American By Birth!

[ConHog]

That might not have been the intention, of course they didn't really have too many immigration laws back then, but it doesn't mean it isn't protecting "anchor babies". And the fact you don't see the similarities between slaves who were not considered full citizens, and illegals, is somewhat funny.

When the 14th ammendment was ratified in 1868 (which is what we are talking about) the United States did not limit immigration. "Thus there were, by definition, no illegal immigrants and the issue of citizenship for children of those here in violation of immigration laws was nonexistent. Granting of automatic citizenship to children of illegal alien mothers is a recent and totally inadvertent and unforeseen result of the amendment and the Reconstructionist period in which it was ratified."




You will enjoy reading this link The 14th Amendment to the United States Constitution - Fourteenth Amendment - anchor babies and birthright citizenship - interpretations and misinterpretations - US Constitution lots of good and accurate info about the 14th ammendment. (BTW the part I italicized in my post above is from the link)

So in reality, unless we change the laws, any person born here(unless restricted by certain citizenship laws) they are a citizen. And " subject to jurisdiction thereof" has nothing to do with illegal aliens.

Yes, duh, that is exactly is what is being said, and a SCOTUS ruling on the matter would effectively change the 14th from teh current view, which is that the 14th doesn't differentiate legal from illegal.

Which is exactly why I said that there is plenty of controversy and debate and you replied with "there is no debate" and then rambled on.

 

[strollingbones]

why is it the right is all about the constitution until they are not?

if you are born here...you are a citizen of the us...get over it....deal with it and move beyond your utter paranoia and hate of mexicans

why is it you never heard anyone talking about illegals except for mexican ones? and how much is the grand...return all mexicans to mexico gonna cost?

 

[Big Black Dog]

Seems like there is a loop hole in everything - including anchor babies. Bet when they put this ammendment into the Constitution they didn't think about all the shit that would be happening over 100 years later with illegal Mexican aliens. My vote is to run them all out of the country - anchor baby or not. It cost no more to deport illegal Mexican aliens than it does to give them public aid and all the other stuff they reap for nothing.

 

[strollingbones]

i notice you still only want to deport mexicans what about deporting all illegals regardless of country of origin

 

[strollingbones]

and the republicans nor the democrats are gonna do a damned thing about mexicans...big business enjoys the cheap labor...if the government was serious they would go after people employeeing illegals and shut that down....how hard is it...they would stop all the phone ss numbers and illegals being able to obtain them...they would stop this crap of when they find numbers that are wrong and go to employoers they say they didnt know.....shut the money off and they will go home...

 

[strollingbones]

mexicans have driven down wages in the construction industry, landscaping, i am sure the list just goes on...depending on where you are from....but i do see a boomrang...many places now are not hiring mexicans cause of the public outcry etc...

 

[Big Black Dog]

i notice you still only want to deport mexicans what about deporting all illegals regardless of country of origin

That would be a good thing too but in the grand scheme of things, Mexicans are the biggest offenders. That would be a good starting place.

 

[Big Black Dog]

and the republicans nor the democrats are gonna do a damned thing about mexicans...big business enjoys the cheap labor...if the government was serious they would go after people employeeing illegals and shut that down....how hard is it...they would stop all the phone ss numbers and illegals being able to obtain them...they would stop this crap of when they find numbers that are wrong and go to employoers they say they didnt know.....shut the money off and they will go home...

Can't argue this point. Pretty well said.

 

[Nosmo King]

and the republicans nor the democrats are gonna do a damned thing about mexicans...big business enjoys the cheap labor...if the government was serious they would go after people employeeing illegals and shut that down....how hard is it...they would stop all the phone ss numbers and illegals being able to obtain them...they would stop this crap of when they find numbers that are wrong and go to employoers they say they didnt know.....shut the money off and they will go home...

What's more politically expedient: arresting Mexicans or stopping any Hispanic for papers, or frog-marching wealthy white folks for using Mexicans as slave labor?

Think like a Republican before you answer.

 

[ConHog]

why is it the right is all about the constitution until they are not?

if you are born here...you are a citizen of the us...get over it....deal with it and move beyond your utter paranoia and hate of mexicans

why is it you never heard anyone talking about illegals except for mexican ones? and how much is the grand...return all mexicans to mexico gonna cost?

Move on? Hmm blacks were at one time slaves, Did they get over it and move on? Or did they correctly say hey, fuck this the COTUS can be amended, let's do that? Just for example. Oh, and no one I know wants to limit the changes to Mexicans, if Canadians or the French are coming over here and having anchor babies, we want that stopped to.

PS I'm also pro amnesty.

