A Tale of Two Storms. $60 Billion in Fed Aid Within 10 Days

[Jarhead]

Here's some non disaster items in the Katrina bill:

* $33.2 million for eight projects in the state of Senate Energy and Water Appropriations Subcommittee Ranking Member Harry Reid (D-Nev.), including: $25 million for rural Nevada; $1.5 million for Truckee Meadows; and $725,000 for Tahoe Regional Planning

• $16.8 million for seven projects in the state of Senate Energy and Water Appropriations Subcommittee member Robert Byrd (D-W.Va.), including: $2.5 million for the Greenbrier River Basin; $325,000 for the Parkersburg and Vienna Riverfront Park; and $150,000 for Island Creek at Logan

• $12.9 million for 11 projects in the state of Senate Energy and Water Appropriations Subcommittee Chairman Pete Domenici (R-N.M.), including: $5 million for central New Mexico; $250,000 for Santa Fe; and $180,000 for the Southwest Valley, Albuquerque.

Lehigh Valley Clancularius Introspectives (LVCI): Sandy Relief Bill Full Of Pork?

Back then, members of congress did not run on a platform of cutting spending and reducing the debt.

Sorry if congress, this time around, wanted to do the right thing.

 

[Stephanie]

Here's some non disaster items in the Katrina bill:

* $33.2 million for eight projects in the state of Senate Energy and Water Appropriations Subcommittee Ranking Member Harry Reid (D-Nev.), including: $25 million for rural Nevada; $1.5 million for Truckee Meadows; and $725,000 for Tahoe Regional Planning

• $16.8 million for seven projects in the state of Senate Energy and Water Appropriations Subcommittee member Robert Byrd (D-W.Va.), including: $2.5 million for the Greenbrier River Basin; $325,000 for the Parkersburg and Vienna Riverfront Park; and $150,000 for Island Creek at Logan

• $12.9 million for 11 projects in the state of Senate Energy and Water Appropriations Subcommittee Chairman Pete Domenici (R-N.M.), including: $5 million for central New Mexico; $250,000 for Santa Fe; and $180,000 for the Southwest Valley, Albuquerque.

Lehigh Valley Clancularius Introspectives (LVCI): Sandy Relief Bill Full Of Pork?

Back then, members of congress did not run on a platform of cutting spending and reducing the debt.

Sorry if congress, this time around, wanted to do the right thing.

UNTIL the PEOPLE start holding these Congresscritters asses to fire they will never stop doing this..but as we see some say hey, it's only a few millions here and there. And as we see Christy is just ANOTHER politican who doesn't care about it either..he just wants to whine, where my money

 

[Seawytch]

Here's some non disaster items in the Katrina bill:

* $33.2 million for eight projects in the state of Senate Energy and Water Appropriations Subcommittee Ranking Member Harry Reid (D-Nev.), including: $25 million for rural Nevada; $1.5 million for Truckee Meadows; and $725,000 for Tahoe Regional Planning

• $16.8 million for seven projects in the state of Senate Energy and Water Appropriations Subcommittee member Robert Byrd (D-W.Va.), including: $2.5 million for the Greenbrier River Basin; $325,000 for the Parkersburg and Vienna Riverfront Park; and $150,000 for Island Creek at Logan

• $12.9 million for 11 projects in the state of Senate Energy and Water Appropriations Subcommittee Chairman Pete Domenici (R-N.M.), including: $5 million for central New Mexico; $250,000 for Santa Fe; and $180,000 for the Southwest Valley, Albuquerque.

Lehigh Valley Clancularius Introspectives (LVCI): Sandy Relief Bill Full Of Pork?

Back then, members of congress did not run on a platform of cutting spending and reducing the debt.

Sorry if congress, this time around, wanted to do the right thing.

Yeah, good spin. What it looks like on this end is Congress doing everything and anything to go against this President...even to the detriment of Americans.

 

[The Infidel]

Here's some non disaster items in the Katrina bill:

* $33.2 million for eight projects in the state of Senate Energy and Water Appropriations Subcommittee Ranking Member Harry Reid (D-Nev.), including: $25 million for rural Nevada; $1.5 million for Truckee Meadows; and $725,000 for Tahoe Regional Planning

• $16.8 million for seven projects in the state of Senate Energy and Water Appropriations Subcommittee member Robert Byrd (D-W.Va.), including: $2.5 million for the Greenbrier River Basin; $325,000 for the Parkersburg and Vienna Riverfront Park; and $150,000 for Island Creek at Logan

• $12.9 million for 11 projects in the state of Senate Energy and Water Appropriations Subcommittee Chairman Pete Domenici (R-N.M.), including: $5 million for central New Mexico; $250,000 for Santa Fe; and $180,000 for the Southwest Valley, Albuquerque.

