Abortion

[Bonnie]

While that can be true in some cases, I don't think all do this! I have heard that some that were raped actually chose to keep the baby, and I truly applaud a woman that can do that, but I just don't think ALL can make that same decision.

J, I have a friend that was raped and kept the baby, and the baby is now 3 years old, and she wakes up everyday and thinks how happy she is. It was not the babie's fault that she was raped, and contrary to popular belief.. that baby is not an reminder of what happened. I think you are the kind of person that if ever faced with a tragedy like that you would do the right thing!!

 

[MissileMan]

Thats total BS. Abstinence isnt unrealistic at all. in fact not having to worry about where you 'are going to get some' lessens the sex drive because you learn how to control yourself.

Asking a person to abstain from sex is just as unreasonable as asking them to abstain from eating, breathing etc. I see a lot of people making sex a religious issue when all it is is a natural biological function. Just once I'd like to see more than just a couple folks try to debate an issue with logic instead of always dragging out the "Sin" card.

 

[MissileMan]

Thats total BS. Abstinence isnt unrealistic at all. in fact not having to worry about where you 'are going to get some' lessens the sex drive because you learn how to control yourself.

And if it's just a matter of "mind over nature" explain how dozens, perhaps hundreds of Catholic priests, who have taken vows of celibacy and have so much "faith" that they devote their entire life to their religion, wind up molesting children in their congregation.

 

[janeeng]

J, I have a friend that was raped and kept the baby, and the baby is now 3 years old, and she wakes up everyday and thinks how happy she is. It was not the babie's fault that she was raped, and contrary to popular belief.. that baby is not an reminder of what happened. I think you are the kind of person that if ever faced with a tragedy like that you would do the right thing!!

Bonnie, I knew there would be some people out there that would have this happen, and I do respect that for sure. I just know that some would never be able to do what your friend did as a rememberance of what happened. Your right, the baby had nothing to do with it at all. I am glad your friend decided to do what she did, her baby is lucky to have her as a Mom!

 

[Avatar4321]

Asking a person to abstain from sex is just as unreasonable as asking them to abstain from eating, breathing etc. I see a lot of people making sex a religious issue when all it is is a natural biological function. Just once I'd like to see more than just a couple folks try to debate an issue with logic instead of always dragging out the "Sin" card.

Where have i mentioned sin? How is asking people to show self control in sex any different from asking people not to gorge themselves on food?

 

[Avatar4321]

And if it's just a matter of "mind over nature" explain how dozens, perhaps hundreds of Catholic priests, who have taken vows of celibacy and have so much "faith" that they devote their entire life to their religion, wind up molesting children in their congregation.

Its not that difficult to understand why. These so called celibrate priests joined the priesthood because they are flaming homosexuals and wanted access to little children. They dont have faith as their actions prove that they dont.

 

[MissileMan]

Its not that difficult to understand why. These so called celibrate priests joined the priesthood because they are flaming homosexuals and wanted access to little children. They dont have faith as their actions prove that they dont.

I see. So your stance is that homosexuals are predisposed to pedophilia, I'm beginning to see your point. NOT!

 

[rtwngAvngr]

Well, manditory might be a bit strong, at least if it requires any surgery. But it should be made available to all men, free of charge, and any man fathering a child without telling the woman he is fertile before they have sex should spend a good time in prison.

It depends on the technology really. If it can be done with nano technology, a simple shot... and it has no negative consequences... yes then manditory would make sense.

Wade.

This is eugenics pure and simple. Your advocacy of this procedure while at the same time denigrating the very notion of self control indicates a fundamental off balancedness on your part.

Also let's not start giving negative rep. You know I've never done that to you, but I can start if you want. Let's keep it positive.

 

[007]

Seriously.. I asked for one good reason... .. instead they start debating on instances in which women should be allowed...

I have yet to hear one good reason...

I've read the whole thread -Cp, and I don't see one good reason. But for the life of me, I can't figure out why you'd be asking for a "good" reason. Is there ever a "good" reason to KILL an innocent unborn baby? It looks a whole lot like "COLD BLOODED MURDER" to me.

 

[dilloduck]

I've read the whole thread -Cp, and I don't see one good reason. But for the life of me, I can't figure out why you'd be asking for a "good" reason. Is there ever a "good" reason to KILL an innocent unborn baby? It looks a whole lot like "COLD BLOODED MURDER" to me.

Apparently the "reason" is that people cannot be expected to discipline themselves. Sound similar to poverty and crime issue.

 

[Avatar4321]

I see. So your stance is that homosexuals are predisposed to pedophilia, I'm beginning to see your point. NOT!

It has nothing to do with homosexuals being predisposed to pedophilia. However, its obviously that these so called priests are homosexual in the fact that they pedofile boys. Nor does it change the fact that many of these so called priests entered into the priesthood not to be celibate but to be in a position of authority where they could perpetuate their evil.

