Ag Secretary: "NO CORN FOR YOU!"

[KissMy]

NEWS FLASH!!! - Ethanol plants produce a co-product. It is called animal feed DDGS (Distillers Dried Grains) You take feed corn to the ethanol plants & you get back both food & fuel!!!

Cattle that would have eaten the corn grain and soybean meal to supplement their diet, now eat distillers grains as that part of their balanced diet. Equal or better performance (rates of gain for beef cattle or milk yield in dairy cows) are usually reported when diets with up to 20% of their food intake from distillers grains are compared with control diets.

NEWS FLASH! Government invents perpetual motion machine!

The corn starch caused methane in cattle that was released into the atmosphere. It was not making beef, hamburgers, steaks or milk. Methane gas is 15 times more powerful of a greenhouse gas than CO2. Now this starch is converted into ethanol instead of methane gas.

 

[percysunshine]

NEWS FLASH!!! - Ethanol plants produce a co-product. It is called animal feed DDGS (Distillers Dried Grains) You take feed corn to the ethanol plants & you get back both food & fuel!!!

Cattle that would have eaten the corn grain and soybean meal to supplement their diet, now eat distillers grains as that part of their balanced diet. Equal or better performance (rates of gain for beef cattle or milk yield in dairy cows) are usually reported when diets with up to 20% of their food intake from distillers grains are compared with control diets.

NEWS FLASH! Government invents perpetual motion machine!

The corn starch caused methane in cattle that was released into the atmosphere. It was not making beef, hamburgers, steaks or milk. Methane gas is 15 times more powerful of a greenhouse gas than CO2. Now this starch is converted into ethanol instead of methane gas.

Ever heard of the laws of thermodynamics? To paraphrase; There ain't no such thing as a free lunch.

Save your global warming bs for the uneducated.

 

[KissMy]

NEWS FLASH! Government invents perpetual motion machine!

The corn starch caused methane in cattle that was released into the atmosphere. It was not making beef, hamburgers, steaks or milk. Methane gas is 15 times more powerful of a greenhouse gas than CO2. Now this starch is converted into ethanol instead of methane gas.

Ever heard of the laws of thermodynamics? To paraphrase; There ain't no such thing as a free lunch.

Save your global warming bs for the uneducated.

DDGS contain all the protein that was in the corn. Protein is what builds muscle, not starch. Muscles = Hamburger.

Bernanke's printing press is what is driving up cotton, corn, oil & metals prices. All commodities have risen big-time in price.

 

[Old Rocks]

The corn starch caused methane in cattle that was released into the atmosphere. It was not making beef, hamburgers, steaks or milk. Methane gas is 15 times more powerful of a greenhouse gas than CO2. Now this starch is converted into ethanol instead of methane gas.

Ever heard of the laws of thermodynamics? To paraphrase; There ain't no such thing as a free lunch.

Save your global warming bs for the uneducated.

DDGS contain all the protein that was in the corn. Protein is what builds muscle, not starch. Muscles = Hamburger.

Bernanke's printing press is what is driving up cotton, corn, oil & metals prices. All commodities have risen big-time in price.

Really? The total wipeout of the Pakistani agriculture from the flooding there, the loss of 40% of the Russian grain crop, and 10% of the EU grain crop from the drought there, the loss of the Australian Queensland wheat, sugar, and banana crops, have nothing to do with the rise in prices. The loss of 1/3 of the world's coking coal, until the mines are drained and the rails rebuilt in Queensland has nothing to do with the rise in prices. And then there is the little matter of major unrest in the one of the major oil producing areas in the world.

But none of this has anything to do with the commodity prices. It has to be Bernanke's fault.

 

[KissMy]

Really? The total wipeout of the Pakistani agriculture from the flooding there, the loss of 40% of the Russian grain crop, and 10% of the EU grain crop from the drought there, the loss of the Australian Queensland wheat, sugar, and banana crops, have nothing to do with the rise in prices. The loss of 1/3 of the world's coking coal, until the mines are drained and the rails rebuilt in Queensland has nothing to do with the rise in prices. And then there is the little matter of major unrest in the one of the major oil producing areas in the world.

But none of this has anything to do with the commodity prices. It has to be Bernanke's fault.

