A Take on Occupy Wall Street

[Katzndogz]

Gosh, golly, gee...maybe the tea partiers are just misunderstood. Just because they opened their very first national convention with a racist, xenophobe, Jim Crow tirade, greeted by wildly cheering tea partiers, we shouldn't read too much into that...

Ex-Congressman Tom Tancredo Racist Speech At Tea Party - YouTube

Calling Obama a 'socialist' is racist? Do tell, what can one call Obama that would not be racist? God? Lord? Savior? Anointed one? Pharaoh? King? Give us a clue here. It seems anyone who didn't vote for 0bama is racist. Now anyone who doesn't like him is racist as well.

Absolutely racist, but not because he called our President 'a committed socialist ideologue'. That is just a ball faced lie.

Educate your self on the Jim Crow era in America...

Not only was Tancredo's speech not racist but obama, who may be your president but not mine, is a committed socialist ideaologue. Then so are you so it is natural you would agree.

 

[Bfgrn]

Calling Obama a 'socialist' is racist? Do tell, what can one call Obama that would not be racist? God? Lord? Savior? Anointed one? Pharaoh? King? Give us a clue here. It seems anyone who didn't vote for 0bama is racist. Now anyone who doesn't like him is racist as well.

Absolutely racist, but not because he called our President 'a committed socialist ideologue'. That is just a ball faced lie.

Educate your self on the Jim Crow era in America...

Not only was Tancredo's speech not racist but obama, who may be your president but not mine, is a committed socialist ideaologue. Then so are you so it is natural you would agree.

Ignorance is not an excuse. My suggestion to educate yourself on the Jim Crow era goes unheeded.

“Bring back Jim Crow laws,” Tancredo tells Tea Party convention

GOPer Tom Tancredo suggests "literacy test" to protect America from presidents like Obama -- a segregation-era method employed by southern US states to keep blacks from voting.
February 5, 2010

The opening night speaker at the Tea Party convention suggested a return to a "literacy test" to protect America from presidents like Obama -- a segregation-era method employed by southern US states to keep blacks from voting.

In his speech Thursday to attendees, former Republican congressman Tom Tancredo invoked the loaded pre-civil rights era buzzword, saying that President Barack Obama was elected because "we do not have a civics, literacy test before people can vote in this country."

Southern states used literacy tests as part of an effort to deny suffrage to African American voters prior to Johnson-era civil rights laws.

"Prior to passage of the federal Voting Rights Act in 1965, Southern (and some Western) states maintained elaborate voter registration procedures whose primary purpose was to deny the vote to those who were not white," a website for civil rights veterans explains. "In the South, this process was often called the 'literacy test.' In fact, it was much more than a simple test, it was an entire complex system devoted to denying African-Americans (and in some regions, Latinos) the right to vote."
more

 

[Katzndogz]

Of course we should have a literacy test! We should always have had a literacy test. As opposed to unions and community organizers just telling people how to vote and who to vote for.

If you think that literacy tests mean blacks can't vote, that's pretty racist of you to keep saying that non-white people can't read. Because I am not a racist like yourself, I believe that non-whites are perfectly able to read.

 

[Sunshine]

Of course we should have a literacy test! We should always have had a literacy test. As opposed to unions and community organizers just telling people how to vote and who to vote for.

If you think that literacy tests mean blacks can't vote, that's pretty racist of you to keep saying that non-white people can't read. Because I am not a racist like yourself, I believe that non-whites are perfectly able to read.

If we had a literacy test, I wonder how many teachers woud not get to vote! Quite a few I'd guess.

 

[Katzndogz]

You really can't mean that in 55 years black people haven't learned to read do you? By any stretch that's pretty absurd not to mention distasteful.

 

[Katzndogz]

Of course we should have a literacy test! We should always have had a literacy test. As opposed to unions and community organizers just telling people how to vote and who to vote for.

If you think that literacy tests mean blacks can't vote, that's pretty racist of you to keep saying that non-white people can't read. Because I am not a racist like yourself, I believe that non-whites are perfectly able to read.

If we had a literacy test, I wonder how many teachers woud not get to vote! Quite a few I'd guess.

A year or so I read that more than 50% of California teachers were functionally illiterate. Although I believe that someone who is functionally illiterate can still be literate enough to pass a literacy test.

