A true Mystery: Why do Republicans say they kept the country safe?

[jillian]

It's that whole early bird -- worm thing

 

[NYcarbineer]

Why do Republicans say what they say? Because they are delusional idiots living in some alternate universe.

Exhibit 999, Mary Matalin claiming that Bush INHERITED 9/11

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xR93iKtFlcQ

No, you're right, you can't make this shit up. At least you can't make shit up that's funnier than what the Republicans say for real.

So, according to you the previous administration to Bush had nothing to do with 9/11 - is that your argument? Really?

How very, very naive of you if that is the case.

I think it is nothing short of pathetic that people insist on blaming 'the republican', Bush, or any other individual or set of ideals for 9/11. It might be easier to believe that but it simply is not fact.

It insults the memory of those who died when their deaths are used for political gain - from either side. I think it's sad that we have so little morality left that we will use any weapon, no matter how distasteful, to score political points.

You're as stupid as Mary Matalin, then. Congratulations.

 

[QUENTIN]

CaliGirl,

Recognizing reality, how something came to pass, particularly something so monumentally destructive and horrendous, is not "scoring political points" it is understanding what happened, how, and why so that we may better prevent it from happening again.

Recent history is pretty well-recorded. It's fairly easy to see what happened and what series of critical decisions were made very poorly and to our collective detriment as a people. Massive mistakes and incompetence allowed a dozen or so guys with box cutters to kill ~3,000 people. In the aftermath, the point is not to point fingers and go "that individual is to blame! his party sucks!" because that doesn't get us anywhere, but rather come to terms with how horribly the government failed in its responsibilities, precisely where it failed, and find what we can do to prevent those costly errors from being made in the future.

If we pretend something we had a million and one ways of preventing, that we had ample and dire warning on and was allowed to proceed only due to the failure to act on intelligence already in our possession, wasn't the result of specific negligence than we open ourselves to more of it by not assuring such negligence will be tolerated no longer.

Had the Christmas bomber succeeded and a 300 people died, knowing now that the intelligence agencies had more than enough information to prevent him from getting on a plane and all the signs that were there but not acted upon, we'd all be saying the same thing. The only difference is the failure of that information to be properly responded to was at the level of a bureaucratic functionary placing the suspect's name on too few watch lists to prevent his attempt and not all the pieces being put together, whereas the failure to prevent the hijackers attempt was made at the level of Cabinet Secretaries who consciously chose not to act when presented with all the relevant data that had put together for them. So it's just incompetence in a different area, at a different tier we have to address and correct.

 

[Cold Fusion38]

Maybe fully refundable tax credits for continued education.

They already have the Hope credit. I claim it myself. I am currently working on my MBA.

Maybe tax credits for medical costs for lower class people who have to choose to either pay bills or get needed medical treatment.

How do you give a tax credit to someone who isn't paying taxes?



I agree. I would love to see tax credits for small business owners. Why don't you get on the horn with Obama and tell him to actually do something that will fix the economy instead of fucking around with all of that wasteful and ineffective "stimulus" spending.

Maybe tax credits for low income home owners who bought houses they could afford before losing their jobs so they can keep their homes through the bad times until they can find new jobs.

Again, if they are low income they aren't paying taxes, so how do you give them a tax credit? Asking for a credit or a handout? Furthermore, a lot of those people shouldn't have qualified for a mortgage in the first place. That is precisely what lead to the economic crash we are experiencing. You can thank the politicians for that.

I could go on and on and on with a hundred BETTER ways to cut taxes than to give them to the ULTRA WEALTHY!

Wealthier Americans are also not entitled to what they work for? It is the "ultra wealthy" who invest and put capital into business entities all over the globe. It is that investment that allows companies to expand and put more people like you and me to work. The economy has recovered every time the Federal tax obligation has been cut because it stimulates more investment and growth in the marketplace. If I were Obama one of the first things I would have instructed Congress to do is temporarily suspend the Capital Gains tax for a year or two or however long is needed for employment to return to acceptable levels. Instead he went on a spending spree to a level never before seen in this nation's history and the economic environment has only gotten worse and stagnant and world wide confidence in the American dollar is at a historical and dangerous low.