There is always a drought & flooding somewhere in the world. But people just keep on believing the governments spin that fraudulent lending & printing money are not the real cause of high commodity prices. Come on! - Even your freaking water bill has gone up over the past couple of years! It's the most abundant thing on the planet.

 

[Annie]

Using farm land to produce 'energy' is wrong. Now even those that championed the cause admit it:

Review & Outlook: Bill Clinton's Corn Sense - WSJ.com

* FEBRUARY 25, 2011

Bill Clinton's Corn Sense
The former President connects ethanol to rising food prices.

America's political addiction to ethanol has consequences, from raising the price of food to lining the pockets of companies like Archer Daniels Midland. So we're delighted to see another prominent booster—Bill Clinton—see the fright.

"We have to become energy independent" but "we don't want to do it at the expense of food riots," the former President told an agriculture conference Thursday. He urged farmers to consider the needs of developing countries—the implication being that the diversion of corn to ethanol production limits food supplies and artificially raises prices.

No kidding. At the same gathering, Department of Agriculture chief economist Joseph Glauber did the math. Despite a forecasted 4% increase in corn planting, Mr. Glauber expects corn used for ethanol to hit a record five billion bushels in 2011-12, or more than one-third of total U.S. production, thanks to renewable fuel mandates and tax incentives. Corn prices recently hit two-and-a-half-year highs.

That means the forced U.S. ramp-up in ethanol production is commandeering corn that could otherwise go for food and contributing to higher food prices here and in much of the world. Meanwhile, India is seeing protests, China is imposing price controls, and Indonesia is stockpiling rice. Don't forget the inflationary impact of the Federal Reserve's easy money policies, which are pushing up prices across the globe more generally. ...

Review & Outlook: Al Gore's Ethanol Epiphany - WSJ.com

* NOVEMBER 27, 2010

Al Gore's Ethanol Epiphany
He concedes the industry he promoted serves no useful purpose.

Anyone who opposes ethanol subsidies, as these columns have for decades, comes to appreciate the wisdom of St. Jude. But now that a modern-day patron saint—St. Al of Green—has come out against the fuel made from corn and your tax dollars, maybe this isn't such a lost cause.

Welcome to the college of converts, Mr. Vice President. "It is not a good policy to have these massive subsidies for first-generation ethanol," Al Gore told a gathering of clean energy financiers in Greece this week. The benefits of ethanol are "trivial," he added, but "It's hard once such a program is put in place to deal with the lobbies that keep it going."

No kidding, and Mr. Gore said he knows from experience: "One of the reasons I made that mistake is that I paid particular attention to the farmers in my home state of Tennessee, and I had a certain fondness for the farmers in the state of Iowa because I was about to run for President."

Mr. Gore's mea culpa underscores the degree to which ethanol has become a purely political machine: It serves no purpose other than re-electing incumbents and transferring wealth to farm states and ethanol producers. Nothing proves this better than the coincident trajectories of ethanol and Mr. Gore's career.

Ethanol's claim on the Treasury was first made amid the 1970s energy crisis, with Jimmy Carter and a Democratic Congress subsidizing anything that claimed to be a substitute for foreign oil. Mr. Gore, freshman House class of 1976, was an early proponent of what was then called "gasahol."...

Switchgrass is an alternative to ethanol, though like it the use of land is questionable:

Is America Headed for a Food Shortage? | Popular Science

Is America Headed for a Food Shortage?
A new study suggests that ethanol production could drive up corn prices, leaving U.S. grains and meat in short supply
By Dawn Stover Posted 06.07.2007

Ethanol is a renewable, homegrown fuel that can help lower U.S. dependence on foreign oil. But as more and more ethanol is made from corn, less and less corn is available for food production, and that´s causing some unforeseen problems.

Corn is a mainstay of American agriculture- it´s an important ingredient in cereals and baked goods, and corn syrup is used to make processed foods like candy, chips and soft drinks. But most importantly, corn is the major source of food for cattle, pigs, turkeys and chickens that are headed for the dinner table.

A recent study conducted by the Center for Agricultural and Rural Development at Iowa State University (which receives funding from grocery manufacturers and livestock producers) reported that U.S. ethanol production could consume more than half of U.S. corn, wheat and coarse grains by 2012, driving up food prices and causing shortages. The study estimates that booming ethanol production has already raised U.S. food prices by $47 per person annually. In Mexico, protests have already erupted over the high price of corn tortillas, a staple food in the local diet.

