Abstinence only works?!?!?

[rightwinger]

Personally I think all this demand for sex education is edorsing or giving kids the ok in having sex. If a parent wants to teach abstinence or putting a banna on a condom, then fine, but the schools or government should not be involved.

I agree, and I think a parent that's saying to their teen that they shouldn't be having sex and explaining why in terms they can relate too, and the possible ramifications they could face, and then a minute later saying 'but if you do, here's what you should do'. When you say that, you're completely erasing any good intent on the first part of the 'talk'. You're saying it's okay to ignore the first part of what I said, it renders it meaningless.

Maybe so....but you are putting all your eggs in one basket that your abstinence talk will work

If it doesn't ....pregnancy will be the result

Why are you afraid of your kid having information? kids need as much information as they can get on their sexuality.

 

[Newby]

I don't think educating them on the dangers of unwanted pregnancies and STD's are a bad thing, especially if there is no one around to talk to them at home.

I think if we indundate our kids with all this sex edducation, it's kind of like telling them we expect you be having sex...IMO we're fucking up.

I understand that there are bad parents out there, but the government should not use that as an excuse to be involved in the buisness of parenting.

So you really think if we just stopped all sex education right now, teenagers won't want to have sex as much? I highly doubt that, if you think back to when you were a teenager it was biologically inprinted that you wanted to have sex as much as possible, not because someone told you that,

No, because they're inundated through the media and pop culture that they're not 'cool' unless they're 'doing it'. That needs to change as well.

 

[High_Gravity]

What is being taught that is so important? You think sex edd is even minimally effective in lowering unwanted pregnancies or STDs? I don't think so...

I don't think educating them on the dangers of unwanted pregnancies and STD's are a bad thing, especially if there is no one around to talk to them at home.

His point is very valid though, apparently it doesn't work.

Hmm, I thought teen pregnancies were going down?

 

[High_Gravity]

I think if we indundate our kids with all this sex edducation, it's kind of like telling them we expect you be having sex...IMO we're fucking up.

I understand that there are bad parents out there, but the government should not use that as an excuse to be involved in the buisness of parenting.

So you really think if we just stopped all sex education right now, teenagers won't want to have sex as much? I highly doubt that, if you think back to when you were a teenager it was biologically inprinted that you wanted to have sex as much as possible, not because someone told you that,

No, because they're inundated through the media and pop culture that they're not 'cool' unless they're 'doing it'. That needs to change as well.

I don't even know how anyone could begin to change that.

 

[Rocko]

Well to be fair if you look at all the teen moms and other single women with not much money who have children and end up living on the government dime, it kind of is.

If they didn't have the 'government dime' to rely on to begin with, maybe they would have made better choices to begin with then? And then it definitely would not be the government's business.

That would be true however thats not the world we live in, when a teen mom gets pregnant and has the child and has to go on assistance, it is the governments business.

They use the "systemic" excuse for everything from nutrition to national security.Do you think the founders would want the taxpayer to pay for every childs sex edd? I don't.

 

[Katzndogz]

I think back to when I was a teenager and I had sex after I got married. As did millions of others.

There is a real problem with not teaching children to delay gratification. They take it seriously and use it across the board, for everything. They have poor impulse control to begin with. They want what they want when they want it. That goes for sex or for a $200.00 pair of Nikes. They have to be trained, guided and taught. Now, the training, guidance and teaching is to the most self-destructive paths there are.

 

[Newby]

So you really think if we just stopped all sex education right now, teenagers won't want to have sex as much? I highly doubt that, if you think back to when you were a teenager it was biologically inprinted that you wanted to have sex as much as possible, not because someone told you that,

No, because they're inundated through the media and pop culture that they're not 'cool' unless they're 'doing it'. That needs to change as well.

I don't even know how anyone could begin to change that.

It's changed to that over the last 50 to 60 years, it can change again. But, you're right, people have worked very hard to normalize sex and sexuality being a very public thing, but at what cost? And what have been the benefits of it really? I guess you could say lots of people making lots of money off of it, but I thought that was a bad thing.

 

[BluePhantom]

We've been all over this on another thread and I will say just what I said there. There's nothing wrong with pushing abstinence, but if that's all you do you are playing Russian roulette. The study being discussed in this thread refers to 6th and 7th grade children. At that age they still cheer for McGruff the Crime Dog so of course they are going to be abstaining. However, when they get older the story changes.

