A very serious question to all Bush haters

[hazlnut]

are you crazy? Are you older then 18 years OLD?

If you aren't crazy AND older then 18 please tell me what alternate universe you lived in during the last 13 years where THESE events didn't occur?

1) 1991 Cease Fire meant Saddam agreed to stop fighting and USA agreed not to invade Iraq and remove him. Remember this?
And so after 9/11 with 92% of Americans WANTING something done and since SADDAM never KEPT the 1991 Cease Fire the 1991 war continued and finished 5/2003!

So my question to you: If you sign a legal document agreeing to terms and you fail to keep the terms.. DO YOU NOT EXPECT some penalties..
The Iraq Liberation Act of 1998 Public law 105-338 CNN - Clinton: Iraq has abused its last chance - December 16, 1998
Clinton signed The Iraq Liberation Act of 1998 Public law 105-338 expressed the sense of congress it should be policy to support efforts to remove from power the
current Iraqi regime. "The President has authority under the consitution to take action in order to deter and prevent acts of international terrorism against the United States."

2) Do you remember the dot.com bubble THAT BURST in 2000?
The Stock Market Crash of 2000-2002 caused the loss of $5 trillion in the market value of companies from March 2000 to October 2002.
Dot-com bubble - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Caused a recession that started then in 3/2001 and $5 trillion in market losses. Allowed taxpayers to deduct each year after 2002 $166 billion from their taxable income.
Lost 300,000 jobs

3) Does the minor event on 9/11/2001 mean anything to you? $2 trillion in losses that again are being written off and in so doing reduces the tax payments to the USA
145,000 jobs lost

4) From 2003 to 2008 WORST HURRICANE SEASONS in history with 7 of the worst 10 hurricanes rom 2004 through 2008 $1 trillion and 400,000 jobs..

YET in spite of that:
Bush had 5 million more people working at the end of his term !
The GDP grew 16% with a $769 billion growth in 2005 the best in 50 years!

Now where are your statistics???

How about a sports analogy.

In the 4th quarter, W. gave up 17 consecutive T.D.s.

The biggest failure since Hoover gave up 23 runs in the 9th inning of the 1928 World Series.

 

[healthmyths]

are you crazy? Are you older then 18 years OLD?

If you aren't crazy AND older then 18 please tell me what alternate universe you lived in during the last 13 years where THESE events didn't occur?

1) 1991 Cease Fire meant Saddam agreed to stop fighting and USA agreed not to invade Iraq and remove him. Remember this?
And so after 9/11 with 92% of Americans WANTING something done and since SADDAM never KEPT the 1991 Cease Fire the 1991 war continued and finished 5/2003!

So my question to you: If you sign a legal document agreeing to terms and you fail to keep the terms.. DO YOU NOT EXPECT some penalties..
The Iraq Liberation Act of 1998 Public law 105-338 CNN - Clinton: Iraq has abused its last chance - December 16, 1998
Clinton signed The Iraq Liberation Act of 1998 Public law 105-338 expressed the sense of congress it should be policy to support efforts to remove from power the
current Iraqi regime. "The President has authority under the consitution to take action in order to deter and prevent acts of international terrorism against the United States."

2) Do you remember the dot.com bubble THAT BURST in 2000?
The Stock Market Crash of 2000-2002 caused the loss of $5 trillion in the market value of companies from March 2000 to October 2002.
Dot-com bubble - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Caused a recession that started then in 3/2001 and $5 trillion in market losses. Allowed taxpayers to deduct each year after 2002 $166 billion from their taxable income.
Lost 300,000 jobs

3) Does the minor event on 9/11/2001 mean anything to you? $2 trillion in losses that again are being written off and in so doing reduces the tax payments to the USA
145,000 jobs lost

4) From 2003 to 2008 WORST HURRICANE SEASONS in history with 7 of the worst 10 hurricanes rom 2004 through 2008 $1 trillion and 400,000 jobs..