If you use the HOPE credit then you should KNOW that it isn't a fully refundable tax credit. Oh and the 50s which were one of the greatest decades for the US had FAR higher tax on the wealthy how do you reconcile that FACT with your claim that CUTTING taxes for the wealthy results in economic growth. You are LYING or flat out misinformed. Starting with Reagan the tax burden has been moved from the wealthiest 10% to the Federal DEBT!!! Since Reagan that national debt has EXPLODED, in fact, Reagan TRIPLED the national debt so he could give tax cuts and guess what they DIDN'T WORK! The FACT is that the ULTRA WEALTHY DON'T invest in their OWN COUNTRY or fellow citizens they send jobs overseas while counting their profits so I say FUCK THEM if they have no patriotism. ANY tax cut for big business and the wealthy should hinge upon making jobs HERE not over seas. If they make jobs/factories here they get a tax break, if they make products over seas they get tariffed 100%.

 

[Cold Fusion38]

Again, if they are low income they aren't paying taxes, so how do you give them a tax credit? Asking for a credit or a handout? Furthermore, a lot of those people shouldn't have qualified for a mortgage in the first place. That is precisely what lead to the economic crash we are experiencing. You can thank the politicians for that.


Oh one more think Taz..........I have a house that I got through a zero down FHA program but I have lost my job and fear I will lose my home. We were qualified for 50% MORE home than we bought so we did NOT over extend or buy more house than we could afford but times change and now we may not be able to keep our home. I know it helps you sleep at night to believe that only those who took advantage of the system are losing their homes but that is a LIE. Heck I would be happy to repay the credit when things improve but the LAST thing that I or my neighbors need is ANOTHER for sale sign in the neighborhood.

 

[Cold Fusion38]

The AVERAGE wage has gone down over the last decade. The AVERAGE American has LESS money while the cost of living has INCREASED. DO YOU FUCKING GET IT!!!??? So if you think I give a fuck about a BILLIONAIRE having to pay more income tax you are sadly mistaken.

"My life is a shit sandwich, so I LIKE making everyone else as miserable as I am!"

Hey, if you can live with the picture this paints of your character, I certainly can. By all means, wallow proudly in being a pusbag.

You are so GD dumb it's painful to read your posts. The AVERAGE AMERICAN!!! Do you understand what that means? I bet YOU have been suffering just like every other average American but you will wag you tail and lick the hand of your master while begging for scraps, what a schmuck you are.

 

[Cold Fusion38]

The true mystery, in my eyes, and I mean no disrespect here rdean, the true mystery is...

Why are you, and many more just like you, so fixated on the past? Why do you, and by "you" I mean you and those just like you, have such a hard on for the Bush administration? They're no longer in office, they can do no more harm, your guys currently control the government, everything shoud be peaches and cream. But no, you continue to harp on things you cannot change. Why not worry about the present? The future? If you continue tolook back, you won't be able to see where we're going.

Do you think the "HARM" done by the Bush admin stopped the day he left office? The damage CONTINUES as we spend MORE money in Iraq, as we lose MORE lives in Afghanistan, as our economy CONTINUES to sink under the $5 TRILLION of debt the Bush admin added to our national debt. WAKE UP we will be suffering for DECADES because of Bush, especially the brain damaged and emotionally scarred servicemen from Iraq/Afghanistan.

 

[Cold Fusion38]

Why do Republicans say what they say? Because they are delusional idiots living in some alternate universe.

Exhibit 999, Mary Matalin claiming that Bush INHERITED 9/11

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xR93iKtFlcQ

No, you're right, you can't make this shit up. At least you can't make shit up that's funnier than what the Republicans say for real.

So, according to you the previous administration to Bush had nothing to do with 9/11 - is that your argument? Really?

How very, very naive of you if that is the case.

I think it is nothing short of pathetic that people insist on blaming 'the republican', Bush, or any other individual or set of ideals for 9/11. It might be easier to believe that but it simply is not fact.

It insults the memory of those who died when their deaths are used for political gain - from either side. I think it's sad that we have so little morality left that we will use any weapon, no matter how distasteful, to score political points.

I am curious, did you think it insulted the memory of those lost on 9/11 when Gulianni CONSTANTLY used 9/11 as a campaign tool? When Bush used 9/11 AND the first responders as a PHOTO OP was that an insult?

 

[Cold Fusion38]

About sums it up...

Ya think? Cuz it appears to me that there's an inability to grasp a simple but significant concept..... just because one is not a democrat, does not make one a republican. I know it's a difficult truth but it is the truth.

I realise this. I was more talking about the overall gist of the post. That aside, this 'Dem" and "repub" thing cracks me up. I come from a nation of 4 million people that has seven different political parties in our parliament. There is a political party for everyone....This is why US politics cracks me up....prolly one of the worst systems in the western world, with the British a close second (which is the FPP system we had until 96)....

