ACLU hard at work.

[KittenKoder]

Here's another one:

Gay Curriculum Proposal Riles Elementary School Parents - Local News | News Articles | National News | US News - FOXNews.com

You mean the Rachel Mandow Network doesn't report this? Oh, pshaw. Sucks to be them.

Finally, on topic ... but still only media hype. It's funny though, Fox in my area went with a different angle but meh.

Gay lifestyle isn't sex, anymore than family is about sex. The schools are not suppose to be biased in any way, for any side, period. The students however can be, that's what learning is about.

Oh, gay lifestyle is not about sex? Then what defines it? I already said I have the same standard about direct allusions to heterosexual penetration in grade schools.

Homosexuality is aberrant. Just like polygamy. You can't make arguments for one that would not also support the other.

How does someone as partisan as you get to be a mod around here?

Aaah ... there you go. Thanks for showing your true colors. You don't care about teaching knowledge and educating kids, you only care because this "offends" you. Done with this now, since you clearly do not think with your brain, only your book.

 

[Agnapostate]

The court forced the school system to allow the report to be presented.

Still indoctrination.

Nice try on the legalistic word dance.

Incorrect. A defense of a student's First Amendment rights was enforced, thereby facilitating a freer exchange of ideas than would have occurred had partisan opposition prevented the presentation of the student's report.

She never claimed the school made her do anything. Her point was the schools in this country now FORCE our children to be taught that being GAY is somehow normal. And at an early age.

They permitted a student to exercise her First Amendment right to present a report. Contrary to your apparent belief that public school students lack constitutional rights altogether, they are guaranteed some degree of such rights in school as determined by the SCOTUS in Tinker v. Des Moines.

How about misogynistic lyrics in a rap song at a grade school talent show? Innocence or ignorance.? What is the body of morality that prohibits that, but has no problem with the discussion of a historic figure whose movement defines itself by their propensity to insert erect penises into other men's rectums?

Who's to say that the lyrics should have been prohibited any more than the discussion of Harvey Milk should have been prohibited? Would you happen to be begging the question?

Is Christopher Columbus a pariah but Harvey Milk an icon? Who gets to decide that except the indoctrinator?

Mere provision of information about such figures does not constitute indoctrination; inculcation of biased or partisan beliefs and opinions about them without provisions for critical or rational examination does. Your preferred schemes probably constitute indoctrination to a greater extent in that they're dependent on prohibiting or restricting student access to opposing viewpoints of ideologies that you consider "aberrant."

 

[Fraulein Hilda]

Finally, on topic ... but still only media hype. It's funny though, Fox in my area went with a different angle but meh.

Gay lifestyle isn't sex, anymore than family is about sex. The schools are not suppose to be biased in any way, for any side, period. The students however can be, that's what learning is about.

Oh, gay lifestyle is not about sex? Then what defines it? I already said I have the same standard about direct allusions to heterosexual penetration in grade schools.

Homosexuality is aberrant. Just like polygamy. You can't make arguments for one that would not also support the other.

How does someone as partisan as you get to be a mod around here?

Aaah ... there you go. Thanks for showing your true colors. You don't care about teaching knowledge and educating kids, you only care because this "offends" you. Done with this now, since you clearly do not think with your brain, only your book.

They are one and the same. Ebonics is knowledge. Does it tend towared edification? How to inject yourself with heroin is knowledge. How to build a nuclear bomb is knowlege. Do these offend people and should they perhaps not be taught?

Is education some morally neutral environment? Ever had kids in a public school on the day teachers walked on a job action out or brow beat them about an upcoming spending referendum?

 

[KittenKoder]

Oh, gay lifestyle is not about sex? Then what defines it? I already said I have the same standard about direct allusions to heterosexual penetration in grade schools.

Homosexuality is aberrant. Just like polygamy. You can't make arguments for one that would not also support the other.

How does someone as partisan as you get to be a mod around here?

Aaah ... there you go. Thanks for showing your true colors. You don't care about teaching knowledge and educating kids, you only care because this "offends" you. Done with this now, since you clearly do not think with your brain, only your book.

They are one and the same. Ebonics is knowledge. Does it tend towared edification? How to inject yourself with heroin is knowledge. How to build a nuclear bomb is knowlege. Do these offend people and should they perhaps not be taught?