"...the study found that students enrolled in (abstinence-only education) were more likely to report becoming pregnant or causing a pregnancy. The study concluded that the program had no measurable impact on the initiation of sex, the frequency of sex, or the number of sexual partners." (1)

"States that prescribe abstinence-only sex education programs in public schools have significantly higher teenage pregnancy and birth rates than states with more comprehensive sex education programs, researchers from the University of Georgia have determined.....the more strongly abstinence education is emphasized in state laws and policies, the higher the average teenage pregnancy and birth rates." (2)

"...youngsters who took the virginity pledge were not only just as likely to have intercourse, they ultimately were more likely to take part in sex in an unsafe manner...participants had just as many sexual partners as nonparticipants and had sex at the same median age as nonparticipants." (3)


The research seems pretty clear. Abstinence-only education may sound like a great idea....but it doesn't work and actually contributes to the problems of teenage pregnancy and unsafe sexual activity.

1. http://ari.ucsf.edu/science/reports/abstinence.pdf

2. Abstinence-only education does not lead to abstinent behavior, researchers find

3. Abstinence-Only Sex Education Statistics – Final Nail in the Coffin

 

[rightwinger]

I think if we indundate our kids with all this sex edducation, it's kind of like telling them we expect you be having sex...IMO we're fucking up.

I understand that there are bad parents out there, but the government should not use that as an excuse to be involved in the buisness of parenting.

So you really think if we just stopped all sex education right now, teenagers won't want to have sex as much? I highly doubt that, if you think back to when you were a teenager it was biologically inprinted that you wanted to have sex as much as possible, not because someone told you that,

No, because they're inundated through the media and pop culture that they're not 'cool' unless they're 'doing it'. That needs to change as well.

That's why we have parents

 

[BluePhantom]

So you really think if we just stopped all sex education right now, teenagers won't want to have sex as much? I highly doubt that, if you think back to when you were a teenager it was biologically inprinted that you wanted to have sex as much as possible, not because someone told you that,

No, because they're inundated through the media and pop culture that they're not 'cool' unless they're 'doing it'. That needs to change as well.

I don't even know how anyone could begin to change that.

It can change but it would require a complete overhaul of how society views itself and what we value. The reason why we have all this sexually orientated stuff in culture is very simple...it sells. People watch the Quiznos commercial 2 Girls, 1 Sub (posted below for your viewing enjoyment) and say "damn....makes me want to buy a sandwich." Well or something along those lines. Obviously this commercial was taken to the extreme but they do it for a reason....the same reason why football teams have hot cheerleaders, servers at sports bars have big tits, and the Chippendale Dancers make a damn good living.......it flat out works and people like sex.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=15W1eAMy_pI]Playboy presents 2 Girls 1 Sub NEW - YouTube[/ame]

 

[Newby]

No, because they're inundated through the media and pop culture that they're not 'cool' unless they're 'doing it'. That needs to change as well.

I don't even know how anyone could begin to change that.

It can change but it would require a complete overhaul of how society views itself and what we value. The reason why we have all this sexually orientated stuff in culture is very simple...it sells. People watch the Quiznos commercial 2 Girls, 1 Sub (posted below for your viewing enjoyment) and say "damn....makes me want to buy a sandwich." Well or something along those lines. Obviously this commercial was taken to the extreme but they do it for a reason....the same reason why football teams have hot cheerleaders, servers at sports bars have big tits, and the Chippendale Dancers make a damn good living.......it flat out works and people like sex.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=15W1eAMy_pI]Playboy presents 2 Girls 1 Sub NEW - YouTube[/ame]

Yes, it's all about the money. The problem is that the political left tend to promote the sexual revolution, and march against 'the rich' and 'evil profits', yet all that sex, sex, sex we're inundated with on a daily basis is all about the money. Go figure, I guess it depends on what you make your money from. Sex is good, oil is bad.

 

[High_Gravity]

No, because they're inundated through the media and pop culture that they're not 'cool' unless they're 'doing it'. That needs to change as well.

I don't even know how anyone could begin to change that.