 

[Bfgrn]

Of course we should have a literacy test! We should always have had a literacy test. As opposed to unions and community organizers just telling people how to vote and who to vote for.

If you think that literacy tests mean blacks can't vote, that's pretty racist of you to keep saying that non-white people can't read. Because I am not a racist like yourself, I believe that non-whites are perfectly able to read.

AGAIN, you refuse to educate yourself, even when I do all the work of providing the information. Does your mommy know you are using her 'puter?

Excerpt I posted:

"In the South, this process was often called the 'literacy test.' In fact, it was much more than a simple test, it was an entire complex system devoted to denying African-Americans (and in some regions, Latinos) the right to vote."

I also embedded another link in the article that goes into detail...

a website for civil rights veterans explains.

 

[Charles_Main]

And yet when the Tea party started PEACEFULLY and for the sole purpose of utilizing the Constitutional right to vote, what exactly was your "feelings" then?

The same, in fact the Tea Party has every right and still does to this day to do the exact same. I don't see much difference between the two other than the issues they wish to be heard to be quite honest.

Really, so you see no difference between a group applying for Permits to Demonstrate and Holding Rallies, and a Group Occupying Public Places, Shitting on Cap Cars, and running around with signs like "Shut down Capitalism" and "If you don't give it, we can take it, we have the numbers"

Just 2 of the signs I saw in one Clip tonight alone.

You want to know the real difference between the Tea Party and OWS? I'll tell you, The Tea Party is a peaceful movement intent on Making change through Voting, The OWS is a group that can't get what they want at the Ballot Box, and is implying to us all right now that they can and will get violent if they do not get what they want.

 

[Katzndogz]

Of course we should have a literacy test! We should always have had a literacy test. As opposed to unions and community organizers just telling people how to vote and who to vote for.

If you think that literacy tests mean blacks can't vote, that's pretty racist of you to keep saying that non-white people can't read. Because I am not a racist like yourself, I believe that non-whites are perfectly able to read.

AGAIN, you refuse to educate yourself, even when I do all the work of providing the information. Does your mommy know you are using her 'puter?

Excerpt I posted:

"In the South, this process was often called the 'literacy test.' In fact, it was much more than a simple test, it was an entire complex system devoted to denying African-Americans (and in some regions, Latinos) the right to vote."

I also embedded another link in the article that goes into detail...

a website for civil rights veterans explains.

What you are doing is taking a practice of the past and conflating that with something we should have been doing right along. Just because the term "literacy test" was used to mean a complex system devoted to denying African Americans and Latinos the right to vote AT ONE TIME, doesn't mean the term "literacy test" can never mean what it is, a test to determine literacy.

 

[editec]

I believe that literacy testing isn't really such a bad idea.

Yeah yeah I know that means I'm a fascist.

But we presumably do not allow CHILDREN to vote because they aren't yet smart enough to vote, right?

So why do we let imbeciles vote when we KNOW many of them are less intelligent and less informed about national issues than some of our own ten year olds?

I don't expect MUCH from voters, but some bear minimum intelligence and some slightly informed POV doesn't seem like too much to ask from constituents.

 

[Cecilie1200]

The right to peaceably assemble will not survive the crime it has come to attract.

The right to peacefully assemble, like all rights has limits. Funny how the left adore this right NOW but complained bitterly about it when the right uses it.

Could someone point out a recent event where the right illegally took over a park, destroying it in the process, illegally blocked traffic and spent over a month in violation of the laws?

Right-wing extremists who question the legitimacy of Barack Obama’s presidency tried to take on local law enforcement recently — and they seem to have come out on the losing end.
Right-Wing Extremists Take On Local Law Enforcement, Lose | TPMMuckraker

Angry enough, in fact, for one TPer, Jim Canelos of Golden Valley, to be arrested for trespassing during a meeting, after his refusal to comply with the regulation (he donned an American flag hat while speaking at the podium during the meeting) and then a request to leave the premises.

The Tea Partiers are also upset over this particular county's passage last year of an ordinance prohibiting weapons on county property. In March 2010 Mervin Fried of Kingman, Arizona, was arrested after violating this ordinance by bringing a pitchfork into the county administration building.