 

[Luissa]

When the 14th ammendment was ratified in 1868 (which is what we are talking about) the United States did not limit immigration. "Thus there were, by definition, no illegal immigrants and the issue of citizenship for children of those here in violation of immigration laws was nonexistent. Granting of automatic citizenship to children of illegal alien mothers is a recent and totally inadvertent and unforeseen result of the amendment and the Reconstructionist period in which it was ratified."




You will enjoy reading this link The 14th Amendment to the United States Constitution - Fourteenth Amendment - anchor babies and birthright citizenship - interpretations and misinterpretations - US Constitution lots of good and accurate info about the 14th ammendment. (BTW the part I italicized in my post above is from the link)

So in reality, unless we change the laws, any person born here(unless restricted by certain citizenship laws) they are a citizen. And " subject to jurisdiction thereof" has nothing to do with illegal aliens.

Yes, duh, that is exactly is what is being said, and a SCOTUS ruling on the matter would effectively change the 14th from teh current view, which is that the 14th doesn't differentiate legal from illegal.

Which is exactly why I said that there is plenty of controversy and debate and you replied with "there is no debate" and then rambled on.

YOu never said there was debate, you said it was unclear what it meant. When I asked my friend who is lawyer, he was very clear in what it meant. So in reality you keep talking about something you have no clue about.

 

[ConHog]

So in reality, unless we change the laws, any person born here(unless restricted by certain citizenship laws) they are a citizen. And " subject to jurisdiction thereof" has nothing to do with illegal aliens.

Yes, duh, that is exactly is what is being said, and a SCOTUS ruling on the matter would effectively change the 14th from teh current view, which is that the 14th doesn't differentiate legal from illegal.

Which is exactly why I said that there is plenty of controversy and debate and you replied with "there is no debate" and then rambled on.

YOu never said there was debate, you said it was unclear what it meant. When I asked my friend who is lawyer, he was very clear in what it meant. So in reality you keep talking about something you have no clue about.

People debate over things that are unclear dummy. And if your lawyer friend definitively told you that the 14th includes the children of illegal aliens, they are either omniscient or presumptuous, because unless or until we get a SCOTUS ruling on the matter it is unclear.

 

[Toome]

Seems to me that the Supreme Court needs to clarify the 14th Amendment's interpretation rather than have Congress repeal the 14th Amendment (would never happen anyway; there aren't enough votes). Seems to me that the issue has to be met head-on: how does the 14th Amendment apply to anchor babies?

 

[Father Time]

Seems like there is a loop hole in everything - including anchor babies. Bet when they put this ammendment into the Constitution they didn't think about all the shit that would be happening over 100 years later with illegal Mexican aliens.

So what? When they wrote the first they had no idea that there would be the internet, video games, Television, or the radio. Should we limit free speech on those (well we all ready do with TV and radio but still)?

 

[ConHog]

Seems like there is a loop hole in everything - including anchor babies. Bet when they put this ammendment into the Constitution they didn't think about all the shit that would be happening over 100 years later with illegal Mexican aliens.

So what? When they wrote the first they had no idea that there would be the internet, video games, Television, or the radio. Should we limit free speech on those (well we all ready do with TV and radio but still)?

In every instance that you mention, the government has taken steps to clarify , just as they need to here.

 

[George Costanza]

Should this be changed to something like: The parent must be legal citizens and reside in America for at least five years.

No.

 

[ConHog]

Should this be changed to something like: The parent must be legal citizens and reside in America for at least five years.

No.

How about. At least one parent MUST already be a legal resident?"

 

[Leweman]

This is a dumb argument and very contradictory. No one should support illegal immigrants coming here in the first place. It is by definition ILLEGAL! So if the government does its job of developing a system of allowing people to come here legally and keeping those who dont conform to that system out of the country then this clause of the 14th amendment becomes irrelevant.

 

[ConHog]

This is a dumb argument and very contradictory. No one should support illegal immigrants coming here in the first place. It is by definition ILLEGAL! So if the government does its job of developing a system of allowing people to come here legally and keeping those who dont conform to that system out of the country then this clause of the 14th amendment becomes irrelevant.

In theory, correct, but practically speaking the government will NEVER EVER be able to completely close down our borders. Also , there is the fact that if a couple gets a visa and enters the country legally but over stays that visa they have become illegal, but at present if they have a child that child becomes a US citizen. Now how could that have been prevented, unless you intend to keep daily tabs on all people who enter our country on a visa

 

[Leweman]

If you were here legally on a visa etc and that expires ... Im sure exceptions can be made. For the most part though it should be a non issue