A serious question about Jewish history

[AmyNation]

A reminder of CDZ rules....Civil discourse is the focus here, regardless of topic matter. Constructive criticism and debate is the tone. No negative repping. No insulting, name calling, or putting down other posters. Consider it a lesson in Civics.

 

[CMike]

According to the Bible, since they are God's chosen people, it is a simple case of disobedience, actions to open the Jew's eyes, and the disbursement of the tribes in order to preserve the tribes, as God promised Abraham. < That particular promise is a generational one.
Had Hitler been able to get his hands on every Jew, he would have killed every Jew.
God disbursed them and God will bring them all home.
Christ, the Rabbi, will rule and reign from His home, Jerusalem.
and:

Genesis 11:1
And the whole earth was of one language, and of one speech

"For then will I turn to the people a pure language, that they may all call upon the Name of Yahweh, to serve him with one consent," Zephaniah 3:9.

Got Hebrew Rosetta Stone?

That may be your vatican. Jerusalem belongs to the jews.

 

[ima]

Staying on topic.......

The OP asks a question, "Why so much hatred towards the Jews"?

Jews claim it is because of envy, different clothes, different religion and dietary habits, usury, and accusations of being the killers of Jesus.

While others say it's because they are seditious and underhanded in their financial dealings. And work non stop to destroy their host countries morals and values.

So it boils down as to who are the true "victims"?

The jews?...... or the gentiles that allow them to reside in their country??.........

Why don't you tell us why muslims hate jews so much? I'd be curious to know.

 

[oldfart]

My favorite hobby is reading history. I think that a large part of the explanation is that early Israelites and later Jews were not persecuted more than many other ethnic groups, but they possessed the twin characteristics of recording and transmitting their history and surviving to keep their culture and history alive. For example, the history of the native inhabitants of the Western Hemisphere is primarily a gruesome tale of enslavement, genocide, and exploitation on a scale hard to comprehend. The Spanish effort to destroy all writings and culture of the "heathens" left little for later generations to interpret. Only a handful of Mayan codices survive.

That the same did not happen to Talmud is a tribute to the dispersion and tenacity of Jewish scholars in maintaining a culture over centuries while many others disappeared and were forgotten.

You see, we only pay attention to the history of the survivors.

 

[ima]

^^^^

C'mon, we'd all like to know why muslims hate jews so much. Islam the religion of peace and all that...

 

[AmyNation]

Muslims don't hate Jews. There are a lot of Muslims in the world, and making broad brush statements about all of them is silly.

 

[ima]

Muslims don't hate Jews. There are a lot of Muslims in the world, and making broad brush statements about all of them is silly.

Must be why we see so many muslims marrying jews.

 

[AmyNation]

Muslims don't hate Jews. There are a lot of Muslims in the world, and making broad brush statements about all of them is silly.

Must be why we see so many muslims marrying jews.

People who are take their religion very seriously rarely marry someone of a different faith.

 

[Coyote]

Reminder: The topic is "A serious question about Jewish history"

It's not about Muslims hating Jews, it's not about Jews hating Muslims, it's not about whether Jews or Gentiles are "victims" of each other.

So...lets try to stay on topic because straying to far will probably end up breaking CDZ rules with the extreme emotions that result.

 

[Sunni Man]

The hatred towards the Jews throughout history didn't happen in a vacuum.

It was a product of cause and effect.

Obviously something about the jews demeanor or behavior brought out intense animosity towards them..........

 

[Coyote]

The hatred towards the Jews throughout history didn't happen in a vacuum.

It was a product of cause and effect.

Obviously something about the jews demeanor or behavior brought out intense animosity towards them..........

Not necessarily.

It's often a combination of factors that may not have a legitimate basis.

For example - historically - you have a myth perpetrated through out Christian history that Jews killed Christ. Christianity arose as one of the dominant world religions and got to control the narrative in most of the civilized world. In addition, church and state were the same.

Once a myth becomes accepted popular "truth" it's extremely difficult to dispell.

It doesn't help that Jews had a reputation for keeping to themselves in their own enclaves (and, of course, the laws of many countries severely restricted where they could live, whether they could buy land (usually not), and what occupations they could work at encouraged that insularity and prevented assimilation). When you have a group like that, a minority - it's easy to scapegoat them, to label them secretive and sinister and spin concpiracy theories. Since most occupations were barred to Jews, many functioned as money lenders, an occupation that is often viewed as disreputable or immoral and fuels more hate. And every society needs a scapegoat.