Planting more corn is one solution, but that means planting less of other crops that are also widely used in foods, such as soybeans and wheat. Tilling fallow land could create more growing space for corn, but might lead to soil erosion and impacts on wildlife habitats.

According to a December 2006 study by the International Food Policy Research Institute, producing enough ethanol to fuel all of the world´s vehicles would require five times more corn than is planted today and 15 times as much sugar cane.

A more promising solution is to make ethanol from cellulose instead of starches and sugars-using plants such as switchgrass and organic waste instead of corn and sugarcane. This would also reduce greenhouse gas emissions much more effectively than making ethanol from corn....

 

[KissMy]

Creating money causes our products to be cheaper for foreigners. This dramatically increases our exports & raises our prices here in the USA. Everything else is a lie.

Why has cotton trippled in price?

“A few years ago, 30 percent of our crop was exported and 70 percent was used domestically,” he told members of the Southern Crop Production Association at their annual conference at Amelia Island, Fla. “Now, we're exporting 70 percent to 75 percent of our crop.

Crop Surge Drives U.S. Export Boom

Record U.S. agricultural exports are providing an unexpected boost to President Barack Obama’s target of doubling overseas sales by 2015...Farm exports from the U.S., the world’s largest grain shipper, may top the 2008 record of $115.3 billion in 2011, said Joe Glauber, chief economist at the U.S. Department of Agriculture.

World less dependent on US crop exports in 2009 than in 1980

Between 1980 and 2009, the world production of corn, wheat, and soybeans grew by 86 percent, increasing from 926 million metric tons to 1.73 billion metric tons (Fig. 1 solid red line). During that same period, the world population grew from 4.5 billion people to 6.8 billion, an increase of 51 percent. On average, the world production of the three crops grew at a rate 40 percent faster than population.

 

[Annie]

Maybe I'm missing something here, but from my reading of OP it was on ethanol and food prices/scarcity. Not on commodities and government policies on that overall.

 

[KissMy]

There is no scarcity! There are just to damn many dollars circulating. There is probably more dollars than rocks on the ground & that makes dollars as worthless as rocks on the ground.

Stories of scarcity & supply disruption get moved up to front page news & main TV coverage because prices rise. It is the tail wagging the dog. Print money now & lie about a year or two later when prices rise. The media & government have brainwashed the planet.

 

[Annie]

There is no scarcity! There are just to damn many dollars circulating. There is probably more dollars than rocks on the ground & that makes dollars as worthless as rocks on the ground.

Stories of scarcity & supply disruption get moved up to front page news & main TV coverage because prices rise. It is the tail wagging the dog. Print money now & lie about a year or two later when prices rise. The media & government have brainwashed the planet.

Wrong. Food wise, there's a huge problem. Ethanol was always a bad idea.

 

[Mr. H.]

Maybe I'm missing something here, but from my reading of OP it was on ethanol and food prices/scarcity. Not on commodities and government policies on that overall.

Here's quote from the linked story:

ARLINGTON, Virginia (Reuters) – Huge U.S. corn and soybean plantings this spring will likely fail to refill razor-thin stocks enough to quell the surge in grain prices, the U.S. Agriculture Department said on Thursday.

In updated forecasts for the world's biggest crop exporter, the USDA warned that it could take several years to restore inventories to comfortable levels. It mostly maintained earlier forecasts on how many acres farmers would sow this spring, but said stocks at the end of the 2012 season would remain tight.

 

[KissMy]

There is no scarcity! There are just to damn many dollars circulating. There is probably more dollars than rocks on the ground & that makes dollars as worthless as rocks on the ground.

Stories of scarcity & supply disruption get moved up to front page news & main TV coverage because prices rise. It is the tail wagging the dog. Print money now & lie about a year or two later when prices rise. The media & government have brainwashed the planet.

Wrong. Food wise, there's a huge problem. Ethanol was always a bad idea.

We export more food now than we ever did before ethanol. We even export a larger percentage of our food than we ever did before ethanol. The media controls the peoples minds. On average, the world production of crops grew at a rate 40 percent faster than population.