YET in spite of that:
Bush had 5 million more people working at the end of his term !
The GDP grew 16% with a $769 billion growth in 2005 the best in 50 years!

Now where are your statistics???

I remember the dot com bust. It was absolutely dwarfed by Bush's 2007-2008 bust.

I think Bush had an increase of 3 million jobs, not 5. But I'll give you 5.

Clinton had at least 20 million. Maybe 25.

As for Iraq, I am one of the few people left who believes the invasion of Iraq was the right thing to do. As someone who personally had to deal with Hussein and his antics on active duty in the Gulf, it was clear to me another war with him was inevitable. And it was far better to do it in 2003 while we still had a fighting chance rather than waiting for the military to be further stripped.

The problem I have with Bush and Iraq is that Bush TOTALLY FUCKED IT UP!!!

Demobilizing the Iraqi Army is going to go down as one of the worst American military fuckups of all time, if not number one.



I appreciate Bush's attempts at immigration reform. He totally understood the situation. We have a labor demand that is not being met by the proper labor supply. His solution would have gone a long way toward resolving that problem, but he was stopped by the psychos and lunatics in his own party.

Too bad.


But overall, Bush sucked. Bush is what happens when Americans stop demanding superior people to lead us, and instead keep voting for the lesser of two evils. You get more and more evil choices.

And just when you thought Bush had to be the very bottom of that sequence...along comes Obama.


I shudder when I think what profoundly disastrous A-Number-One-Fuckup is next in the pipeline.


.

You say "Bush sucked."
FACTS...
1) The phony surplus VANISHED when the same dot.com phony capital gains revenue lost $5 trillion in value. Do YOU think those people that had $5 trillion in losses DIDN"T report those losses in their ADJUSTED TAX INCOME over the next 30 years which is what IRS allows? For example if a Dot.com investor loss $1 million of that $5 trillion that means the investor has 30 years to write off against taxable income $33,000.
So Instead of having a tax on $1 million or at 35% $350,000 by subtracting $33,000 from $1 million that means taxes of 35% on $966,000 or $338,000 a loss to the US treasury of $12,000 from just this $1 million of the $5 trillion!
Or for every $1 million in losses $12,000 loss in tax revenue or on the $5 trillion nearly $60 billion in tax revenue for each year from 2003 and 30 years forward.

2) Then we had 9/11 which cost $2 trillion or at the above example another $24 billion in loss tax revenue from 2004 and next 30 years.

3) Hurricanes cost $1 trillion.. at the above another $12 billion in loss tax revenue.
Collectively Federal tax revenue Loss due to the $8 trillion in losses nearly $100 billion a year from 2003 and next 30 years!

Then payroll taxes
Assuming 300,000 jobs lost due to dot.com bust -- 145,000 lost due to 9/11 (remember airlines didn't fly for 3 days!) 400,000 jobs lost due to hurricanes..
850,000 jobs lost.
So at say an average of $30,000 per job and Social Security and Medicare EMPLOYEE pays 7.65% or $2,295 paid by employee.. BUT I imagine you and many like you forget the EMPLOYER matches that and also pays $2,295 or a total of $4,590 paid in by Employee and Employer!
$4,590 times 850,000 jobs or near $4 billion a year due to those LOST jobs in Federal REVENUE!

So between these two tax revenue generators losing over $100 billion a year all due to what... EVENTS beyond ANYONE's control!!!

 

[bayoubill]

A very serious question to all Bush haters

contrary to what some folks mighta thought about I stand on this issue, I love bush...


call me old-fashioned, but I think it's against God's will for women to be shaving down there...


make no mistake, though... I'm all for a neat trim job... ;-)

 

[Billo_Really]

Why not, people defend obama all the time and he's way worse than Bush ever was or could ever be.

People didn't have to make up mythical issues to criticize Bush over, like you do against Obama.

 

[Too Tall]

Adjusted for inflation, tax revenues peaked in 2000. They only exceeded that level twice in Bush's presidency, 2006 and 2007. So 6 of the 8 years of Bush's presidency,

with Bush's 2 tax cuts, revenues were below the last year of Clinton's presidency.

