A Rational Discussion of the Federal Budget

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Jul 1, 2011
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excellent look at one aspect of the budget... entitlements like Medicare.

A Rational Discussion of the Federal Budget | RealClearPolitics

For those of us who like to believe that human beings are rational, trying to explain what happens in politics can be a real challenge.

For example, that segment of the population that has the least to fear from a reform of Medicare or Social Security is the most fearful -- namely, those already receiving Medicare or Social Security benefits.

It is understandable that people heavily dependent on these programs would fear losing their benefits, especially after a lifetime of paying into these programs. But nobody in his right mind has even proposed taking away the benefits of those who are already receiving them.

Let's stop and think, if only for the novelty of it. If you make any change in anything, you are ending it "as we know it." Does that mean that everything in the status quo should be considered to be set in concrete forever?

If there were not a single Republican, or none who got elected to any office, arithmetic would still end "Medicare as we know it," for the simple reason that the money in the till is not enough to keep paying for it. The same is true of Social Security.

We are not yet Greece, but we are not exempt from the same rules of arithmetic that eventually caught up with Greece. We just have a little more time. The only question is whether we will use that time to make politically difficult changes or whether we will just kick the can down the road, and keep pretending that "Medicare as we know it" would continue on indefinitely, if it were not for people who just want to be mean to the elderly.

It is today's young people who are going to be left holding the bag when they reach retirement age and discover that all the money they paid in is long gone. It is today's young people who are going to be dumped over a cliff when they reach retirement age, if nothing is done to reform entitlements.
 
Hmmm, look at that. A half page article with the lofty claim of being "A Rational Discussion of the Federal Budget" that does not utter a syllable about defense spending.

Let's stop and think, if only for the novelty of it. If you make any change in anything, you are ending it "as we know it."

That's the Democratic spin for Republican plans.

When a Democrat wants to change anything, then it becomes, according to Republicans, a "government takeover".

:lol:
.
 
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Hmmm, look at that. A half page article with the lofty claim of being "A Rational Discussion of the Federal Budget" that does not utter a syllable about defense spending.

Let's stop and think, if only for the novelty of it. If you make any change in anything, you are ending it "as we know it."

That's the Democratic spin for Republican plans.

When a Democrat wants to change anything, then it becomes a "government takeover".

:lol:
.

you missed my comments then...

excellent look at one aspect of the budget... entitlements like Medicare.
 
No question that both Medicare and Social Security need to be fixed. The question is....Do we need a major revamp of both programs or merely a change in the contributions and benefits?

Republicans seem to be going for the nuclear option in using current insolvency as a justification to privatize both programs. Social Security needs a change in the retirement eligibility date (70 vs 67) to regain solvency.

Medicare is more difficult. Insurance companies do not want to insure old people. They never have and never will. Old people are the ones who use most of our medical dollar. They are also the ones most afraid of being bankrupted and pennyless after a major illness. Vouchers may work short term. The risk is in vouchers not keeping up with escallating medical costs and leaving the elderly at risk of financial ruin.

The answer seems to be more in attacking the medical cost aspects of the formula rather than the insurance part
 
No question that both Medicare and Social Security need to be fixed. The question is....Do we need a major revamp of both programs or merely a change in the contributions and benefits?

Republicans seem to be going for the nuclear option in using current insolvency as a justification to privatize both programs. Social Security needs a change in the retirement eligibility date (70 vs 67) to regain solvency.

Medicare is more difficult. Insurance companies do not want to insure old people. They never have and never will. Old people are the ones who use most of our medical dollar. They are also the ones most afraid of being bankrupted and pennyless after a major illness. Vouchers may work short term. The risk is in vouchers not keeping up with escallating medical costs and leaving the elderly at risk of financial ruin.

The answer seems to be more in attacking the medical cost aspects of the formula rather than the insurance part

I do not completely disagree with your comments.

:)
 
Hmmm, look at that. A half page article with the lofty claim of being "A Rational Discussion of the Federal Budget" that does not utter a syllable about defense spending....

BTW, for what it's worth, I am on record on this board as stating that were I elected President, one of my first objectives would be tpo get a comprehensive list of EVERY military facility, base, etc. we have around the world, and determine if we could reduce or eliminate presence in various areas without affecting the stability of the area or our ability to defend ourselves. I am relatively sure we could drop a minimum of 20% of our defense budget by looking into this.
 
No question that both Medicare and Social Security need to be fixed. The question is....Do we need a major revamp of both programs or merely a change in the contributions and benefits?

Republicans seem to be going for the nuclear option in using current insolvency as a justification to privatize both programs. Social Security needs a change in the retirement eligibility date (70 vs 67) to regain solvency.