Is education some morally neutral environment? Ever had kids in a public school on the day teachers walked on a job action out or brow beat them about an upcoming spending referendum?

The sad thing, if I had not been taught about drugs in elementary I would have fallen in with them the bad way. I learned how to make a nuke easily, actually, I figured it out then later in school found out I was right because I just happen to be a technical prodigy, so that's moot. Ebonics was taught in schools, as part of some other classes, so yeah, why that's a problem anyway is beyond me, hell, they teach sign language, is there something wrong with that one to? Since the public schools are paid through taxes from everyone, yes, they are neutral, and all the information they allow should not be influenced by what someone "feels" is right or wrong or what someone's religion believes is right or wrong, period. If you want a biased school, go private, otherwise your beliefs are only protected, not enforced, just like everyone elses, and they are taught as myth and theology as it appropriate. So, unless you have some scientific and unbiased reason why gay rights is wrong, you cannot stop it from being allowed by the students in their discussions, just as they also cannot stop the students from saying it's wrong. But in order for them to make intelligent decisions in life, they need to know the facts, without those facts they will make stupid and ignorant choices and wind up in prison or worse.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

still waiting for an answer

She never claimed the school made her do anything. Her point was the schools in this country now FORCE our children to be taught that being GAY is somehow normal. And at an early age.

That you are twisting it to means he claimed the school had her write this report either means you are shit dumb on the topic or trying to divert attention from what was being argued.

actually, she did
she was claiming that this was forced indoctrination
when the school was against the girl giving this report
thus, not forced anything

Are you just being a DUMB ASS tonight, She meant the school system in the US Forces sex education and the Homosexual Agenda in elementary school now. All across this country. And when the schools object the ACLU and the politically correct jump all over them.

This is an abnormality, a school that actually took the time to INFORM parents about a potential subject they might not want their children to be FORCED to hear about.

 

[KittenKoder]

She never claimed the school made her do anything. Her point was the schools in this country now FORCE our children to be taught that being GAY is somehow normal. And at an early age.

That you are twisting it to means he claimed the school had her write this report either means you are shit dumb on the topic or trying to divert attention from what was being argued.

actually, she did
she was claiming that this was forced indoctrination
when the school was against the girl giving this report
thus, not forced anything

Are you just being a DUMB ASS tonight, She meant the school system in the US Forces sex education and the Homosexual Agenda in elementary school now. All across this country. And when the schools object the ACLU and the politically correct jump all over them.

This is an abnormality, a school that actually took the time to INFORM parents about a potential subject they might not want their children to be FORCED to hear about.

Really, pray tell, what curriculum, and be specific, is about teaching sex to children in 6th grade?

 

[RetiredGySgt]

How about misogynistic lyrics in a rap song at a grade school talent show? Innocence or ignorance.? What is the body of morality that prohibits that, but has no problem with the discussion of a historic figure whose movement defines itself by their propensity to insert erect penises into other men's rectums?

Is Christopher Columbus a pariah but Harvey Milk an icon? Who gets to decide that except the indoctrinator?

but the point is, the report of Milk was censored
had she done it on Columbus, she wouldnt have had a problem

Because Columbus is not sexual in nature, nor Homosexual. He is a LEGITIMATE Historical figure, that has been discussed for YEARS in our schools.

And by the way? 6th Graders do NOT have 1st Amendment rights in school like adults have in every day life. Don't like that? Take it up with the Supreme Court.

Further in real life if Susie showed up at work and wanted time to read her "report" it to would be subject to the rules of the work place and what the topic was. Ohh and the ADULTS would have the right to walk out if they found her piece offensive. 6th Graders do not have the right to walk out of class if they find something offensive. Thus Teachers must act in the best interest of the ENTIRE class, including the PARENTS of the children in that classroom.

The Teacher read the report and found it questionable so she took it to the Principle who read it and agreed that parents MUST be informed. ALL part of the authority, responsibility and DUTY under law of the Principle and the teacher.

After the parents were informed, time was allowed to read the report to those that chose to listen or had their parents permission to listen. She was not censored in ANY manner regardless of the baseless claims by you, the ACLU and others on this Board. Had she BEEN censored, it would have been with in the power of the school to MAKE that call.