I am always gratified to see Tea Party members devoting their energy to this sort of protest
Daily Kos: Arizona Tea Party Member Arrested While Protesting For His Rights - To Wear a Hat

Point is, people are going to express themselves in one way or the other and to say that every person be they Tea Party members or Occupy Wall street can be defined as left or right is somewhat of an over simplification much less, no one here knows what each and every person who is involved with those groups political leanings are. While it's well documented that for the most part the Tea Party is associated with the Republican Party, in each and every interview with members , they are just as critical to both sides and will tell you that they are NOT a left and right movement. As for Occupy Wall Street as they have yet to have a singular message other than the one I mentioned, the same things can be said for all the people there too. I was simply pointing out to exercise one's rights under the constitution is a good thing, not something to be shouted down or denegrated be it a Tea Party gathering, or Occupy Wall Street.

One, you're desperately reaching to try to excuse and legitimize the uncivilized behavior of this garbage. Two, you're wasting space on my screen trying to pretend the Internet blog trash you read constitutes any sort of real source. If you're going to link this shit, don't bother linking at all, because I think we can all guess without it that your "information" is so much diarrhea being spewed from someone's anus.

 

[Cecilie1200]

I'm sure it will, Tipsy. These rights have survived much more than Occupy Wall Street as well as many others and will continue to.

Let me clarify. The exercise of Occupy Wall Street's right to peaceably assemble will not survive the crime it has come to attract.

They are accomplishing nothing. They are getting ripped off, raped and assaulted. The free stuff they advertise will increase the number of criminals. Tired of a futile exercise that only causes loss, the protesters will find other things to do.

You know Tipsy, sadly in way I have to agree with you on one point, in the end they most likely will not accomplish much. I don't see them causing a rush of American companies as a result of these groups coming back to the United States to begin manufacturing here or much less a rapid change in the economic situation. Sadly, more often than not these groups OCW, the Tea Party and others original message is co-opted by every special interest group seeking to further an agenda and in the middle are the same people who have always been there and thats everyone else.

They're not going to accomplish ANYTHING, because they have no goals they're trying to accomplish or demands they want met. They're PROUD of having no goals. Everytime someone pops up and says, "THIS is what we want to achieve with this protest", the others shout him down and insist he doesn't represent the movement.

No wonder they're all such losers in real life, if they approach it with the same gormless lack of direction.

 

[Cecilie1200]

OWS seems to be wearing out its welcome.


They’re defecating on our doorsteps,” fumed board member Catherine Hughes, a stay-at-home mom who lives one block from the protest. “The cowbells start at 4 a.m. and the drumming goes past 10 a.m. A lot of people are very frustrated. A lot of people are concerned about the safety of our kids.”

Fed-up homeowners said they’ve been insulted and harassed as they trek to their jobs each morning. “The protesters taunt people who are on their way to work,” said James Fernandez, 51.



Read more: Zuccotti neighbors: Stop dumping on us - NYPOST.com

No doubt expressing contempt and hatred for the people who work will get the parasies a lot of sympathy and support.

This right here is the reason that mass protests are required to file for permits from the city first: to allow the city to make sure that the rights of others are not being infringed upon by it. Unfortunately, New York City seems to have abdicated its responsibility to its other citizens in this case.

 

[Cecilie1200]

Of course we should have a literacy test! We should always have had a literacy test. As opposed to unions and community organizers just telling people how to vote and who to vote for.

If you think that literacy tests mean blacks can't vote, that's pretty racist of you to keep saying that non-white people can't read. Because I am not a racist like yourself, I believe that non-whites are perfectly able to read.

AGAIN, you refuse to educate yourself, even when I do all the work of providing the information. Does your mommy know you are using her 'puter?

Excerpt I posted:

"In the South, this process was often called the 'literacy test.' In fact, it was much more than a simple test, it was an entire complex system devoted to denying African-Americans (and in some regions, Latinos) the right to vote."

I also embedded another link in the article that goes into detail...

a website for civil rights veterans explains.

In other words, the racist here assumes that black people are still as ignorant and uneducated now as they were right after slavery, and that blacks are the ONLY ignorant, uneducated people in the country, so if you dislike ignorant people, you obviously must hate blacks.

