lacks principles, I do not mean to suggest that he lacks moral conviction. The typical conservative is indeed usually a man of very strong moral convictions. What I mean is that he has no political principles which enable him to work with people whose moral values differ from his own for a political order in which both can obey their convictions. It is the recognition of such principles that permits the coexistence of different sets of values that makes it possible to build a peaceful society with a minimum of force. The acceptance of such principles means that we agree to tolerate much that we dislike. There are many values of the conservative which appeal to me more than those of the socialists; yet for a liberal the importance he personally attaches to specific goals is no sufficient justification for forcing others to serve them. I have little doubt that some of my conservative friends will be shocked by what they will regard as "concessions" to modern views that I have made in Part III of this book. But, though I may dislike some of the measures concerned as much as they do and might vote against them, I know of no general principles to which I could appeal to persuade those of a different view that those measures are not permissible in the general kind of society which we both desire. To live and work successfully with others requires more than faithfulness to one's concrete aims. It requires an intellectual commitment to a type of order in which, even on issues which to one are fundamental, others are allowed to pursue different ends.

Closely connected with this is the usual attitude of the conservative to democracy. I have made it clear earlier that I do not regard majority rule as an end but merely as a means, or perhaps even as the least evil of those forms of government from which we have to choose. But I believe that the conservatives deceive themselves when they blame the evils of our time on democracy. The chief evil is unlimited government, and nobody is qualified to wield unlimited power.[8] The powers which modern democracy possesses would be even more intolerable in the hands of some small elite.

Why I Am Not a Conservative - F. A. Hayek

 

[Liability]

"He who knows does not speak, he who speaks does not know." Lao-Tzu

CrusaderFrank, see above, fits you perfectly.

What Is Conservatism and What Is Wrong with It?

"A bigger heap of steaming, self-serving and self-congratulatory manure, I've not ever seen."

~The Dude

Really The DUD...e? This is the bigger heap of steaming, self-serving and self-congratulatory manure, you've not ever seen?

What Is Conservatism and What Is Wrong with It?

Philip E. Agre
August 2004

Liberals in the United States have been losing political debates to conservatives for a quarter century. In order to start winning again, liberals must answer two simple questions: what is conservatism, and what is wrong with it? As it happens, the answers to these questions are also simple:

Q: What is conservatism?
A: Conservatism is the domination of society by an aristocracy.

Q: What is wrong with conservatism?
A: Conservatism is incompatible with democracy, prosperity, and civilization in general. It is a destructive system of inequality and prejudice that is founded on deception and has no place in the modern world.

* * * *

EXCEPT, naturally, your quotation of that position expressed by Agre assumes that it is correct. It isn't. Conservatism is absolutely NOT the domination of society by any aristocracy. That claim is merely a lie.

And the contention that conservatism is "incompatible" with democracy is also untrue. Neither is it incompatible with prosperity. Indeed, the precise opposite is true. It is by virtue of conservative principles that societies flourish. It is premised ON equality, not inequality. That is another absolute lie.

All of the negatives Agre and you falsely associate with conservatism are actually instead true of the modern American "liberal" political philosophy.

Hayek's contentions about the meaning of conservatism are also false for similar reasons.

One has to be a virtual imbecile to accept the false premises you cherish, Bfgrn. But then, you ARE Bfgrn.

 

[Bfgrn]

"A bigger heap of steaming, self-serving and self-congratulatory manure, I've not ever seen."

~The Dude

Really The DUD...e? This is the bigger heap of steaming, self-serving and self-congratulatory manure, you've not ever seen?

What Is Conservatism and What Is Wrong with It?

Philip E. Agre
August 2004

Liberals in the United States have been losing political debates to conservatives for a quarter century. In order to start winning again, liberals must answer two simple questions: what is conservatism, and what is wrong with it? As it happens, the answers to these questions are also simple:

Q: What is conservatism?
A: Conservatism is the domination of society by an aristocracy.

Q: What is wrong with conservatism?
A: Conservatism is incompatible with democracy, prosperity, and civilization in general. It is a destructive system of inequality and prejudice that is founded on deception and has no place in the modern world.

* * * *

EXCEPT, naturally, your quotation of that position expressed by Agre assumes that it is correct. It isn't. Conservatism is absolutely NOT the domination of society by any aristocracy. That claim is merely a lie.

And the contention that conservatism is "incompatible" with democracy is also untrue. Neither is it incompatible with prosperity. Indeed, the precise opposite is true. It is by virtue of conservative principles that societies flourish. It is premised ON equality, not inequality. That is another absolute lie.

All of the negatives Agre and you falsely associate with conservatism are actually instead true of the modern American "liberal" political philosophy.

Hayek's contentions about the meaning of conservatism are also false for similar reasons.

One has to be a virtual imbecile to accept the false premises you cherish, Bfgrn. But then, you ARE Bfgrn.