 

[editec]

The premise that Jews were hated through out history is a tad overstated.

 

[Sunni Man]

I don't buy the scapegoat or the christ killer theory.

Dozens of countries have expelled the jews and not all were christian.

Some were pagan, muslim, and other religion based........

 

[Coyote]

The premise that Jews were hated through out history is a tad overstated.

That is true...and for large periods of history they got along fine with Islam - the two faiths have a lot in common.

I think some of the "hate" has to do with conversions - both Islam and Christianity allow it and have forced it on other religions such as with Jews who typically have resisted.

 

[Coyote]

I don't buy the scapegoat or the christ killer theory.

Dozens of countries have expelled the jews and not all were christian.

Some were pagan, muslim, and other religion based........

I think the Christ killer was part of it - I think another part had to do with conversions. At different times in history - Christian countries expelled Jews and Muslims and likewise, Islamic countries expelled Jews and Christians - it wasn't just Jews. But Jews never had a country where they were the dominant religion that they could go to. I don't know about other religions - I haven't seen any references to them.

 

[Sunni Man]

I don't buy the scapegoat or the christ killer theory.

Dozens of countries have expelled the jews and not all were christian.

Some were pagan, muslim, and other religion based........

I think the Christ killer was part of it - I think another part had to do with conversions. At different times in history - Christian countries expelled Jews and Muslims and likewise, Islamic countries expelled Jews and Christians - it wasn't just Jews. But Jews never had a country where they were the dominant religion that they could go to. I don't know about other religions - I haven't seen any references to them.

Christian countries have expelled muslims and jews for centuries.

But there was never an official expulsion of christians or jews from any muslim country.

If fact, most jews left arab lands only after the establishment of the state of Israel in1948

 

[ima]

The hatred towards the Jews throughout history didn't happen in a vacuum.

It was a product of cause and effect.

Obviously something about the jews demeanor or behavior brought out intense animosity towards them..........

So what is it about Jews that you hate so much? Maybe that will illuminate why they've been so hated throughout history as you claim, because I don't see it. I see you singling out Jews as usual. Plenty of people/religions/races have been "hated" as you say by others. .

 

[Coyote]

I don't buy the scapegoat or the christ killer theory.

Dozens of countries have expelled the jews and not all were christian.

Some were pagan, muslim, and other religion based........

I think the Christ killer was part of it - I think another part had to do with conversions. At different times in history - Christian countries expelled Jews and Muslims and likewise, Islamic countries expelled Jews and Christians - it wasn't just Jews. But Jews never had a country where they were the dominant religion that they could go to. I don't know about other religions - I haven't seen any references to them.

Christian countries have expelled muslims and jews for centuries.

But there was never an official expulsion of christians or jews from any muslim country.

What's "official" - sometimes a de-facto expulsion is no different than an "official" one - for example, in wikipedia:

With the November 1947 declaration of United Nations Partition Plan for Palestine, severe anti-Jewish pogroms with massive casualties erupted across the Arab World. Arab pogroms against Jews in Aden and Syria were particularly violent.[citation needed] The violence prompted a severe increase in Jewish exodus, with the Aleppo Jewish community deteriorating into decline and soon after the pogrom half the city's Jewish population had left.[20] In 1948, the violence had spread to Egypt, Morocco and Iraq as well, practically covering all Arab countries.[citation needed] At the same time, independent Arab countries began to encourage Jewish emigration to Israel.[21][22][23]

In Libya, Jews were deprived of citizenship, and in Iraq, their property was seized. Those Jews who were forced to emigrate were not allowed to take their property. From 1948 to 1949, the Israeli government secretly airlifted 50,000 Jews from Yemen and from 1950 to 1952, 130,000 Jews were airlifted from Iraq. From 1949 to 1951, 30,000 Jews fled Libya to Israel. In these cases over 90% of the Jewish population opted to leave, despite the necessity of leaving their property behind.[24]

In total it is estimated that 800,000 to 1,000,000 Jews were forced out or fled from their homes in Arab countries from 1948 until the early 1970s. Some place the emigration peak to a slightly earlier time window of 1944 to 1964, when some 700,000 Jews moved to Israel from Arab countries and were dispossessed of nearly their entire property.[25]