 

[KittenKoder]

How about misogynistic lyrics in a rap song at a grade school talent show? Innocence or ignorance.? What is the body of morality that prohibits that, but has no problem with the discussion of a historic figure whose movement defines itself by their propensity to insert erect penises into other men's rectums?

Is Christopher Columbus a pariah but Harvey Milk an icon? Who gets to decide that except the indoctrinator?

but the point is, the report of Milk was censored
had she done it on Columbus, she wouldnt have had a problem

Because Columbus is not sexual in nature, nor Homosexual. He is a LEGITIMATE Historical figure, that has been discussed for YEARS in our schools.

And by the way? 6th Graders do NOT have 1st Amendment rights in school like adults have in every day life. Don't like that? Take it up with the Supreme Court.

Further in real life if Susie showed up at work and wanted time to read her "report" it to would be subject to the rules of the work place and what the topic was. Ohh and the ADULTS would have the right to walk out if they found her piece offensive. 6th Graders do not have the right to walk out of class if they find something offensive. Thus Teachers must act in the best interest of the ENTIRE class, including the PARENTS of the children in that classroom.

The Teacher read the report and found it questionable so she took it to the Principle who read it and agreed that parents MUST be informed. ALL part of the authority, responsibility and DUTY under law of the Principle and the teacher.

After the parents were informed, time was allowed to read the report to those that chose to listen or had their parents permission to listen. She was not censored in ANY manner regardless of the baseless claims by you, the ACLU and others on this Board. Had she BEEN censored, it would have been with in the power of the school to MAKE that call.

So, then students should not be taught about family either, since that's sexual.

 

[Agnapostate]

And by the way? 6th Graders do NOT have 1st Amendment rights in school like adults have in every day life. Don't like that? Take it up with the Supreme Court.

I've not seen anyone here claim otherwise. However, it is indeed the case that public school students possess First Amendment rights to some degree. Again, consult Tinker v. Des Moines.

 

[Fraulein Hilda]

but the point is, the report of Milk was censored
had she done it on Columbus, she wouldnt have had a problem

Because Columbus is not sexual in nature, nor Homosexual. He is a LEGITIMATE Historical figure, that has been discussed for YEARS in our schools.

And by the way? 6th Graders do NOT have 1st Amendment rights in school like adults have in every day life. Don't like that? Take it up with the Supreme Court.

Further in real life if Susie showed up at work and wanted time to read her "report" it to would be subject to the rules of the work place and what the topic was. Ohh and the ADULTS would have the right to walk out if they found her piece offensive. 6th Graders do not have the right to walk out of class if they find something offensive. Thus Teachers must act in the best interest of the ENTIRE class, including the PARENTS of the children in that classroom.

The Teacher read the report and found it questionable so she took it to the Principle who read it and agreed that parents MUST be informed. ALL part of the authority, responsibility and DUTY under law of the Principle and the teacher.

After the parents were informed, time was allowed to read the report to those that chose to listen or had their parents permission to listen. She was not censored in ANY manner regardless of the baseless claims by you, the ACLU and others on this Board. Had she BEEN censored, it would have been with in the power of the school to MAKE that call.

So, then students should not be taught about family either, since that's sexual.

No, they should not be taught about family. Are they? Have they eclipsed Asian immigrants in math and science yet? Have the dropout rates in major metropolitan urban areas dropped below 50% yet?

 

[DiveCon]

She never claimed the school made her do anything. Her point was the schools in this country now FORCE our children to be taught that being GAY is somehow normal. And at an early age.

That you are twisting it to means he claimed the school had her write this report either means you are shit dumb on the topic or trying to divert attention from what was being argued.

actually, she did
she was claiming that this was forced indoctrination
when the school was against the girl giving this report
thus, not forced anything

Are you just being a DUMB ASS tonight, She meant the school system in the US Forces sex education and the Homosexual Agenda in elementary school now. All across this country. And when the schools object the ACLU and the politically correct jump all over them.

This is an abnormality, a school that actually took the time to INFORM parents about a potential subject they might not want their children to be FORCED to hear about.

no, but it seems like you are being a dumbass
that has absolutely nothing to do with what she claimed
she was claiming THIS school was doing forced indoctrination
and it wasnt


have you read the whole thread?