Untill the recession that Clinton caused.

Clinton didn't cause anything. The 2001 recession was a natural function of the business cycle. Learn what the business cycle is and you might understand that.

The dotcom bust was not a natural function of the business cycle.

 

[healthmyths]

I'm still waiting for someone to refute my figures that the $8 trillion in losses are costing Federal revenue nearly $100 billion a year.

 

[Billo_Really]

1) 1991 Cease Fire meant Saddam agreed to stop fighting and USA agreed not to invade Iraq and remove him. Remember this?
And so after 9/11 with 92% of Americans WANTING something done and since SADDAM never KEPT the 1991 Cease Fire the 1991 war continued and finished 5/2003!

First off, UN Resolution 1441 was the legal document being enforced at the time, not the Cease Fire agreement. And second, it was not our call to make. Any violations of 1441, were to be referred back to the UNSC for review. Thirdly, Iraq wasn't fighting anyone, so how could they break a ceasefire? The only shots they fired, was in response to the over 3000 sorties, dropping over 600 bombs, on over 300 pre-selected targets, we were doing under the cover of "no-fly" zone enforcement. If you were dropping that much ordinance in my back yard, I'd be shooting at you to. And finally, when are you going to stop bringing up 9/11 when talking about our illegal and immoral invasion of Iraq? The two have nothing to do with each other. But if you think they do, then you probably believe we should've attacked Mexico over Pearl Harbor?

So my question to you: If you sign a legal document agreeing to terms and you fail to keep the terms.. DO YOU NOT EXPECT some penalties..
The Iraq Liberation Act of 1998 Public law 105-338 CNN - Clinton: Iraq has abused its last chance - December 16, 1998
Clinton signed The Iraq Liberation Act of 1998 Public law 105-338 expressed the sense of congress it should be policy to support efforts to remove from power the
current Iraqi regime. "The President has authority under the consitution to take action in order to deter and prevent acts of international terrorism against the United States."

You wanna talk about your responsibility when signing a legal document? How bout our Congress ratifying Article 51 of the UN Charter, which, BTW, carries the same weight as the Constitution. And that Article states there is only 2 ways you can legally attack another country:

1. you yourself are attacked by a significant force, or the attack is imminent
2. you receive UNSC authorization to use all necessary means

We had neither! In addition, Iraq didn't attack the US, nor were they making any threats towards us. And how the fuck could they commit acts of terrorism with all the UN inspectors driving around their country in white vans? But I will make you this promise, if you can show me any UN resolution on Iraq, that contained the words "regime change", I'll give you a $1000.

2) Do you remember the dot.com bubble THAT BURST in 2000?
The Stock Market Crash of 2000-2002 caused the loss of $5 trillion in the market value of companies from March 2000 to October 2002.
Dot-com bubble - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Caused a recession that started then in 3/2001 and $5 trillion in market losses. Allowed taxpayers to deduct each year after 2002 $166 billion from their taxable income.
Lost 300,000 jobs!

So what! That's the chance you take when you decide to act on a business idea and it turns out to be a shitty idea. The American taxpayer doesn't insure business sucess for the private sector. If they make it, fine. If they don't, fuck'em!

3) Does the minor event on 9/11/2001 mean anything to you? $2 trillion in losses that again are being written off and in so doing reduces the tax payments to the USA
145,000 jobs lost!

9/11 didn't mean we needed to waste trillions of taxpayer dollars in someone else's god-damn country with no direct benefit in return for average American's. And we're still paying for this shit! That's Bush's fault. As well as every skumbag, PNAC neocon.

4) From 2003 to 2008 WORST HURRICANE SEASONS in history with 7 of the worst 10 hurricanes rom 2004 through 2008 $1 trillion and 400,000 jobs...

Watch it now, your comment is getting a little too close to a pro-global warming position, which is a big no-no, for right-wing sock puppets.