No doubt our political system is f'ed up but it is entrenched in over 200 years of history. The thing to consider is that we set up a highly succesful system while most other countries were still in the dark ages. The fact is MANY countries modeled their system to a degree after ours but they had the advantage of seeing all the things that were wrong with our system, Canada is a prime example. I wish we had a parlamentary system with 3-7 parties but that will NEVER happen unless we have civil war which I DON'T want.

 

[rdean]

The true mystery, in my eyes, and I mean no disrespect here rdean, the true mystery is...

Why are you, and many more just like you, so fixated on the past? Why do you, and by "you" I mean you and those just like you, have such a hard on for the Bush administration? They're no longer in office, they can do no more harm, your guys currently control the government, everything shoud be peaches and cream. But no, you continue to harp on things you cannot change. Why not worry about the present? The future? If you continue tolook back, you won't be able to see where we're going.

Oh, that's an easy one. I'm embarrassed to have to answer it.

The only way we, as a country, can avoid the same mistakes we made in the past, is to study and understand what those mistakes were. In 1997, the Reagan Legacy Project was developed to rewrite the Ronald Reagan Legacy into something Republicans can actually be proud of. The problem is the mistakes of that administration were covered up and historical facts changed to make he seem as if damaging policies actually "worked".

The attempt to do the same for the Bush administration is already under way. If Republicans remain unchecked, in twenty years, Bush will have been transformed from a fool into the greatest president. He will be known for bringing change to the Middle East. For rebuilding New Orleans. His fiscal policies will have saved the world economy. He will be known as he "Decider" and a deep thinker and thoughtful leader who also was a leader in Civil Rights and Environmental Protection.

You can see it coming. That's what Republicans do. For example, they ignore the fact that racists fled the Democratic Party to take up residence in the Republican party, then claim that the Republican Party was the forefront of civil rights, yea, before the racists took it over. A perfect example of "rewriting history". You can change so much just by leaving out a few sentences or adding a couple of words.

 

[rdean]

Why do Republicans say what they say? Because they are delusional idiots living in some alternate universe.

Exhibit 999, Mary Matalin claiming that Bush INHERITED 9/11

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xR93iKtFlcQ

No, you're right, you can't make this shit up. At least you can't make shit up that's funnier than what the Republicans say for real.

So, according to you the previous administration to Bush had nothing to do with 9/11 - is that your argument? Really?

How very, very naive of you if that is the case.

I think it is nothing short of pathetic that people insist on blaming 'the republican', Bush, or any other individual or set of ideals for 9/11. It might be easier to believe that but it simply is not fact.

It insults the memory of those who died when their deaths are used for political gain - from either side. I think it's sad that we have so little morality left that we will use any weapon, no matter how distasteful, to score political points.

You just stepped over the line.

When Obama visited injured troops, Republicans accused him of making that a photo opportunity. Any pictures taken were taken by Army photographers. Obama visited many more times but there was an attempt to keep them secret because of the sleazy and disgusting tactics of Republicans to politicise our soldiers.

A PERFECT EXAMPLE:

John McStain, at a town hall meeting repeatedly lying, saying he had a "perfect record" with Veterans groups when we knew they had given him a grade of D and a score of 20%. LIES, LIES, LIES. The same veterans groups gave Obama a grade of B and a score of 80%. But Obama didn't use that in his campaign because he didn't want to USE the soldiers. Republicans USE everybody.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AG77dI_ZSl8[/ame]

 

[amrchaos]

I've heard the Republicans claim over and over again they "kept the country safe". I can't figure out exactly what that means.

Some examples:

Republicans put at least 100,000 people into carcinogenic trailers after Katrina and then sat on the reports detailing why they were getting "sick".

FEMA Trailers for Katrina Victims Tainted by Toxic Chemical - ABC News

In 2007, a bridge collapsed during rush hour. This led to a report that at least 70,000 bridges in the US were a danger. What did Republicans do to alleviate this danger?

4 dead, 79 injured, 20 missing after dozens of vehicles plummet into river | StarTribune.com

More than 4000 young American patriots have been killed in Iraq. More than 30,000 injured or crippled. The Iraqis want us gone. A man who threw shoes at our president, one of the worst insults in Islam, became a "national hero" to the Iraqis. We are going bankrupt to rebuild a country that is now a religious theocracy by Constitution with Islam the "national religion" (Article 2) and want us gone. We have done nothing to help the million Christians who have been murdered or exiled.

40,000 Americans die each year because they have no health care. The Iraqis have the "public option" written into a constitution supported by American Republicans. See Article 31 and 32. What did Republicans do for health care here? Why do Republicans help the Iraqis, who don't even want help, but not the US?