It can change but it would require a complete overhaul of how society views itself and what we value. The reason why we have all this sexually orientated stuff in culture is very simple...it sells. People watch the Quiznos commercial 2 Girls, 1 Sub (posted below for your viewing enjoyment) and say "damn....makes me want to buy a sandwich." Well or something along those lines. Obviously this commercial was taken to the extreme but they do it for a reason....the same reason why football teams have hot cheerleaders, servers at sports bars have big tits, and the Chippendale Dancers make a damn good living.......it flat out works and people like sex.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=15W1eAMy_pI]Playboy presents 2 Girls 1 Sub NEW - YouTube[/ame]

Look I'm all for people doing the right thing and waiting for that special someone to have sex and all that but at the same time I like having sex available for me even though I am not married or want a family, I have seen how men act when they are not getting laid and it is very strange, men in the Middle East who don't get laid resort to fucking goats, or each other, I don't think thats a genie we want to let out of the bottle here, some people here make it sound like they want pre-marital meaningless sex to be illegal, like it is in the Muslim countries.

 

[rightwinger]

I don't even know how anyone could begin to change that.

It can change but it would require a complete overhaul of how society views itself and what we value. The reason why we have all this sexually orientated stuff in culture is very simple...it sells. People watch the Quiznos commercial 2 Girls, 1 Sub (posted below for your viewing enjoyment) and say "damn....makes me want to buy a sandwich." Well or something along those lines. Obviously this commercial was taken to the extreme but they do it for a reason....the same reason why football teams have hot cheerleaders, servers at sports bars have big tits, and the Chippendale Dancers make a damn good living.......it flat out works and people like sex.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=15W1eAMy_pI]Playboy presents 2 Girls 1 Sub NEW - YouTube[/ame]

Yes, it's all about the money. The problem is that the political left tend to promote the sexual revolution, and march against 'the rich' and 'evil profits', yet all that sex, sex, sex we're inundated with on a daily basis is all about the money. Go figure, I guess it depends on what you make your money from. Sex is good, oil is bad.

Sex is good........sex with oil is very good

 

[Newby]

I don't even know how anyone could begin to change that.

It can change but it would require a complete overhaul of how society views itself and what we value. The reason why we have all this sexually orientated stuff in culture is very simple...it sells. People watch the Quiznos commercial 2 Girls, 1 Sub (posted below for your viewing enjoyment) and say "damn....makes me want to buy a sandwich." Well or something along those lines. Obviously this commercial was taken to the extreme but they do it for a reason....the same reason why football teams have hot cheerleaders, servers at sports bars have big tits, and the Chippendale Dancers make a damn good living.......it flat out works and people like sex.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=15W1eAMy_pI]Playboy presents 2 Girls 1 Sub NEW - YouTube[/ame]

Look I'm all for people doing the right thing and waiting for that special someone to have sex and all that but at the same time I like having sex available for me even though I am not married or want a family, I have seen how men act when they are not getting laid and it is very strange, men in the Middle East who don't get laid resort to fucking goats, or each other, I don't think thats a genie we want to let out of the bottle here, some people here make it sound like they want pre-marital meaningless sex to be illegal, like it is in the Muslim countries.

I just don't think it has to be so public, in every commercial, every tv show, espeically those shows aimed at teens. No one wants to deny anyone anything, just do it in private, where it should be.

 

[Newby]

It can change but it would require a complete overhaul of how society views itself and what we value. The reason why we have all this sexually orientated stuff in culture is very simple...it sells. People watch the Quiznos commercial 2 Girls, 1 Sub (posted below for your viewing enjoyment) and say "damn....makes me want to buy a sandwich." Well or something along those lines. Obviously this commercial was taken to the extreme but they do it for a reason....the same reason why football teams have hot cheerleaders, servers at sports bars have big tits, and the Chippendale Dancers make a damn good living.......it flat out works and people like sex.

Playboy presents 2 Girls 1 Sub NEW - YouTube

Yes, it's all about the money. The problem is that the political left tend to promote the sexual revolution, and march against 'the rich' and 'evil profits', yet all that sex, sex, sex we're inundated with on a daily basis is all about the money. Go figure, I guess it depends on what you make your money from. Sex is good, oil is bad.

Sex is good........sex with oil is very good

Okay, that was funny... Props..