 

[RetiredGySgt]

but the point is, the report of Milk was censored
had she done it on Columbus, she wouldnt have had a problem

Because Columbus is not sexual in nature, nor Homosexual. He is a LEGITIMATE Historical figure, that has been discussed for YEARS in our schools.

And by the way? 6th Graders do NOT have 1st Amendment rights in school like adults have in every day life. Don't like that? Take it up with the Supreme Court.

Further in real life if Susie showed up at work and wanted time to read her "report" it to would be subject to the rules of the work place and what the topic was. Ohh and the ADULTS would have the right to walk out if they found her piece offensive. 6th Graders do not have the right to walk out of class if they find something offensive. Thus Teachers must act in the best interest of the ENTIRE class, including the PARENTS of the children in that classroom.

The Teacher read the report and found it questionable so she took it to the Principle who read it and agreed that parents MUST be informed. ALL part of the authority, responsibility and DUTY under law of the Principle and the teacher.

After the parents were informed, time was allowed to read the report to those that chose to listen or had their parents permission to listen. She was not censored in ANY manner regardless of the baseless claims by you, the ACLU and others on this Board. Had she BEEN censored, it would have been with in the power of the school to MAKE that call.

So, then students should not be taught about family either, since that's sexual.

Wrong as usual. Ohh and remind me when children are taught about FAMILIES anyway? I do not recall that class when I went nor when my children went.

No classes on any type of family. Social Studies gets into societies and how they operate, rather then pure history. But not about families.

There are no classes on married versus divorced or separated families. No classes on who can and can not marry. No discussions at all in Elementary school about that at all, well except the new classes dealing with Homosexual couples and sex education in Elementary school.

School books have specifically been changed to ADDRESS homosexual couples and families. To teach our children that being gay is normal and perfectly fine. Now where is my class on teaching those same children that CHRISTIAN Religion is NORMAL and fine? Or to teach them that Heterosexual couples are actually the NORMAL couples?

Less then 5 percent of the population is gay. They are NOT normal. It is also an at risk relationship, with increased risk of disease for both men and women. The reality is gays tend to be promiscuous, especially men. They CHOSE to engage in unhealthy sexual practices and situations.

Just like it is not the schools place to discuss NORMAL sex or relationships with elementary school children. It is NOT their place to go out of their way to discuss the Homosexual community, couples or sex.

 

[Fraulein Hilda]

For the last fucking time, a court upheld that the little brainwashed shit had a right to present a report on the gay man Harvey Milk, no matter what the school or parents wanted.

That is indoctrination.

 

[KittenKoder]

For the last fucking time, a court upheld that the little brainwashed shit had a right to present a report on the gay man Harvey Milk, no matter what the school or parents wanted.

That is indoctrination.

You already informed us that you don't like reality much, or historical reality at least. Old news.

 

[Father Time]

For the last fucking time, a court upheld that the little brainwashed shit had a right to present a report on the gay man Harvey Milk, no matter what the school or parents wanted.

That is indoctrination.

How? If this whole fight was over a report on the inquisition would she then be an indoctrinated Catholic shit?

On a separate note I always find it amusing how in these situations how people chant "if it were about some right wing figure X Y or Z the ACLU/the left wing wouldn't care" this being said without any solid evidence or psychic powers.

 

[DiveCon]

For the last fucking time, a court upheld that the little brainwashed shit had a right to present a report on the gay man Harvey Milk, no matter what the school or parents wanted.

That is indoctrination.

How? If this whole fight was over a report on the inquisition would she then be an indoctrinated Catholic shit?

On a separate note I always find it amusing how in these situations how people chant "if it were about some right wing figure X Y or Z the ACLU/the left wing wouldn't care" this being said without any solid evidence or psychic powers.

well, that would depend on the bend of the report
she might end up an anti-chatholic shit

 

[Fraulein Hilda]

Local school boards and parents have a right to shape their curriculum using any local standards and mores they want.

 

[DamnYankee]

those damn straight people !

I know! Straight concepts should be illegal!

not everyone orgasms to big hard drives KK. Sorry you're an oddball.

Well... at least not the metal type....