Full Text of Iraqi Constitution - washingtonpost.com

Federal Spending Was on ‘Starvation Diet’ During Bush Years. That means the "infrastructure". Keeping roads and bridges and trains modern is very important to keeping Americans safe. Why nothing for the US? Don't we deserve a safe country?

CNSNews.com - Federal Spending Was on ‘Starvation Diet’ During Bush Years, Says Democratic Senator

So, I'm just trying to understand how Republicans kept America "safe". Throwing water at a "firecracker" when the house was burning was keeping us safe?

What are Republicans doing now to help "keep us safe"?

It is called political propaganda!

 

[rightwinger]

You have to understand what Republicans mean by safety..

It means after they allowed 3000 Americans to be killed in terrorist attacks that no foreign islamic terrorists attacked us on American soil.

It does not mean we were not attacked overseas or does not mean we were not attacked by domestic terrorists

 

[CrusaderFrank]

You have to understand what Republicans mean by safety..

It means after they allowed 3000 Americans to be killed in terrorist attacks that no foreign islamic terrorists attacked us on American soil.

It does not mean we were not attacked overseas or does not mean we were not attacked by domestic terrorists

You mean like Obama's friend and mentor William Ayers?

 

[rdean]

You have to understand what Republicans mean by safety..

It means after they allowed 3000 Americans to be killed in terrorist attacks that no foreign islamic terrorists attacked us on American soil.

It does not mean we were not attacked overseas or does not mean we were not attacked by domestic terrorists

You mean like Obama's friend and mentor William Ayers?

Friend and Mentor? Please put a link where Ayers said he "mentored" Obama.

I know you can't because none exists.

Ayers said he hardly knew Obama.

Ayers denied entry to Canada - Americas- msnbc.com

And why would Ayers say he hardly knew Obama? After all, he could write a book called, "I Mentored My Friend" and make a million.

The truth is they served on "different" boards on the "same" right wing Republican foundation. That means they rarely met unless it was at the same function. Only when all boards were present. Hardly "close".
Then Obama went to Ayers house for a fundraiser. Ayers himself said Obama went to 20 other houses that day.

The problem with you guys is you are dirty. You lie and your dirty. Your standards are so low that you support someone like Sarah Palin who actually does "pal" around with a domestic terrorist and is married to a secessionist.

The mistake the Republicans make are these spurious accusations. That causes the spotlight to be shifted back at them at some point, then we are shocked and surprised at how dirty they are.

Sarah Palin constantly going on about "paling around with terrorists". Even though Obama barely knew Ayers and was only 8 years old when Ayers was breaking the law. Unlike her palling around with her African Pastor who is an admitted Domestic Terrorist. He even tried to kill someone. How do we know? He proudly told us. Seems he had a vision that his intended victim was a "witch".

Then you have her regular Pasteur from the Wasilla Assembly of God, who actually preached that critics of Bush will go to hell; wondered whether people who voted for Kerry would go to heaven, and said that Jesus, how did he put it? Jesus "operated from that position of war."

I already pointed out McCain lying.

So if you guys want to bring up this "made up" controversy, fine, but we all know who actually lies. We all know who is dirty.

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

If you use the HOPE credit then you should KNOW that it isn't a fully refundable tax credit.

No, it isn't fully refundable, but it is better than nothing. Again, most people who would need the credit wouldn't pay enough in taxes anyway for it to be fully refundable.

Oh and the 50s which were one of the greatest decades for the US had FAR higher tax on the wealthy how do you reconcile that FACT with your claim that CUTTING taxes for the wealthy results in economic growth. You are LYING or flat out misinformed.

I am neither lying nor misinformed. As a matter of fact, I am almost finished with my MBA. For you to presume you actually know more about this subject than I do is patently ridiculous, yet amusing nonetheless. You are correct that our economy did very well in the 1950s even with some of the highest tax rates in American history. Your problem is that you don't know why and that's because you are unable to see the forest through the trees. You see, in the 1950s the Europeans were still on a long road to recovery after getting obliterated during the war. The USA was the primary manufacturer and exporter of just about everything: cars, textiles, you name it. In other words, we had no global competition. There was nothing else to buy other than American goods. As Europe began coming back online in the late 50s we began to slip into recession and that is why Kennedy cut the top tax rate, to spur economic growth.

Starting with Reagan the tax burden has been moved from the wealthiest 10% to the Federal DEBT!!! Since Reagan that national debt has EXPLODED, in fact, Reagan TRIPLED the national debt so he could give tax cuts and guess what they DIDN'T WORK!