Liability...F.A. Hayek is DUD...e's ultimate hero... what DUD...e claims to be a big 'heap of steaming, self-serving and self-congratulatory manure' is EXACTLY what DUD...e's ultimate hero says

Yes I AM Bfgrn, and I'm fully aware of who I am, what I believe and WHY I believe it. My question to you Liability...are YOU DUD...e?

 

[CrusaderFrank]

"A bigger heap of steaming, self-serving and self-congratulatory manure, I've not ever seen."

~The Dude

Really The DUD...e? This is the bigger heap of steaming, self-serving and self-congratulatory manure, you've not ever seen?

What Is Conservatism and What Is Wrong with It?

Philip E. Agre
August 2004

Liberals in the United States have been losing political debates to conservatives for a quarter century. In order to start winning again, liberals must answer two simple questions: what is conservatism, and what is wrong with it? As it happens, the answers to these questions are also simple:

Q: What is conservatism?
A: Conservatism is the domination of society by an aristocracy.

Q: What is wrong with conservatism?
A: Conservatism is incompatible with democracy, prosperity, and civilization in general. It is a destructive system of inequality and prejudice that is founded on deception and has no place in the modern world.

* * * *

EXCEPT, naturally, your quotation of that position expressed by Agre assumes that it is correct. It isn't. Conservatism is absolutely NOT the domination of society by any aristocracy. That claim is merely a lie.

And the contention that conservatism is "incompatible" with democracy is also untrue. Neither is it incompatible with prosperity. Indeed, the precise opposite is true. It is by virtue of conservative principles that societies flourish. It is premised ON equality, not inequality. That is another absolute lie.

All of the negatives Agre and you falsely associate with conservatism are actually instead true of the modern American "liberal" political philosophy.

Hayek's contentions about the meaning of conservatism are also false for similar reasons.

One has to be a virtual imbecile to accept the false premises you cherish, Bfgrn. But then, you ARE Bfgrn.

Hey! There's nothing virtual about his imbecility, it's the real deal!

 

[Liability]

Really The DUD...e? This is the bigger heap of steaming, self-serving and self-congratulatory manure, you've not ever seen?

What Is Conservatism and What Is Wrong with It?

Philip E. Agre
August 2004

Liberals in the United States have been losing political debates to conservatives for a quarter century. In order to start winning again, liberals must answer two simple questions: what is conservatism, and what is wrong with it? As it happens, the answers to these questions are also simple:

Q: What is conservatism?
A: Conservatism is the domination of society by an aristocracy.

Q: What is wrong with conservatism?
A: Conservatism is incompatible with democracy, prosperity, and civilization in general. It is a destructive system of inequality and prejudice that is founded on deception and has no place in the modern world.

* * * *

EXCEPT, naturally, your quotation of that position expressed by Agre assumes that it is correct. It isn't. Conservatism is absolutely NOT the domination of society by any aristocracy. That claim is merely a lie.

And the contention that conservatism is "incompatible" with democracy is also untrue. Neither is it incompatible with prosperity. Indeed, the precise opposite is true. It is by virtue of conservative principles that societies flourish. It is premised ON equality, not inequality. That is another absolute lie.

All of the negatives Agre and you falsely associate with conservatism are actually instead true of the modern American "liberal" political philosophy.

Hayek's contentions about the meaning of conservatism are also false for similar reasons.

One has to be a virtual imbecile to accept the false premises you cherish, Bfgrn. But then, you ARE Bfgrn.

Liability...F.A. Hayek is DUD...e's ultimate hero... what DUD...e claims to be a big 'heap of steaming, self-serving and self-congratulatory manure' is EXACTLY what DUD...e's ultimate hero says

Yes I AM Bfgrn, and I'm fully aware of who I am, what I believe and WHY I believe it. My question to you Liability...are YOU DUD...e?

Holy shit, was THAT a massively stupid reply! Bravo. If you were intent on hitting the bulls eye of stupidity, you can save the rest of the arrows in your quiver!

Hayek has a great economic mind. If Dude respects that, that's fine by me.

But to the extent that Hayek defines "conservatism" in the irrational and baseless way you quoted him as defining it, then I don't care how great an economic genius Hayek may be. His contentions about the meaning of conservatism are wrong all the same.

Dude and I have shared use of a brain (together with Frank). When Dude and I disagree (it is rare, but it happens) it is pretty much cognitive dissonance time. But the thing is -- and you and your ilk will never fathom this -- it is possible to disagree and yet do so in a respectful fashion. His disagreements with some of my expressed positions have caused me to confront alternative views. Not such a horrible thing.

Why don't you ASK Dude if he accepts every single pronouncement uttered from the mouth (or type-writer) of Mr. Hayek?

When YOU quote somebody you cherish, like say Mao, does that mean that YOU accept every single thing that individual has ever had to say on any topic?