Medicare is more difficult. Insurance companies do not want to insure old people. They never have and never will. Old people are the ones who use most of our medical dollar. They are also the ones most afraid of being bankrupted and pennyless after a major illness. Vouchers may work short term. The risk is in vouchers not keeping up with escallating medical costs and leaving the elderly at risk of financial ruin.

The answer seems to be more in attacking the medical cost aspects of the formula rather than the insurance part

This is correct. We are living longer and should therefore be working longer. And any reform must have cost reduction as its PRIMARY goal.

ObamaCare was a classic bait-and-switch con game. Remember all that talk about the per capita spending on medical care in the US? Healthcare "reform" was supposed to be about bending the cost curve down.

That was the bait.

The switch was ObamaCare. It does nothing to bend the cost curve down at all. In fact, it entrenches systems which will continue to bend the curve up, and then some.


.
 
Hmmm, look at that. A half page article with the lofty claim of being "A Rational Discussion of the Federal Budget" that does not utter a syllable about defense spending....

BTW, for what it's worth, I am on record on this board as stating that were I elected President, one of my first objectives would be tpo get a comprehensive list of EVERY military facility, base, etc. we have around the world, and determine if we could reduce or eliminate presence in various areas without affecting the stability of the area or our ability to defend ourselves. I am relatively sure we could drop a minimum of 20% of our defense budget by looking into this.

Rational indeed

:clap2:
 
excellent look at one aspect of the budget... entitlements like Medicare.

A Rational Discussion of the Federal Budget | RealClearPolitics

For those of us who like to believe that human beings are rational, trying to explain what happens in politics can be a real challenge.

For example, that segment of the population that has the least to fear from a reform of Medicare or Social Security is the most fearful -- namely, those already receiving Medicare or Social Security benefits.

It is understandable that people heavily dependent on these programs would fear losing their benefits, especially after a lifetime of paying into these programs. But nobody in his right mind has even proposed taking away the benefits of those who are already receiving them.

Let's stop and think, if only for the novelty of it. If you make any change in anything, you are ending it "as we know it." Does that mean that everything in the status quo should be considered to be set in concrete forever?

If there were not a single Republican, or none who got elected to any office, arithmetic would still end "Medicare as we know it," for the simple reason that the money in the till is not enough to keep paying for it. The same is true of Social Security.

We are not yet Greece, but we are not exempt from the same rules of arithmetic that eventually caught up with Greece. We just have a little more time. The only question is whether we will use that time to make politically difficult changes or whether we will just kick the can down the road, and keep pretending that "Medicare as we know it" would continue on indefinitely, if it were not for people who just want to be mean to the elderly.

It is today's young people who are going to be left holding the bag when they reach retirement age and discover that all the money they paid in is long gone. It is today's young people who are going to be dumped over a cliff when they reach retirement age, if nothing is done to reform entitlements.

In 1997, the Trustees of Medicare projected Medicare part A would be insolvent by 2001.

It wasn't, and as of 2012, it's not.

Why is that?????

reference:

Solvency Projections of the Medicare Part A Trust Fund, 1970-2011 - Kaiser Slides
 
No question that both Medicare and Social Security need to be fixed. The question is....Do we need a major revamp of both programs or merely a change in the contributions and benefits?

Republicans seem to be going for the nuclear option in using current insolvency as a justification to privatize both programs. Social Security needs a change in the retirement eligibility date (70 vs 67) to regain solvency.

Medicare is more difficult. Insurance companies do not want to insure old people. They never have and never will. Old people are the ones who use most of our medical dollar. They are also the ones most afraid of being bankrupted and pennyless after a major illness. Vouchers may work short term. The risk is in vouchers not keeping up with escallating medical costs and leaving the elderly at risk of financial ruin.

The answer seems to be more in attacking the medical cost aspects of the formula rather than the insurance part

This is correct. We are living longer and should therefore be working longer. And any reform must have cost reduction as its PRIMARY goal.

ObamaCare was a classic bait-and-switch con game. Remember all that talk about the per capita spending on medical care in the US? Healthcare "reform" was supposed to be about bending the cost curve down.

That was the bait.

The switch was ObamaCare. It does nothing to bend the cost curve down at all. In fact, it entrenches systems which will continue to bend the curve up, and then some.


.

Insurance is at the core of out Medical care crisis. It adds nothing to overall well being of Americans but only serves as a middle man in pooling premiums and dispersing payments. The overhead and profit margins of the Insurance Industry only add to the growing medical waste.