 

[Oldstyle]

I've been wathing these young people at Occupy Wall Street lately and while I don't know every single detail of what they seem to want from Wall Street, the very idea that they take the time to exercise rights given to them under the constitution and for the most part peacefully should be admired. We as Americans can disagree, and we seem to be doing an awful lot of that lately, but rights such as the right to assemble , free speech, and any other are rights that are daily defended all over the world by young men and women with their very lives and has been for this nations over 200 plus year history. these young people camp out there in the street because they feel that the opportunity that their fathers and grandfathers had is no longer available to them and in some way's they are right when you look at American companies that have laid off or fired over 2.9 Million Americans in the last 10 years and Hired 2.4 Million overseas according to the Dept. of Labor. That being said, while many of us may or may not agree on why they are there, they are exercising the same right's given under the same constitution that every American lives under and should love. While many may not agree with me here, I for one admire all those young people, for taking part in the very nation they live and while I may not agree with everything they stand for, they are exercising a right that many who wore a uniform to defend, and in a small way it gives me hope that this young generation loves the nation as much as all those who came before them.

I also believe that freedom of speech and the right to assemble are two of our most important rights as Americans, Navy. That being said...I don't find EVERY group that assembles and speaks to be worthy of admiration. You actually need to have an intelligent MESSAGE. The OWS crowd lost me when they started a deliberate campaign to force the New York City Police to arrest them so as to garner publicity for what could only be characterized as a "non-event". The OWS protesters had to go that route because they didn't have a coherent message nor did they have solutions to the problems they are so outraged about. Call me crazy but before you ask me to scrap a system that's worked reasonably well for hundreds of years...please give me a viable alternative.

At some point reasonably benign protests like the OWS's will morph into more violent protests like they are experiencing in Europe. Those will only serve to make a bad situation even worse.

 

[Bfgrn]

I believe that literacy testing isn't really such a bad idea.

Yeah yeah I know that means I'm a fascist.

But we presumably do not allow CHILDREN to vote because they aren't yet smart enough to vote, right?

So why do we let imbeciles vote when we KNOW many of them are less intelligent and less informed about national issues than some of our own ten year olds?

I don't expect MUCH from voters, but some bear minimum intelligence and some slightly informed POV doesn't seem like too much to ask from constituents.

No, it's not a bad idea, it is a horrible idea. Unless you believe voting is not a right.

It is ironic that conservatives who squeal for 'less government' in our lives, have NO problem asking for A LOT MORE government in the lives of people they want to ostracize, silence and censor.

WHO is going to administer this 'test'? WHO is going to grade this 'test'? WHO gets to render what people are worthy of this new PRIVILEGE to vote? WHO is going to pay for this 'test'? Do we create a new bureaucracy?

 

[Navy1960]

And yet when the Tea party started PEACEFULLY and for the sole purpose of utilizing the Constitutional right to vote, what exactly was your "feelings" then?

The same, in fact the Tea Party has every right and still does to this day to do the exact same. I don't see much difference between the two other than the issues they wish to be heard to be quite honest.

Really, so you see no difference between a group applying for Permits to Demonstrate and Holding Rallies, and a Group Occupying Public Places, Shitting on Cap Cars, and running around with signs like "Shut down Capitalism" and "If you don't give it, we can take it, we have the numbers"

Just 2 of the signs I saw in one Clip tonight alone.

You want to know the real difference between the Tea Party and OWS? I'll tell you, The Tea Party is a peaceful movement intent on Making change through Voting, The OWS is a group that can't get what they want at the Ballot Box, and is implying to us all right now that they can and will get violent if they do not get what they want.

No I don't in terms of what the original message is, for example,

Could all those populist pitchforks currently pointed at Washington be turned toward Wall Street instead?

That's the question that ought to worry Wall Street executives as they prepare to pay themselves nice bonuses this month, hard on the heels of a government bailout of the financial system, and amid continuing job losses around the rest of the country. Financial firms know they're in for heat on bonuses; they've already been chastised on national TV by President Barack Obama's chief economist.

The more searing heat, though, might come not from Washington's corridors of power but from the streets, where disjointed populist armies are starting to organize in the so-called tea-party movement.