Of course they worked. The mid to late 80s were thriving and carried on right through the 90s. Reagan was right to cut taxes. The U.S. was in a deep recession. Reagan piled on so much debt because of the Cold War. The Republicans will justify that as an acceptable reason for him to have increased the debt so much. I don't agree.

The FACT is that the ULTRA WEALTHY DON'T invest in their OWN COUNTRY or fellow citizens they send jobs overseas while counting their profits so I say FUCK THEM if they have no patriotism.

Of course they invest in their own country. If they didn't unemployment would be considerably higher than it is today. There are thousands of American based companies in which the wealthy invest in every single day, but you already knew that. You're simply engaging in hyperbole to try and strengthen your point. Sure there are companies that outsource overseas. That is a consequence of inevitable globalization. Just as the U.S moved away from being an agricultural economy into a manufacturing economy, it is now evolving into a more technology based economy. It's called progress. Those with the initiative and motivation will prepare themselves for it. The rest will be wasting their lives away in despair waiting for the 1950s to come back. Which group do you intend to be apart of?

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

Oh one more think Taz..........I have a house that I got through a zero down FHA program but I have lost my job and fear I will lose my home. We were qualified for 50% MORE home than we bought so we did NOT over extend or buy more house than we could afford but times change and now we may not be able to keep our home. I know it helps you sleep at night to believe that only those who took advantage of the system are losing their homes but that is a LIE. Heck I would be happy to repay the credit when things improve but the LAST thing that I or my neighbors need is ANOTHER for sale sign in the neighborhood.

I never said that only those who took advantage of the system are losing their homes. I said many of those mortgages should have never been made, but you already knew that. You're using a straw man to dishonestly bolster your argument.

I am going to go out on a limb here (yes, that's sarcasm) and assume you voted for the Big O. He was a big supporter of Bush's big banker bailout. That was supposed to keep people like you from losing your home. As you can see, it was all a bunch of bullshit. It was nothing but our Congress, both Democrat and Republican, using our tax dollars to keep the movers and shakers in business. You might want to think about that next time you walk into the voting booth.

 

[Dont Taz Me Bro]

It means after they allowed 3000 Americans to be killed in terrorist attacks that no foreign islamic terrorists attacked us on American soil.

The 9-11 attacks were a culmination of failures by both the Clinton administration and the Bush administration, but as they say, hindsight is 20/20. If it is fair to say that Bush allowed 3,000 Americans to be killed then it is fair to say that Obama has allowed this recession to greatly worsen and fester.

 

[Harry Dresden]

I've heard the Republicans claim over and over again they "kept the country safe". I can't figure out exactly what that means.

I think it's more than obvious that Republican are referring to the fact that we hadn't experienced any further terrorist attacks on U.S. soil since 9-11. I find it hard to believe that you "can't figure out exactly what that means."

Republicans put at least 100,000 people into carcinogenic trailers after Katrina and then sat on the reports detailing why they were getting "sick".

FEMA Trailers for Katrina Victims Tainted by Toxic Chemical - ABC News

This would have happened whether Bush was president or John Kerry or Al Gore had been president. FEMA is the perfect example of an inefficient government bureaucracy that no one should rely on to save their ass. Furthermore, mistakes at the state and local level also contributed to the number of people displaced by the hurricane.

I'm not sure why you're surprised this happened. I'm surprised when the government does something right.



This is neither a Republican nor Democrat problem. The State of Minnesota is responsible for maintaining its infrastructure and they dropped the ball. If you want to play partisan politics, however, the governor was a Republican and the state legislature was controlled by the Democrats. Pick your poison.



Unfortunately true, many lives lost for a wasted crusade. However, both Republicans and Democrats sent us into the war.



40,000 Americans dying for lack of health care, if that figure is true, is not the business of the Federal government. The only person responsible for obtaining your own health care is you. Stop making excuses for your failures and get off your ass and fix them (I mean "your" as in people in general, not literally you). Relying on the all powerful nanny government is how we ended up with those 100,000 hurricane victims living in tainted trailers.

Federal Spending Was on ‘Starvation Diet’ During Bush Years.

Quite the opposite, actually. Federal spending under Bush ballooned and the national debt doubled under his presidency.

What are Republicans doing now to help "keep us safe"?

Why are you relying so much on politicians for your safety? Certainly, they have responsibilities to keep this country safe when it comes to foreign enemies, but the best person to keep you and your family safe is you.

Taz meet Rdean......wait until you meet his power twin Zona.....

 

[Harry Dresden]

They wouldn't let me in.

most people lock the doors when they see you coming Dean.......