Lehigh Valley Clancularius Introspectives (LVCI): Sandy Relief Bill Full Of Pork?

Back then, members of congress did not run on a platform of cutting spending and reducing the debt.

Sorry if congress, this time around, wanted to do the right thing.

Yeah, good spin. What it looks like on this end is Congress doing everything and anything to go against this President...even to the detriment of Americans.

You jackass, what about us not liking Pookie because he is half black??

You're slipping.

 

[Too Tall]

Is this some sort of knee jerk reaction because Bush was mentioned as the signor of the aid bill? This has nothing to do with either the current or former President, but about Congress approving aid for one hurricane within 10 days and still not having approved aid for another after 60.

Just a question that I don't know the answer too. How much money was included in the Katrina relief bill that was pork barrel spending? Apparently the Senate has put several billion dollars in the present bill that has nothing to do with Hurricane aid.

I suggest that the House of Representatives should take this pork out of the bill and send it back to the Senate for approval.

Show it. List the pork in the most recent bill that failed to pass Congress.

See post #70 for a few examples.

 

[Vast LWC]

Check your math....
That is all.

.5 billion (the total of the supposed "Pork" mentioned in the post I was responding to) is in fact less than 1% of 60 billion.
Math is correct.

$28 billion for future "disaster-mitigation" projects...

Stop lying dude!

Apparently you didn't fully read my post. I wasn't including said 28 billion dollars.

Fixing the damage without trying to prevent it from happening again would be retarded. Therefore "Disaster-mitigation" is not "pork".

 

[Vast LWC]

That has ZERO to do with getting the people back on their feet.

Shit, why stop at that dollar amount?
Why not $100 billion??

It has EVERYTHING to do with it.

Why the hell would you fix up the damage, only to have it happen again next year?

That would be the height of idiocy.

 

[Vast LWC]

I will say it again....

$28 billion for future "disaster-mitigation" projects!!!!

Here, I'll give you the line that you apparently missed:

Discounting, of course, the mitigation of future disasters, which clearly can not be included in any consideration of what is pork in this case.

 

[Vast LWC]

Evidently a lot of people believe this money grows on the magic money trees they have in the back of the white house..

Hey, what's a few million

No wonder we are in the trouble we are in..

No, it "grows" from taxpayers in New York and New Jersey.

Since they are continuously among the top 5 contributors in federal revenue, per capita, every year.

 

[Oldstyle]

There's millions of dollars that are earmarked for States that weren't even affected by Sandy, Vast...the majority of that money going to buy the votes of Republican Senators in States like Miss., Ala. and Texas. Trust me, I'm not saying some members of the GOP are just as guilty of this as Democrats. I hold them in even more contempt than their counterparts because they are "supposed" to be the fiscally responsible party and they are not!!!

You really couldn't find pork?

Examples of the billions slated to go other than those effected in New Jersey and Staten Island:

$28 billion for future "disaster-mitigation" projects.
$100 million for the repair of all 265 Head Start centers around the country.
$8 million (+) to buy cars and equipment for the Homeland Security and Justice departments.
$150 million for the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration to dole out to fisheries in Alaska.
$2 million for the Smithsonian Institution to repair museum roofs in Washington, D.C.
$207 million for the VA Manhattan Medical Center.
$41 million to fix up eight military bases along the storm's path, including Guantanamo Bay, Cuba.
$4 million for repairs at Kennedy Space Center in Florida.
$1.1 million to repair national cemeteries.

Finally, let's say everything you mentioned was in fact "pork", which is clearly not the case, but let's say it was.

Discounting, of course, the mitigation of future disasters, which clearly can not be included in any consideration of what is pork in this case.

That would be a total of:

$513 million dollars, out of 60 billion dollars or less than 1% of the whole, which is a hell of a lot less than the pork that was included in the Katrina relief aid, which was passed by the Republican-controlled Congress of the time in 10 days.

Of course, the damage from Katrina was in the South, a Republican stronghold, so they had no problem at all with any of THAT pork.

Come on, Vast...you really think 8 million dollars worth of Homeland Security and Justice Department cars and equipment were damaged in that hurricane?

You really think we need to spend 28 billion dollars on "disaster mitigation" projects?

I've been around long enough to recognize when government is blowing smoke up my ass with their budget requests...and something as vague as disaster mitigation projects means the bulk of that money is going to something other than mitigating disasters.

 

[Vast LWC]

Back then, members of congress did not run on a platform of cutting spending and reducing the debt.

Sorry if congress, this time around, wanted to do the right thing.

Which, conveniently, happens to be when Blue States need the aid.

Tell me, how many of the current Republican members of the house voted for the Katrina bill?

