Almost all of us are statist Progressives

[JakeStarkey]

I explained that Correll and dblack's comments are minimal in worth.

They make unsubstantiated assertions without evidence to a valid analysis of progressivism, then say I have to rebut them. No, I don't.

They can argue about the worth or not of progressivism, they can attack the analysis, but they haven't.

I made a point, you have not addressed it. Your analysis rests, at least in part, in you defining the motives and intents of others, in order to fit your pre arrived at conclusion.

You merely babbled. Do you have a point? Attacking me in no way invalidates what I have analyzed.

Here it is again. Read it this time.

Progressivism is a process and active philosophy encompassing the political spectrum from far right to far left, from libertarianism to authoritarianism. Hitler (the death camps), Stalin (collective agriculture), American pro-life (insisting on government prohibition of abortion) or anti-Marriage Equality, the Civil Rights Act, the Fair Housing Act, segregation in the American South – all are examples of Progressivism. All are progressives who use politics of Big Government to change government, or society, or culture or economy to further the achievement of desired goals.

I see you've dropped statism from the mix. Good call. Progressivism and statism aren't the same things. Lose the Big Government nonsense and I could agree with the above statement.

Never used it in the definition above in the first place, only the OP. Nothing was dropped. Progressivism uses state power through political means to create change. So, yes, it is statism, the power of the state.

 

[JakeStarkey]

I am glad to see you guys struggle with definitions and meanings and will keep teaching you here.

(1) The power of the government in repealing Prohibition is a demonstration of the government to give and take away. Nothing is diminished.

(2) No, blacks are much better off than in 1965. You have to offer more than your opinion. Give some facts, evidence, worthy points.

(3) The Republic /= monarchy comparison is a fallacy. You have just babbled some points. There is no connection at all.

I think the major issue here is that conservatives, right wingers, and even liberts don't like to think of themselves as progressives. If they use the state politically to change culture, society, economy, government, etc., they are progressives and statists. No way around it.

 

[dblack]

I am glad to see you guys struggle with definitions and meanings and will keep teaching you here.

Calling you on your equivocation and idiotic games is no struggle at all.f

 

[JakeStarkey]

I am glad to see you guys struggle with definitions and meanings and will keep teaching you here.

Calling you on your equivocation and idiotic games is no struggle at all.f

There is no equivocation (you can't point it out) and yell "idiotic games" as if that means anything merely shows you are on the run. I will keep teaching you.

 

[Votto]

I am glad to see you guys struggle with definitions and meanings and will keep teaching you here.

(1) The power of the government in repealing Prohibition is a demonstration of the government to give and take away. Nothing is diminished.

(2) No, blacks are much better off than in 1965. You have to offer more than your opinion. Give some facts, evidence, worthy points.

(3) The Republic /= monarchy comparison is a fallacy. You have just babbled some points. There is no connection at all.

I think the major issue here is that conservatives, right wingers, and even liberts don't like to think of themselves as progressives. If they use the state politically to change culture, society, economy, government, etc., they are progressives and statists. No way around it.

At the signing of the 1964 Civil Rights Act, 87 percent of black homes were married, two-parent homes, and 40 percent of blacks were business owners. But 50 years after the signing of the Civil Rights Act, 49 years after the introduction of the Great Society initiatives and 46 years after the introduction of race-based affirmative action, blacks disproportionately represent practically every undesirable category. - See more at: WorldNetDaily African Americans Worse Off Now Than Under Slavery Jim Crow Right Wing Watch

 

[dblack]

I am glad to see you guys struggle with definitions and meanings and will keep teaching you here.

Calling you on your equivocation and idiotic games is no struggle at all.f

There is no equivocation (you can't point it out)...

I already have. To reiterate: you're equivocating on the terms 'progressive' and 'statist'. You're throwing out a claim, knowing that definitions of those terms, in political debate, are relatively narrow - knowing that when you say "progressive statist" here, it will be understood as a description of someone who wants a strong central government proactively involved in social and economic issues. Then, when challenged on your preposterous claim that everyone, even libertarians, are progressive statists, you fall back on the general, philosophical definition of the terms, such that a "progressive statist" amounts to anyone who advocates for change in government. That's chickenshit sophistry.

 

[JakeStarkey]

I am glad to see you guys struggle with definitions and meanings and will keep teaching you here.

(1) The power of the government in repealing Prohibition is a demonstration of the government to give and take away. Nothing is diminished.

(2) No, blacks are much better off than in 1965. You have to offer more than your opinion. Give some facts, evidence, worthy points.

(3) The Republic /= monarchy comparison is a fallacy. You have just babbled some points. There is no connection at all.

I think the major issue here is that conservatives, right wingers, and even liberts don't like to think of themselves as progressives. If they use the state politically to change culture, society, economy, government, etc., they are progressives and statists. No way around it.

At the signing of the 1964 Civil Rights Act, 87 percent of black homes were married, two-parent homes, and 40 percent of blacks were business owners. But 50 years after the signing of the Civil Rights Act, 49 years after the introduction of the Great Society initiatives and 46 years after the introduction of race-based affirmative action, blacks disproportionately represent practically every undesirable category. - See more at: WorldNetDaily African Americans Worse Off Now Than Under Slavery Jim Crow Right Wing Watch

Thank you. Compare those stats from 1964 with the same categories today.

Also did blacks disproportionately represent their race in every undesirable category in 1964?

Your comment about AA is meaningless until you can show it as cause.

 

[JakeStarkey]

dblack misuses equivocate, but I needed him to make the statement above first, and his opinion of my sophistry is sophistry itself. Remember that the doctrines of libertarianism fog his thinking.

Progressivism and statism in achieving goals governmentally, socially, culturally, and economically ipso facto expects and demands proactive government to achieve such goals.

dblack, as a libertarian, does not like government telling him there are certain things he must do, can't do, and must pay taxes for. OK.