Ethanol is a bad idea if you grow crops just to make ethanol. It is good if you use the DDGS co-product to feed the same animals that the original crops were going to feed. This is why it is only feasible to replace 12% of US fuel consumption. It will never replace oil.

 

[Annie]

There is no scarcity! There are just to damn many dollars circulating. There is probably more dollars than rocks on the ground & that makes dollars as worthless as rocks on the ground.

Stories of scarcity & supply disruption get moved up to front page news & main TV coverage because prices rise. It is the tail wagging the dog. Print money now & lie about a year or two later when prices rise. The media & government have brainwashed the planet.

Wrong. Food wise, there's a huge problem. Ethanol was always a bad idea.

We export more food now than we ever did before ethanol. We even export a larger percentage of our food than we ever did before ethanol. The media controls the peoples minds. On average, the world production of crops grew at a rate 40 percent faster than population.

Ethanol is a bad idea if you grow crops just to make ethanol. It is good if you use the DDGS co-product to feed the same animals that the original crops were going to feed.

Straight out question to you: Are you in favor of continuing subsidies on corn production for ethanol?

 

[KissMy]

Wrong. Food wise, there's a huge problem. Ethanol was always a bad idea.

We export more food now than we ever did before ethanol. We even export a larger percentage of our food than we ever did before ethanol. The media controls the peoples minds. On average, the world production of crops grew at a rate 40 percent faster than population.

Ethanol is a bad idea if you grow crops just to make ethanol. It is good if you use the DDGS co-product to feed the same animals that the original crops were going to feed.

Straight out question to you: Are you in favor of continuing subsidies on corn production for ethanol?

No- Ethanol is profitable without subsidy. They should have never forced oil companies to ship to all corners of the USA. It would have competed just fine in the local Midwest as E85. The problem now is that the media has bashed it so bad that people refuse to use it, so now you need some sort of mandate. Even with corn prices at all time highs the ethanol plants turn out ethanol at $2.33 a gallon. Last year production cost was only $1.00 a gallon.

 

[Mr. H.]

Since the government mandates ethanol blends, there will always be a guaranteed market for it.

Guaranteed markets equal guaranteed sales. Not a bad "business" to be in, you think?

 

[Annie]

We export more food now than we ever did before ethanol. We even export a larger percentage of our food than we ever did before ethanol. The media controls the peoples minds. On average, the world production of crops grew at a rate 40 percent faster than population.

Ethanol is a bad idea if you grow crops just to make ethanol. It is good if you use the DDGS co-product to feed the same animals that the original crops were going to feed.

Straight out question to you: Are you in favor of continuing subsidies on corn production for ethanol?

No- Ethanol is profitable without subsidy. They should have never forced oil companies to ship to all corners of the USA. It would have competed just fine in the local Midwest as E85. The problem now is that the media has bashed it so bad that people refuse to use it, so now you need some sort of mandate. Even with corn prices at all time highs the ethanol plants turn out ethanol at $2.33 a gallon. Last year production cost was only $1.00 a gallon.

So no problem in ending the subsidies and the mandates. Good.

 

[Cain]

One thing about the USAF, and I don't mean it to be critical. You either fly or you wipe wings. If you want to spend a career wiping wings it's fine. Personally I'm biased toward the Marines. Every Marine, including pilots, is a rifleman. Think about it.

I am going in as Security Forces, they don't fly or wipe wings.

It was intended as a metaphor but the fact that you didn't get it indicates that you are sold on the career. Everybody in the USAF has a single mission and one mission only and that is to keep the wings flying. The security force wipes wings just as surely as the computer geeks or the cooks. It's not a bad thing but don't be fooled.

I understand, but you don't seem to get what I am saying. Your generalizing the whole Air Force into one saying, but anyone can do that with any branch. Generalizations such as: Zoomies, Chairforce, Groundpounders, Jarheads, Weekend Warriors etc. Are very common, doesn't mean their true, or even worth saying.

Honestly, I could care less what others think about my future career, or me, if that makes me sold, then the shoe fits.

 

[KissMy]

Straight out question to you: Are you in favor of continuing subsidies on corn production for ethanol?