It's a movement dominated for the moment by mistrust of big government and big government health-care plans. But it's also animated by mistrust of big institutions in general, and a tendency to see those institutions secretly working in tandem to the detriment of the little guy. So it's a short leap from anger at Washington's spending of taxpayer dollars to anger at Wall Street executives saved by those same taxpayer dollars -- and then taking home big bonus checks
No Seat for Wall Street at Tea Party - WSJ.com

U.S. Capitol Police arrested 10 people this afternoon after the Capitol Hill Tea Party crowd stormed Congressional office buildings.

Sgt. Kimberly Schneider, public information office for the Capitol Police, told TPMDC the arrests happened in the Cannon House building as tea partiers attempted to protest Speaker Nancy Pelosi about health care
Strange Scene: 10 Arrested As Tea Partiers Heckle Police | TPMDC

The point is that OWS and the Tea Party both have no moral high ground here. My point is that both these groups share a common theme when it comes to Wall Street and as hard as that is for some Tea Party members to hear, it is in fact true based on everything I have ever seen the Tea Party Stands for as well as what most of these kids at OWS are saying. As for the peaceful means through voting, etc. I am convinced that the power of the people lay in the ballot box, however if the contention here is that OWS is promoting something beyond that and the Tea Party is not, the perhaps I have misread some of the signs then that both sides have shown up to various demonstrations with.

 

[Navy1960]

The right to peacefully assemble, like all rights has limits. Funny how the left adore this right NOW but complained bitterly about it when the right uses it.

Could someone point out a recent event where the right illegally took over a park, destroying it in the process, illegally blocked traffic and spent over a month in violation of the laws?

Right-wing extremists who question the legitimacy of Barack Obama’s presidency tried to take on local law enforcement recently — and they seem to have come out on the losing end.
Right-Wing Extremists Take On Local Law Enforcement, Lose | TPMMuckraker

Angry enough, in fact, for one TPer, Jim Canelos of Golden Valley, to be arrested for trespassing during a meeting, after his refusal to comply with the regulation (he donned an American flag hat while speaking at the podium during the meeting) and then a request to leave the premises.

The Tea Partiers are also upset over this particular county's passage last year of an ordinance prohibiting weapons on county property. In March 2010 Mervin Fried of Kingman, Arizona, was arrested after violating this ordinance by bringing a pitchfork into the county administration building.

I am always gratified to see Tea Party members devoting their energy to this sort of protest
Daily Kos: Arizona Tea Party Member Arrested While Protesting For His Rights - To Wear a Hat

Point is, people are going to express themselves in one way or the other and to say that every person be they Tea Party members or Occupy Wall street can be defined as left or right is somewhat of an over simplification much less, no one here knows what each and every person who is involved with those groups political leanings are. While it's well documented that for the most part the Tea Party is associated with the Republican Party, in each and every interview with members , they are just as critical to both sides and will tell you that they are NOT a left and right movement. As for Occupy Wall Street as they have yet to have a singular message other than the one I mentioned, the same things can be said for all the people there too. I was simply pointing out to exercise one's rights under the constitution is a good thing, not something to be shouted down or denegrated be it a Tea Party gathering, or Occupy Wall Street.

One, you're desperately reaching to try to excuse and legitimize the uncivilized behavior of this garbage. Two, you're wasting space on my screen trying to pretend the Internet blog trash you read constitutes any sort of real source. If you're going to link this shit, don't bother linking at all, because I think we can all guess without it that your "information" is so much diarrhea being spewed from someone's anus.

Then as a suggestion, don't read it.

 

[California Girl]

The right to peaceably assemble will not survive the crime it has come to attract.

The right to peacefully assemble, like all rights has limits. Funny how the left adore this right NOW but complained bitterly about it when the right uses it.

Could someone point out a recent event where the right illegally took over a park, destroying it in the process, illegally blocked traffic and spent over a month in violation of the laws?

Right-wing extremists who question the legitimacy of Barack Obama’s presidency tried to take on local law enforcement recently — and they seem to have come out on the losing end.
Right-Wing Extremists Take On Local Law Enforcement, Lose | TPMMuckraker

Angry enough, in fact, for one TPer, Jim Canelos of Golden Valley, to be arrested for trespassing during a meeting, after his refusal to comply with the regulation (he donned an American flag hat while speaking at the podium during the meeting) and then a request to leave the premises.