YET in spite of that:
Bush had 5 million more people working at the end of his term !
The GDP grew 16% with a $769 billion growth in 2005 the best in 50 years!

Now where are your statistics???

It was about 1/10 of the growth during Clinton's 8 years in office.

 

[g5000]

I'm still waiting for someone to refute my figures that the $8 trillion in losses are costing Federal revenue nearly $100 billion a year.

Post the evidence.

.

 

[NYcarbineer]

Why did Bush cut taxes if he knew we needed extra revenue for all the extraordinary events that the OP has started about 30 threads on?

Bush may have had quite a few crises, but he reacted to them in precisely the wrong way.

That's why we're in the messes we're in today.

 

[Rozman]

I voted for Bush - twice. But he was still a terrible president. We are still paying for his mistakes.

To answer your points-

1- Yes, Saddam was a bastard, but we had him in a box. We did not need to climb into that box with him. Democrats do deserve some of the blame, they went along with it and were just as loud, but it was still a horrible idea, and as one of Bush's predecessors said, "The BUck stops here."

2- Yes, the recession of 2001 was horrible. But you know what, Bush took the wrong approach. It was not a recession that could be helped with cutting taxes. (There are times when that might be a solution. the 1960 recession or the 1981 recession. 2001 and 2008 were not those times.)

3- Yes, 9-11 was horrible. But Bush's reaction to it, going to war with a country that had nothing to do with it w hile ignoring the guy who did it, was wrong, too. And expensive.

4- The hurricanes were awful. BUt they were made worse by the fact that he got rid of the professionals Clinton put in FEMA and replaced them with hacks like "Brownie".

The notion that he had more jobs than when he started is statistically misleading in so many ways.

Fact is, unemployment was 3.9% when he took office and 7.8% when he left. But it is worse than that in the fact that the jobs that were created on his watch were not good paying manufacturing jobs, but poorly paying service jobs.

Fact is, unemployment was 3.9% when he took office and 7.8% when he left. But it is worse than that in the fact that the jobs that were created on his watch were not good paying manufacturing jobs, but poorly paying service jobs.

Can you fill us in on the jobs our Lord and Savior (according to Jamie Foxx) President Obama has created....He has now created well over 5 million jobs now....

Are they all $100k jobs...

Please let us all know the type of jobs this President has created.

 

[Billo_Really]

Why did Bush cut taxes if he knew we needed extra revenue for all the extraordinary events that the OP has started about 30 threads on?
.

Because he was a corporate bitch, doing what he was told, like a good little whore.

 

[lovemymutts]

I voted for Bush - twice. But he was still a terrible president. We are still paying for his mistakes.

To answer your points-

1- Yes, Saddam was a bastard, but we had him in a box. We did not need to climb into that box with him. Democrats do deserve some of the blame, they went along with it and were just as loud, but it was still a horrible idea, and as one of Bush's predecessors said, "The BUck stops here."

2- Yes, the recession of 2001 was horrible. But you know what, Bush took the wrong approach. It was not a recession that could be helped with cutting taxes. (There are times when that might be a solution. the 1960 recession or the 1981 recession. 2001 and 2008 were not those times.)

3- Yes, 9-11 was horrible. But Bush's reaction to it, going to war with a country that had nothing to do with it w hile ignoring the guy who did it, was wrong, too. And expensive.

4- The hurricanes were awful. BUt they were made worse by the fact that he got rid of the professionals Clinton put in FEMA and replaced them with hacks like "Brownie".

The notion that he had more jobs than when he started is statistically misleading in so many ways.

Fact is, unemployment was 3.9% when he took office and 7.8% when he left. But it is worse than that in the fact that the jobs that were created on his watch were not good paying manufacturing jobs, but poorly paying service jobs.

Joe I'm with you 100%.

 

[thanatos144]

Why did Bush cut taxes if he knew we needed extra revenue for all the extraordinary events that the OP has started about 30 threads on?

Bush may have had quite a few crises, but he reacted to them in precisely the wrong way.