Countries with universal coverage have a much lower overhead cost and consume a lower percentage of GDP. We need to do more to hold down medical costs. More competition in treatment options, more competition in the drug industry and lower cost preventive screenings
 
Hmmm, look at that. A half page article with the lofty claim of being "A Rational Discussion of the Federal Budget" that does not utter a syllable about defense spending....

BTW, for what it's worth, I am on record on this board as stating that were I elected President, one of my first objectives would be tpo get a comprehensive list of EVERY military facility, base, etc. we have around the world, and determine if we could reduce or eliminate presence in various areas without affecting the stability of the area or our ability to defend ourselves. I am relatively sure we could drop a minimum of 20% of our defense budget by looking into this.

An excellent goal.

However, I think when some people talk about the multiple hundreds of "bases" we have around the world, they are speaking from ignorance. Most of those are embassies and unmanned facilities and such. Every embassy has Marines deployed as a protective force. So that counts as a "military base".

Are we going to close embassies? I don't think that would be wise.

We have a significant permanent military presence in perhaps a dozen to two dozen countries at most.

A 20 percent reduction in our defense budget could only be accomplished by a huge drawdown in personnel and reduction of our military readiness. It would drastically affect the lengths of deployments and the subsequently more infrequent rotations would stretch our remaining forces to the limit. It would mean shorter down times.


The raw materials in your iPad have become a national interest which now require us to keep the source countries within our control. So that is something to think about. Are you willing to do without certain gadgets, or pay a lot more for them, in order to achieve a severe withdrawal of our might around the globe?

Keeping the sea lanes open isn't cheap.


Perhaps we could save a lot of money by not getting into wars we should not be getting into. Or perhaps our leadership needs to prosecute war like they aren't a bunch of mentally challenged snails and get the job done right.

The demobilization of the Iraqi armed forces after the invasion was one of the greatest military blunders of all time, and cost us trillions of dollars.





.
 
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ObamaCare was a classic bait-and-switch con game. Remember all that talk about the per capita spending on medical care in the US? Healthcare "reform" was supposed to be about bending the cost curve down.

That was the bait.

The switch was ObamaCare. It does nothing to bend the cost curve down at all. In fact, it entrenches systems which will continue to bend the curve up, and then some.

Not so. There's very little hope of bending the cost curve (saving not just Medicare, but private payers as well) while still perserving access for the average American without some basic restructuring, such as:

  • Uniting payers around new payment and delivery models that encourage and demand value for the health dollar
  • Preparing and pushing providers to assume accountability for cost containment and quality improvement for at least some patient populations
  • Moving away from the perverse incentives of fee-for-service reimbursement
  • Creating rational marketplaces for health insurance and transparent markets for health services
  • Determining the comparative effectiveness of medical treatments and developing/disseminating evidence-based care guidelines
  • Incorporating signals of the relative value of health services into the financial choices faced by consumers via the design of insurance products (i.e cost-sharing)

One guess: what’s the only piece of federal legislation in recent history that lays the foundation for public and private sector actors alike achieving these goals?

Cost containment and system transformation are slow but the wheels are finally in motion.
 
excellent look at one aspect of the budget... entitlements like Medicare.

A Rational Discussion of the Federal Budget | RealClearPolitics

For those of us who like to believe that human beings are rational, trying to explain what happens in politics can be a real challenge.

For example, that segment of the population that has the least to fear from a reform of Medicare or Social Security is the most fearful -- namely, those already receiving Medicare or Social Security benefits.

It is understandable that people heavily dependent on these programs would fear losing their benefits, especially after a lifetime of paying into these programs. But nobody in his right mind has even proposed taking away the benefits of those who are already receiving them.





It is today's young people who are going to be left holding the bag when they reach retirement age and discover that all the money they paid in is long gone. It is today's young people who are going to be dumped over a cliff when they reach retirement age, if nothing is done to reform entitlements.

In 1997, the Trustees of Medicare projected Medicare part A would be insolvent by 2001.

It wasn't, and as of 2012, it's not.

Why is that?????

reference:

Solvency Projections of the Medicare Part A Trust Fund, 1970-2011 - Kaiser Slides

So the 'rational discussion' part of the thread title was what? A ruse?
 
Hmmm, look at that. A half page article with the lofty claim of being "A Rational Discussion of the Federal Budget" that does not utter a syllable about defense spending.
Maybe they didn't want to scare-away any Teabaggers.​

"During an appearance on CNN’s Starting Point on Tuesday, Tea Party Express Chairwoman Amy Kremer refused to condemn the deficit increase that would result from Mitt Romney’s proposed tax cuts, suggesting that the group is more concerned about acting as a surrogate for the Republican candidate than promoting fiscal responsibility. "

 

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