After all, it was only 7 years ago, and, thanks to district gerrymandering, turnover hasn't been very high. So there must be a significant number of Republicans still in the house that were there in 2005.

So:

When southern states are the ones getting the aid, Republicans pull out all the stops, ignore huge amounts of pork, and get it done in 10 days.

but...

When north-eastern states are getting aid, suddenly it's time to start screaming about the 1% of the funding that may or may not be pork.

Yeah, I think we all understand how this works now.

Thanks.

 

[Vast LWC]

Come on, Vast...you really think 8 million dollars worth of Homeland Security and Justice Department cars and equipment were damaged in that hurricane?

You really think we need to spend 28 billion dollars on "disaster mitigation" projects?

I've been around long enough to recognize when government is blowing smoke up my ass with their budget requests...and something as vague as disaster mitigation projects means the bulk of that money is going to something other than mitigating disasters.

Even if that is the case, that means that the correct response is to immediately present their own bill, removing those requests, and then present it to the Senate so a compromise can be reached as soon as possible.

Instead, we have 2 months of NOTHING.

 

[LogikAndReazon]

Clearly a case of racial hatred in katrina and hatred of progressives in the northeast. Always the victim. They deserve better. lol

 

[Vast LWC]

Clearly a case of racial hatred in katrina and hatred of progressives in the northeast. Always the victim. They deserve better. lol

Who's talking about "hatred"? I was referring to "selfishness".

 

[Oldstyle]

Come on, Vast...you really think 8 million dollars worth of Homeland Security and Justice Department cars and equipment were damaged in that hurricane?

You really think we need to spend 28 billion dollars on "disaster mitigation" projects?

I've been around long enough to recognize when government is blowing smoke up my ass with their budget requests...and something as vague as disaster mitigation projects means the bulk of that money is going to something other than mitigating disasters.

Even if that is the case, that means that the correct response is to immediately present their own bill, removing those requests, and then present it to the Senate so a compromise can be reached as soon as possible.

Instead, we have 2 months of NOTHING.

I think what you're going to see for the near future is just about any request to the House for funding is going to be a cue for many in the GOP to hold out for spending cuts elsewhere. The fact is...we're spending way too much and none of the leaders of the Democrats OR the Republicans is doing anything about it. Those who were sent to Washington by their constituents to cut spending are butting their heads against a brick wall of "inside the Beltway business as usual".

 

[Vast LWC]

I think what you're going to see for the near future is just about any request to the House for funding is going to be a cue for many in the GOP to hold out for spending cuts elsewhere. The fact is...we're spending way too much and none of the leaders of the Democrats OR the Republicans is doing anything about it. Those who were sent to Washington by their constituents to cut spending are butting their heads against a brick wall of "inside the Beltway business as usual".

The inability to act on the behalf of the constituency, when they are in dire need, is just as much of a clear sign of a BAD GOVERNMENT, as congress spending too much on frivolities.

But, really, what can one expect from the worst Congress in a century?

If you elect people to office that have an ideological hatred of all things government, you get bad government, just as if you elect people that think of government as their personal money trough you get bad government.

 

[Oldstyle]

I think what you're going to see for the near future is just about any request to the House for funding is going to be a cue for many in the GOP to hold out for spending cuts elsewhere. The fact is...we're spending way too much and none of the leaders of the Democrats OR the Republicans is doing anything about it. Those who were sent to Washington by their constituents to cut spending are butting their heads against a brick wall of "inside the Beltway business as usual".

The inability to act on the behalf of the constituency, when they are in dire need, is just as much of a clear sign of a BAD GOVERNMENT, as congress spending too much on frivolities.

But, really, what can one expect from the worst Congress in a century?

If you elect people to office that have an ideological hatred of all things government, you get bad government, just as if you elect people that think of government as their personal money trough you get bad government.

I don't think the people that are calling for spending cuts have an "ideological hatred of all things government", Vast. They have an ideological hatred of of bad government which we now have...but they were sent to Washington because their constituents are sick and tired of business as usual inside the Beltway and want this out of control spending to stop.

The fact of the matter is that our government is fundamentally unable to be fiscally responsible. That isn't a condemnation of one party either...it's a condemnation of both. Every single piece of legislation that goes through the House...the Senate...and the Oval Office is bloated and wasteful. They don't know any other way. It's disgusting to watch.

 

[auditor0007]

Is this some sort of knee jerk reaction because Bush was mentioned as the signor of the aid bill? This has nothing to do with either the current or former President, but about Congress approving aid for one hurricane within 10 days and still not having approved aid for another after 60.

It is just too difficult for them to keep on subject. You're confusing them with facts.

 

[Article 15]

Bush was a leader, love him or hate him, he could lead. Something sorely lacking in the current administration.