That's why we're in the messes we're in today.

Why do you hate the idea of people keeping more of what they earn??????Why do you hate working men and women?

 

[thanatos144]

I voted for Bush - twice. But he was still a terrible president. We are still paying for his mistakes.

To answer your points-

1- Yes, Saddam was a bastard, but we had him in a box. We did not need to climb into that box with him. Democrats do deserve some of the blame, they went along with it and were just as loud, but it was still a horrible idea, and as one of Bush's predecessors said, "The BUck stops here."

2- Yes, the recession of 2001 was horrible. But you know what, Bush took the wrong approach. It was not a recession that could be helped with cutting taxes. (There are times when that might be a solution. the 1960 recession or the 1981 recession. 2001 and 2008 were not those times.)

3- Yes, 9-11 was horrible. But Bush's reaction to it, going to war with a country that had nothing to do with it w hile ignoring the guy who did it, was wrong, too. And expensive.

4- The hurricanes were awful. BUt they were made worse by the fact that he got rid of the professionals Clinton put in FEMA and replaced them with hacks like "Brownie".

The notion that he had more jobs than when he started is statistically misleading in so many ways.

Fact is, unemployment was 3.9% when he took office and 7.8% when he left. But it is worse than that in the fact that the jobs that were created on his watch were not good paying manufacturing jobs, but poorly paying service jobs.

Joe I'm with you 100%.

Joe is most likely 15 and didnt vote for anyone.

 

[lovemymutts]

I voted for Bush - twice. But he was still a terrible president. We are still paying for his mistakes.

To answer your points-

1- Yes, Saddam was a bastard, but we had him in a box. We did not need to climb into that box with him. Democrats do deserve some of the blame, they went along with it and were just as loud, but it was still a horrible idea, and as one of Bush's predecessors said, "The BUck stops here."

2- Yes, the recession of 2001 was horrible. But you know what, Bush took the wrong approach. It was not a recession that could be helped with cutting taxes. (There are times when that might be a solution. the 1960 recession or the 1981 recession. 2001 and 2008 were not those times.)

3- Yes, 9-11 was horrible. But Bush's reaction to it, going to war with a country that had nothing to do with it w hile ignoring the guy who did it, was wrong, too. And expensive.

4- The hurricanes were awful. BUt they were made worse by the fact that he got rid of the professionals Clinton put in FEMA and replaced them with hacks like "Brownie".

The notion that he had more jobs than when he started is statistically misleading in so many ways.

Fact is, unemployment was 3.9% when he took office and 7.8% when he left. But it is worse than that in the fact that the jobs that were created on his watch were not good paying manufacturing jobs, but poorly paying service jobs.

Joe I'm with you 100%.

Joe is most likely 15 and didnt vote for anyone.

I can't speak for Joe.I'm 59 and also voted for Bush twice.Hind sight is 20/20 and everything Joe said is true.

 

[Rozman]

I am shocked that the Democrat party, the friend of the working class is happy with Obama going
after people making $250K?

 

[lovemymutts]

I am shocked that the Democrat party, the friend of the working class is happy with Obama going
after people making $250K?

The AVERAGE workingclass makes LESS than 70,000.00 per year.

 

[thanatos144]

I am shocked that the Democrat party, the friend of the working class is happy with Obama going
after people making $250K?

The AVERAGE workingclass makes LESS than 70,000.00 per year.

workingclass????? What is it with you progressives and your caste system?

 

[Rozman]

People making $250K are not rich.
A lot of them are small business owners living in big cities.
I never understood Obama the friend of the working class doing this.

 

[Truthseeker420]

Wow, someone is actually going to try to defend that cocksucker?

Why not, people defend obama all the time and he's way worse than Bush ever was or could ever be. obama can't be compared to Bush, obama would have to be compared to Caligula or Nero. That's how far back we'd have to go to get another obama.

War, Torture and welfare for the rich vs Healthcare,tax cuts and rebuilding infrastructure.