The Tea Partiers are also upset over this particular county's passage last year of an ordinance prohibiting weapons on county property. In March 2010 Mervin Fried of Kingman, Arizona, was arrested after violating this ordinance by bringing a pitchfork into the county administration building.

I am always gratified to see Tea Party members devoting their energy to this sort of protest
Daily Kos: Arizona Tea Party Member Arrested While Protesting For His Rights - To Wear a Hat

Point is, people are going to express themselves in one way or the other and to say that every person be they Tea Party members or Occupy Wall street can be defined as left or right is somewhat of an over simplification much less, no one here knows what each and every person who is involved with those groups political leanings are. While it's well documented that for the most part the Tea Party is associated with the Republican Party, in each and every interview with members , they are just as critical to both sides and will tell you that they are NOT a left and right movement. As for Occupy Wall Street as they have yet to have a singular message other than the one I mentioned, the same things can be said for all the people there too. I was simply pointing out to exercise one's rights under the constitution is a good thing, not something to be shouted down or denegrated be it a Tea Party gathering, or Occupy Wall Street.

With respect, Navy (and you know I do totally respect you), taking an opinion from the media is a high road to hell. Generally, the media are, these days, pushing their own agenda within their reporting. I find it wise to interrogate the source - particularly when using the media as 'evidence'.

 

[Navy1960]

I've been wathing these young people at Occupy Wall Street lately and while I don't know every single detail of what they seem to want from Wall Street, the very idea that they take the time to exercise rights given to them under the constitution and for the most part peacefully should be admired. We as Americans can disagree, and we seem to be doing an awful lot of that lately, but rights such as the right to assemble , free speech, and any other are rights that are daily defended all over the world by young men and women with their very lives and has been for this nations over 200 plus year history. these young people camp out there in the street because they feel that the opportunity that their fathers and grandfathers had is no longer available to them and in some way's they are right when you look at American companies that have laid off or fired over 2.9 Million Americans in the last 10 years and Hired 2.4 Million overseas according to the Dept. of Labor. That being said, while many of us may or may not agree on why they are there, they are exercising the same right's given under the same constitution that every American lives under and should love. While many may not agree with me here, I for one admire all those young people, for taking part in the very nation they live and while I may not agree with everything they stand for, they are exercising a right that many who wore a uniform to defend, and in a small way it gives me hope that this young generation loves the nation as much as all those who came before them.

I also believe that freedom of speech and the right to assemble are two of our most important rights as Americans, Navy. That being said...I don't find EVERY group that assembles and speaks to be worthy of admiration. You actually need to have an intelligent MESSAGE. The OWS crowd lost me when they started a deliberate campaign to force the New York City Police to arrest them so as to garner publicity for what could only be characterized as a "non-event". The OWS protesters had to go that route because they didn't have a coherent message nor did they have solutions to the problems they are so outraged about. Call me crazy but before you ask me to scrap a system that's worked reasonably well for hundreds of years...please give me a viable alternative.

At some point reasonably benign protests like the OWS's will morph into more violent protests like they are experiencing in Europe. Those will only serve to make a bad situation even worse.

While I agree completely and have stated as much many times in this thread that these kids do not seem to have a coherent message and like other movements of this sort they do seem to attract every group that wishes to express a message. However that does not change my original message in that these young people for the most part as expressing themselves and exercising rights hard won and as such in doing so they have my admiration. Again, while I may not agree with the methods of some if it sparks a conversation of American Jobs then perhaps it may be worthwhile.

I personally cannot see, these protests becomming anywhere near as bad as those in Europe , for the primary reason is this nation police have a lower tolerence for such nonsense than they do in Europe and if the past is any guage such as those in Denver, Seattle, Chicago, etc. then these protests would be quickly put down.

As to "capitalism" in general, which seems to be the message for some at OWS, yes, it is a economic system that our nation has had for most of its history and there is not doubt that it is implied but not written in the constitution that the means of prodution is privately owned in this country even thought the word capitalism does not appear anywhere in the constitution. However I will point out that the word "people" does many times over, and while some may deny it, our nation has also had a mix of socialism mixed in with that, i.e. Social Security, Medicare, etc . etc. I for one am not advocating ridding this nation of a system that has worked for this nation, however I would advocate for reforms that would for example provide American more opportunities than do appear to have today.