 

[High_Gravity]

It can change but it would require a complete overhaul of how society views itself and what we value. The reason why we have all this sexually orientated stuff in culture is very simple...it sells. People watch the Quiznos commercial 2 Girls, 1 Sub (posted below for your viewing enjoyment) and say "damn....makes me want to buy a sandwich." Well or something along those lines. Obviously this commercial was taken to the extreme but they do it for a reason....the same reason why football teams have hot cheerleaders, servers at sports bars have big tits, and the Chippendale Dancers make a damn good living.......it flat out works and people like sex.

Playboy presents 2 Girls 1 Sub NEW - YouTube

Look I'm all for people doing the right thing and waiting for that special someone to have sex and all that but at the same time I like having sex available for me even though I am not married or want a family, I have seen how men act when they are not getting laid and it is very strange, men in the Middle East who don't get laid resort to fucking goats, or each other, I don't think thats a genie we want to let out of the bottle here, some people here make it sound like they want pre-marital meaningless sex to be illegal, like it is in the Muslim countries.

I just don't think it has to be so public, in every commercial, every tv show, espeically those shows aimed at teens. No one wants to deny anyone anything, just do it in private, where it should be.

I can agree with that.

 

[PoliticalChic]

No, because they're inundated through the media and pop culture that they're not 'cool' unless they're 'doing it'. That needs to change as well.

I don't even know how anyone could begin to change that.

It can change but it would require a complete overhaul of how society views itself and what we value. The reason why we have all this sexually orientated stuff in culture is very simple...it sells. People watch the Quiznos commercial 2 Girls, 1 Sub (posted below for your viewing enjoyment) and say "damn....makes me want to buy a sandwich." Well or something along those lines. Obviously this commercial was taken to the extreme but they do it for a reason....the same reason why football teams have hot cheerleaders, servers at sports bars have big tits, and the Chippendale Dancers make a damn good living.......it flat out works and people like sex.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=15W1eAMy_pI]Playboy presents 2 Girls 1 Sub NEW - YouTube[/ame]

Be right back....gotta go get a sammich.....

 

[BluePhantom]

Yes, it's all about the money. The problem is that the political left tend to promote the sexual revolution, and march against 'the rich' and 'evil profits', yet all that sex, sex, sex we're inundated with on a daily basis is all about the money. Go figure, I guess it depends on what you make your money from. Sex is good, oil is bad.

Interesting observation. I guess we could switch it around and say that conservatives argue that oil is good, sex is bad too, but I think what you are touching on is the idea that exploiting something to make money (be it sex, oil, whatever) is ok when it's something we as individuals happen to endorse but shameful when it's not. Does that mean we are all of us hypocrites?

 

[BluePhantom]

I just don't think it has to be so public, in every commercial, every tv show, espeically those shows aimed at teens. No one wants to deny anyone anything, just do it in private, where it should be.

Agreed but people are scrambling to make money so advertisers are not going to pass up an opportunity simply because who might be viewing. But this has been hammered into our heads from birth. Let's take my previous example about servers at sports bars. Sports bars cater to men and men like sports, beer, and hot women. Well where do we get that? Simple. As little boys we would sit down and watch the football game with Dad (our idol of what a man should be) and as we bonded with Dad we noticed Dad was drinking a beer. And of course on TV we saw beer commercials. Then we saw the cheerleaders on TV and Dad would say "WOOOO HOOOO look at the rack on that blonde!!!!" And so after doing this over and over, as kids we begin to equate manliness with competition (football), beer, big tits, hot girls, etc.

Well when we grow up we do the exact same thing with our sons and the cycle continues. There's all sorts of things we do like this; I am just using one example. But the point is that men like these things because it's been pounded into our brains from birth that we should like these things. And women have their things they do just like men do. So this is what I mean when I say changing that culture would require a complete overhaul of how we go about life in general. It's possible but you are talking about a monumental task.

 

[Newby]

Yes, it's all about the money. The problem is that the political left tend to promote the sexual revolution, and march against 'the rich' and 'evil profits', yet all that sex, sex, sex we're inundated with on a daily basis is all about the money. Go figure, I guess it depends on what you make your money from. Sex is good, oil is bad.

Interesting observation. I guess we could switch it around and say that conservatives argue that oil is good, sex is bad too, but I think what you are touching on is the idea that exploiting something to make money (be it sex, oil, whatever) is ok when it's something we as individuals happen to endorse but shameful when it's not. Does that mean we are all of us hypocrites?

To some extent, we all probably are.

And I don't think it's that conservatives don't endorse sex, I think it's public sex that's the problem.