Ignoring the facts and generalizing homosexual pedaphile priests as indicative of all human beings is irrational. Besides which the analogy isnt valid to begin witht. We arent advocating celibacy we are advocating abstinence and chastity. You are obviously unfamiliar with the different.

Celibacy involves no sex ever. Abstinence and chastity advocates teach that sex needs to be done responsibly in the bonds of marriage. Celibacy would be like telling people not to eat. Abstinence and chasty would be telling people to eat at the right times. There are times when its appropriate to go without food and water. Fasting. Dieting. etc. Sex is no different. As you said its perfectly natural.

 

[Bonnie]

Bonnie, I knew there would be some people out there that would have this happen, and I do respect that for sure. I just know that some would never be able to do what your friend did as a rememberance of what happened. Your right, the baby had nothing to do with it at all. I am glad your friend decided to do what she did, her baby is lucky to have her as a Mom!

I agree with you, but I think mom is lucky to have that baby, at least that's what her mom says

 

[MissileMan]

It has nothing to do with homosexuals being predisposed to pedophilia. However, its obviously that these so called priests are homosexual in the fact that they pedofile boys. Nor does it change the fact that many of these so called priests entered into the priesthood not to be celibate but to be in a position of authority where they could perpetuate their evil.

Ignoring the facts and generalizing homosexual pedaphile priests as indicative of all human beings is irrational. Besides which the analogy isnt valid to begin witht. We arent advocating celibacy we are advocating abstinence and chastity. You are obviously unfamiliar with the different.

Celibacy involves no sex ever. Abstinence and chastity advocates teach that sex needs to be done responsibly in the bonds of marriage. Celibacy would be like telling people not to eat. Abstinence and chasty would be telling people to eat at the right times. There are times when its appropriate to go without food and water. Fasting. Dieting. etc. Sex is no different. As you said its perfectly natural.

I wasn't generalizing or ignoring facts. I was arguing my point that the human sex drive is so powerful that even those who are supposed to be "above" the temptations of the flesh can succomb. My argument is that abstinence will never be a realistic form of birth control in the fight to lower the numbers of abortions. The best way to prevent abortions is to prevent pregnancy through education and contraception.

Celibacy is abstinence btw it's just that celibacy has a "permanent" connotation. And comparing cutting back on your food intake for a few days and going without sex for months or even years isn't very rational either.

 

[Bonnie]

The biggest hypocracy of this whole horrible problem is when "Pro-choice" advocates claim the government needs to stay out of the womb, and yet.......It was the highest form of government that stepped in the womb and said its okay to kill the baby if unwanted. So basically it was the government that gave American women an all access pass to committ murder. Biggest bit of bullshit spin ever concocted by the Libs!!!

 

[dilloduck]

I wasn't generalizing or ignoring facts. I was arguing my point that the human sex drive is so powerful that even those who are supposed to be "above" the temptations of the flesh can succomb. My argument is that abstinence will never be a realistic form of birth control in the fight to lower the numbers of abortions. The best way to prevent abortions is to prevent pregnancy through education and contraception.

Celibacy is abstinence btw it's just that celibacy has a "permanent" connotation. And comparing cutting back on your food intake for a few days and going without sex for months or even years isn't very rational either.

If you expect people to be unable to do something , you are giving them permisssion to fail.

 

[rtwngAvngr]

If you expect people to be unable to do something , you are giving them permisssion to fail.

Eggsactly!

 

[MissileMan]

If you expect people to be unable to do something , you are giving them permisssion to fail.

No, I am expecting them to fail. There's a big difference.

 

[Bonnie]

No, I am expecting them to fail. There's a big difference.

So basically you are placing humans on the same reasoning scale as Apes????

 

[dilloduck]

No, I am expecting them to fail. There's a big difference.

I'd be glad to hear the difference !

 

[Gem]

MissileMan,

I can see that you truly believe your opinions on this matter...the only problem is that the truth flies in the face of those opinions...are you mature enough to change your opinions when the facts prove you wrong?

You keep going back to the priests guilty of pedophilia...ignoring, conviniently, that the vast majority of priests are NOT pedophiles. The vast majority of those in the priesthood are NOT guilty of abusing children because of their vows of celibacy, so using them as an example does not work.

It would be just as logical to say that having sex causes these crimes since people who HAVE SEX commit them.

You also need to look at history to show that our obsession with sex at earlier and earlier ages has nothing to do with biology and everything to do with societal pressures.

I agree with you that abstinence doesn't work...but you are 100% wrong when you attribute this failure to the unflinching power of the human sex drive rather than a society that tells its children not to have sex, while showing them more images of sex by the time they are 12 then people in the past saw in their entire lives.

Stating that "humans can't control themselves" is a cop-out...but worse than that...its a "cop-out" that has been thoroughly debunked. Men CAN be faithful their entire lives...Woman CAN cheat on their hubands, Priests CAN (in fact most ARE) be celibate and NOT be pedophiles, and Young People CAN wait to have sex.