A body representing the Jewish refugees, the World Organization of Jews from Arab Countries (WOJAC) estimated in 2006, that Jewish property abandoned in Arab countries would be valued at more than $100 billion, later revising their estimate in 2007 to $300 billion. They also estimated Jewish-owned real-estate left behind in Arab lands at 100,000 square kilometers (four times the size of the state of Israel).[3][9][26][27] estimated by Sidney Zabludoff to be at minimum $700 million in period prices and $6 billion today.[9] The organization asserts that a major cause of the Jewish exodus was a deliberate policy decision taken by the Arab League.[28] In 2007, a Jewish advocacy group JJAC (Justice for Jews from Arab Countries) has too alleged that Arab League members formulated a coordinated policy to expel or force the departure of the Jewish population.[29][30][31]

and

Middle Ages


During early Islam, Leon Poliakov writes, Jews enjoyed great privileges, and their communities prospered. There was no legislation or social barriers preventing them from conducting commercial activities. Many Jews migrated to areas newly conquered by Muslims and established communities there. The vizier of Baghdad entrusted his capital with Jewish bankers. The Jews were put in charge of certain parts of maritime and slave trade. Siraf, the principal port of the caliphate in the 10th century, had a Jewish governor.[11]

Since the 11th century, there have been instances of pogroms against Jews.[12] Examples include the 1066 Granada massacre, the razing of the entire Jewish quarter in the Andalucian city of Granada.[13] In North Africa, there were cases of violence against Jews in the Middle Ages,[14] and in other Arab lands including Egypt,[15] Syria.[16] and Yemen[17] Jewish population was confined to segregated quarters, or mellahs, in Morocco beginning from the 15th century. In cities, a mellah was surrounded by a wall with a fortified gateway. In contrast, rural mellahs were separate villages inhabited solely by the Jews.[18]

The Almohads, who had taken control of much of Islamic Iberia by 1172, were far more fundamentalist in outlook than the Almoravides, and they treated the dhimmis harshly. Jews and Christians were expelled from Morocco and Islamic Spain.[19] Faced with the choice of either death or conversion, some Jews, such as the family of Maimonides, fled south and east to the more tolerant Muslim lands, while others went northward to settle in the growing Christian kingdoms.[20][21]

In 1465, Arab mobs in Fez slaughtered thousands of Jews, leaving only 11 alive, after a Jewish deputy vizier treated a Muslim woman in an offensive manner. The killings touched off a wave of similar massacres throughout Morocco.[22][23]

If fact, most jews left arab lands only after the establishment of the state of Israel in1948

That's partly due to the expulsions don't you think?

 

[Indofred]

Tell me about it.
I wanted a serious discussion about hate of a group over a couple of thousand years and nothing to do with the last hundred or so.
History often supplies clues or solutions to modern problems but, some people hate so much, they aren't interested in understanding, just hate, misery and killing.

Just in case anyone isn't clear:
I dislike Israel's government but have no problem with ANY religious group at all, including Jews.
After all, why should I? Jews are guilty of nothing, only some Jews are guilty of some things. Pretty much the same applies to Muslims and every other religious group.
So many in each group deny or excuse the idiot end of our own people because they just want hate to continue.
South Africa had The Truth and Reconciliation Commission after their daft period of history.
Perhaps a group of us on here could start out own.

However, some sparks of intelligence have lightened up the darkness that this thread has become and it's possible there may be a start.

I'm pretty sure the mods are keeping an eye on this thread so, with that in mind, I would request offenders are stopped by whatever means so the thread be allowed to develop in the way I'd hoped.

 

[ima]

Tell me about it.
I wanted a serious discussion about hate of a group over a couple of thousand years and nothing to do with the last hundred or so.
History often supplies clues or solutions to modern problems but, some people hate so much, they aren't interested in understanding, just hate, misery and killing.

Just in case anyone isn't clear:
I dislike Israel's government but have no problem with ANY religious group at all, including Jews.
After all, why should I? Jews are guilty of nothing, only some Jews are guilty of some things. Pretty much the same applies to Muslims and every other religious group.
So many in each group deny or excuse the idiot end of our own people because they just want hate to continue.
South Africa had The Truth and Reconciliation Commission after their daft period of history.
Perhaps a group of us on here could start out own.

However, some sparks of intelligence have lightened up the darkness that this thread has become and it's possible there may be a start.

I'm pretty sure the mods are keeping an eye on this thread so, with that in mind, I would request offenders are stopped by whatever means so the thread be allowed to develop in the way I'd hoped.

Fred, it's pretty simple, they've been "hated" because they've always been a minority wherever they were. As is almost every minority everywhere, like I said, nothing exceptional over Jews being hated. Every country has its hated minorities, in the US, it's muslims, used to be beaners, before that used to be blacks, before that used to be indians.