 

[DamnYankee]

but the point is, the report of Milk was censored
had she done it on Columbus, she wouldnt have had a problem

Because Columbus is not sexual in nature, nor Homosexual. He is a LEGITIMATE Historical figure, that has been discussed for YEARS in our schools.

And by the way? 6th Graders do NOT have 1st Amendment rights in school like adults have in every day life. Don't like that? Take it up with the Supreme Court.

Further in real life if Susie showed up at work and wanted time to read her "report" it to would be subject to the rules of the work place and what the topic was. Ohh and the ADULTS would have the right to walk out if they found her piece offensive. 6th Graders do not have the right to walk out of class if they find something offensive. Thus Teachers must act in the best interest of the ENTIRE class, including the PARENTS of the children in that classroom.

The Teacher read the report and found it questionable so she took it to the Principle who read it and agreed that parents MUST be informed. ALL part of the authority, responsibility and DUTY under law of the Principle and the teacher.

After the parents were informed, time was allowed to read the report to those that chose to listen or had their parents permission to listen. She was not censored in ANY manner regardless of the baseless claims by you, the ACLU and others on this Board. Had she BEEN censored, it would have been with in the power of the school to MAKE that call.

So, then students should not be taught about family either, since that's sexual.

What I believe he's trying to say is, it's entirely up to the school district/board of ed/admnistrators to decide, and the parents by way of their right to "input" into the system. This particular parent had avenues available other than the ACLU. It's a sad commentary, really, that members of a society/community choose to sue rather than work out their differences and/or accept that "majority" as the proper authority by which they will be ruled.

 

[PubliusInfinitum]

Yup and if this were about Garfield we wouldn't have even heard about it. BUT since anything Gay is good, well damn it is national news.

That's silly. If it were about Garfield then I doubt the school would have done anything about it so naturally we wouldn't be hearing about it.

Got it right? Not even close it is a fucking elementary school. What the hell is wrong with you? Since when do we sue Elementary schools for doing their damn jobs? And since when does a report become a National News item from an ELEMENTARY School? Why just as soon as it has any dealings with a Gay, that is when.

What's their job here? The presentation had nothing to do with sex ed.

It becomes national news when the ACLU files a lawsuit it seems.

And these are 6th graders, I understand that this is an elementary school but that was junior high for me. We're talking 12 year olds here.

I bet if little Suzy did a report on that guy in Iowa that is trying to get to the Supreme Court about the fact they are sending him to jail for sleeping with his ADULT CONSENTING STEP DAUGHTER none of us would have heard about it. The ACLU wouldn't have even listened to the problem much less spend time and effort to threaten an ELEMENTARY SCHOOL. Nor would it be NATIONAL NEWS.

You see DUMB ASS, that too would fall under CURRENT EVENTS. Just as important as HISTORY.

We don't know what the actual assignment was. For all we know at this point the assignment could just have been to do a presentation on a historical figure you admire. I doubt some schmo in Iowa who is currently in a fight to bang his stepdaughter would qualify.

Why does the anti-gay crowd automatically take things to the extreme when they come up with these imaginary scenarios?

Well sure... because there's no reason to edit or 'censor' what 12 year olds are subjected to... I mean it's just homosexuality and the advocacy of the normalization of sexual deviancy... 12 year olds are perfectly capable of understanding the cultural ramifications of that!

If I had been the principle of that school... I would have agreed with the teacher... that the children were not well suited to hear such an advocacy unless and until an explanation of that advocacy was provided before and after the 'report' was given... whereupon I would have prepared a few words which would properly frame the 'report'...

At which time the ACLU could have sued ME personally for having publically explained to the poor innocent, immature 12 year old minds (6th graders are predominately 11 year olds... but hey... why cloud the issue with facts) in a diatribe of HATE SPEECH...

And we could spend the next several years enjoying a public forum which allowed us to state our reasoned argument on the cultural calamity of normalizing the abnormal... where the pseudo-science of 'human sexuality' which provides the conclusion that Homosexuality is not a function of sexual deviancy, is an irrational FARCE designed to advance sexual deivancy as acceptable, and otherwise normal human behavior which is PERFECTLY SUITABLE AS A TOPIC OF DISCUSSION FOR ELEMENTARY STUDENTS...

Incidentally... Junior High: grades 7-8-9 ... Middle School: grades 6-7-8