No- Ethanol is profitable without subsidy. They should have never forced oil companies to ship to all corners of the USA. It would have competed just fine in the local Midwest as E85. The problem now is that the media has bashed it so bad that people refuse to use it, so now you need some sort of mandate. Even with corn prices at all time highs the ethanol plants turn out ethanol at $2.33 a gallon. Last year production cost was only $1.00 a gallon.

So no problem in ending the subsidies and the mandates. Good.

My family & I have been burning E85 ethanol in all of our vehicles for 10 years now. We would go to gas stations that had 10 pumps with no one at them but would have to wait for the ethanol pump. We would talk to the people using it & they loved it & would go to that station just to get it. Now since all the bad press has come out against it there is no-body at the E85 pump when we go to fill up even though the price is 50 cents a gallon less than gas. Media has enormous power. Just ask anyone if they know the ethanol plants create livestock feed that has all the same protein value as the corn that went into it. They will tell you no way, but the fact is they do.

The people I talk to that useta to use it say they don't anymore because on the news they said it causes food to go up. Now there has to be some sort of mandate to keep the system going. I don't care if they make the midwest use E85 & the further out places use gas but the media has ruined ethanol. There is no study on the viability of ethanol that factors in the energy value of the DDG feed that comes out of the plants. They also never factor in how most plants use waste heat prom power plants to cook the mash. This waste heat used to go into the atmosphere. They also do not factor in No Till Farming methods that cut in half the total fuels used to produce corn. I have read all their studies & done all the math. They conveniently leave all the things I mentioned above out of their study intentionally to make their point. When you just add in the feed value the ethanol produces 2.2 units of energy for every 1 unit of energy used or lost in the entire chain from growing corn to making your car move. If you add in No-Till Farming & waste energy consumption the EROEI goes much higher.

I have a farm, own part of an ethanol plant & burn it in my vehicles. The ethanol plant made $12 million last year. The subsidiary goes to the oil companies to make the E85 pumps available to customers at their gas stations & blender credit for them to mix it into gasoline. Some subsidiary went to the railroad for their transportation infrastructure. The ethanol plant got a one time $150k subsidiary to start-up but nothing since then & farmers are not subsidized. This one plant employs 50 full time workers 350 service jobs & keeps farmers from taking government money they were getting prior to ethanol to keep land out of production. It also replaced the harmful MTBE in gasoline that pollutes all the ground water.

 

[Mr. H.]

I own part of an oil business. I wish the government would give me an extra 50 cents a gallon for the oil I produce. I also wish they'd put a tariff on imported oil. The media isn't nice towards my business and the President just plain wishes I'd go away, even though we've been in the business for four generations.

 

[Mr. H.]

Several months ago, I attended an Ag Conference themed "Telling Our Story". It was a fascinating experience. Using the media, Facebook, and Twitter to dispel myth, rumor, and half-truth about the practices in Agriculture: markets, food safety, nutrition, economics, government programs, etc.

This old guy sitting next to me asks, "So, where you farming at? Where's your acreage". I told him my county and said we've been at it four generations now. As for acreage- I said I wasn't a farmer in the conventional sense, but an energy farmer.

His reply? "Oh, you're one of the rich kind". I said "You know what? I'd love to have your public relations problems. And what's more- according to what you just said, I've got quite a job ahead of me".

The irony- me, operating in a totally different economic and political environment. At the mercy of the market, the scorn of public opinion, the target of Washington. He, with his set-aside programs, loan deficiency payments, crop insurance, guaranteed and protected markets - the "can't do no wrong sweetheart of America".

I'm sick and tired of this shit. This past winter caused a shutdown that cost tens of thousands of dollars- the weather- the act of God from which the farmer is protected. I have put up with this bullshit for over 30 years. Who gives a fuck - $1.00/gallon gasoline is what gets votes.

Call it manufacturing or extraction or whatever the hell you want to call it. Oil and gas means jobs, it means real economic generation, taxes and royalties for local state and federal treasuries. It also means buying less of the stuff from someone outside our borders. Agriculture has a myriad of safeguards built into its risk portfolio. The only "safeguards" available to the hydrocarbon industries are tax code provisions that have been in place for decades and that are available to a host of other endeavors.

Why, for fuck's sake are we suddenly hell bent on strangling what works in order to promote only that which we are led to believe we "HOPE" will work?