Please provide evidence that Bush had to whip Congress up to get them to approve a bill. The fact is that Bush didn't have anything to do with it.

You know, I take it back, it does have something to do with the President. The Republicans refuse to help American people because they hate this President. What other explanation is there to hold up disaster relief for over two months?

Pretty much this.

Tho I will add that Katrina happening in the GOP south and Sandy happening in the Dem northeast had something to do with it.

That, and Republicans are just in general the party of douchebags.

Republicans are fundamentally bad people and shit like this proves it.

 

[Pogo]

A tale of two storms?/

Yup. The State and local Govt dropped the ball on Katrina. Bush told that dumb assed Gov to declare it a disaster area three days before the storm hit. The moron didn't do it and in fact waffled about it even after the levis broke.

The State should have had a mandatory evacuation and forced everyone out. NO is 5 feet below sea level. Only a moron would have stayed. They had 250 school busses that could have taken loads out. Those same school busses got flooded out.

Bush and FEMA took the hit but the State and local Gov and that stupid Gov were to blame. Of course some will contunue to Blame Bush and FEMA but hey, its the lefty way.

You are utterly full of revisionist shit, and I told you this in the other thread.

The fact is Governor Blanco asked for federal assistance on Saturday August 27, as soon as it became clear the storm was coming. And Bush signed off. In other words they both did their jobs. Something you couldn't be bothered to do in anything like "research".

"...I have determined that this incident is of such severity and magnitude that effective response is beyond the capabilities of the State and affected local governments, and that supplementary Federal assistance is necessary to save lives, protect property, public health, and safety, or to lessen or avert the threat of a disaster. I am specifically requesting emergency protective measures, direct Federal Assistance, Individual and Household Program (IHP) assistance, Special Needs Program assistance, and debris removal. ... "In response to the situation I have taken appropriate action under State law and directed the execution of the State Emergency Plan on August 26, 2005 in accordance with Section 501 (a) of the Stafford Act. A State of Emergency has been issued for the State in order to support the evacuations of the coastal areas in accordance with our State Evacuation Plan."" -- Gov. Kathleen Blanco, August 27 ... that's two days before the storm. DUH.

By the way Governors don't declare disaster areas. Presidents do. - and they do that after the event. You can't do it before.

The blame has already been lain, officially, on the Army Corps of Engineers. If that doesn't fit your revisionist agenda that's just too god damn fucking bad.

I beg to differ with your "account", Pogo...if Governor Blanco had requested National Guard troops or Federal troops, order would have been kept in New Orleans but she failed to do so until well AFTER the storm hit. If she and Mayor Ray Nagle had ordered a mandatory evacuation two days in advance of the storm instead of 14 hours before Katrina made landfall a whole lot of people would be alive today that aren't. To maintain that Blanco "did her job" would be laughable if it weren't for all the people who suffered because she DIDN'T do her job.

I don't know where y'all pull these made-up stories from -- makeshitup.com? The history still is, and this hasn't changed, the evacuation was ordered two days before; the Gov ordered I-10 contraflowed on Saturday 8/27. That was the very day the path of the storm became certain; before that it was not known. About the National Guard, I think you're confusing an order for additional troops to be specifically assigned to New Orleans that day, as can be seen here:

On September 1, 2005, with reports of looting and lawlessness escalating, Governor Blanco announced she was sending 300 Louisiana National Guardsmen to supplement the New Orleans Police Department, saying, "These troops are fresh back from Iraq. They are well-trained, experienced, battle-tested and under my orders to restore order in the streets. These are some of the 40,000 extra troops that I have demanded. They have M-16s, and they're locked and loaded."

(Wiki - emphasis added) "Extra" troops, not first troops.

I ask again, he said to the chorus of crickets, what is the point of getting all hung up on mandatory evacuation orders? What does this have to do with Congress? Indeed what is the point of all this fixation on Kathleen Blanco at all? This is really simple: Warrior102 came up with the fabrication that the governor "abandoned the state", even referring to Blanco as "he", since he too is making it all up as he goes along. So I immediately corrected that on both counts. It's settled. It's been settled.

How is this stupid history revision relevant to this thread? Y'all don't bother to read these corrections anyway so wtf does which date which governor sent which National Guard troops where have to do with the topic at all? Smokescreen?

"Ray Nagle" You're making it up too. Y'all are embarrassing yourselves.

PS I should note, that post from Claudette you quoted? She came back after I corrected her too, and divulged that she had gone to Snopes overnight and found out I had it right and she had it wrong. She was big enough to come back the next day and admit that. So that post thread and the fabrications it started with is history now. She never did explain whence come these history revisions (smells like Beck spirit to me), nor have any of you explained how you think you can challenge eyewitness accounts with some blog you found on the internet seven years later.