A question to all Christians

[CMike]

This explains more about the oral law.

The Oral Law - What is the Torah?

 

[Foxfyre]

All commandments are in the five books of moses. The oral law was given to Moses by G-D as well on Mt sinai. Moses got the written law, and the oral law.

The prophets have no laws.

Without the oral law it's impossible to implement the written law.

For example don't violate the shabbos by creating. What exactly does that mean? Does it mean starting a fire? How about cooking? Can you put food on the stove? Can you drive? Can you carry? How much can you carry? Can you take a shower? Can you take medicine?

Do not murder. What does that mean? What about killing in the military? What about self defense? What if someone is coming to kill you? These questions are answered in the oral law which was also given by G-D.

All these questions may seem petty. However, if a jew is keeping the sabbath he needs the answers to these questions. The answers were given to Moses from G-D on Mt Sinai.

As I said earlier, Cmike, I won't argue Jewish theology with a Jew. I respect your faith, I respect your beliefs, and I have no desire to mess with anything that holds it all together for you. My hope was to explain and perhaps defend the Christian perspective a bit so that you could respect that too whether or not you agree with it.

I have an advantage perhaps in that my faith also includes yours. And you, by virtue of your faith, must of necessity reject mine. And perhaps that creates a divide too wide to bridge. I don't know. But again, I am an eternal optimist.

I will close with this little true story. Awhile back, one of my students asked how, before the time of time pieces, the Jews would know on a cloudy day the exact time of the setting of the sun ushering in the Sabbath? I didn't have a clue so I went to some on line Jewish chat rooms to ask the question. I was treated quite badly in all of those rooms as I was seen as a Christian antagonist just there to dish out contempt or aspersion on the Jewish faith.

Apparently one Jewish gentleman accepted that I was not a chat room troll. He emailed me with his opinion that on a cloudy day, the Sabbath begins when dinner is on the table. He figured in the typical orthodox Jewish household, that would be close enough. I thanked him profusely and still think fondly of him.

 

[CMike]

That's a funny story.

Actually these days it's pretty easy, you just look at the calender. Just about all jewish calendars have candle lighting time, and sunset.

 

[Sublimating]

My church is an accepting and open church.We do not judge anyone and state they are an abomination for their beliefs or sexual orientation. We find no where in The Bible where Jesus stated anything bad about gays.
Why do many of you claim we are wrong when Jesus is the reason we celebrate life?
Why are all of you so infatuated with someone else's sex life?
What does that have to do with being a Christian? How is it being Christlike condemning gay folks?

There's a general consensus among humankind that homosexuality is immoral.
Not all people, cultures or religions throughout the ages share in this idea, just most of them.
There's also a general consensus among Christians that homosexuality is both immoral and sinful.
The reason for this is that there are several scriptures in the bible which, taken at face value, condemn homosexuality.

Now, some take the view that people are basically unintelligent, superstitious and arbitrary in how they function meaning that the near universal, cultural, timeless condemnation of homosexuality is just a useless coincidence born from superstition and ignorance.
The same people tend to believe that Christians as a group tend to be judgmental, biased and unlearned meaning that the various scriptures which supposedly condemn homosexuality have actually been misinterpreted, mistranslated and misunderstood.

As a matter rational thinking, statistics, logic, and just plain old odds, it would be pretty amazing if those people were right and there wasn't anything immoral or sinful about homosexuality. It's quite amazing that some people seem to believe against everything that this is precisely the case, that there's nothing immoral or sinful about homosexuality. I, myself cannot. I believe that homosexuals will be judge and condemned so, I warn them of the wrath to come whenever I have an willing listener. I would be remiss if I failed to do so.

 

[Gadawg73]

My church is an accepting and open church.We do not judge anyone and state they are an abomination for their beliefs or sexual orientation. We find no where in The Bible where Jesus stated anything bad about gays.
Why do many of you claim we are wrong when Jesus is the reason we celebrate life?
Why are all of you so infatuated with someone else's sex life?
What does that have to do with being a Christian? How is it being Christlike condemning gay folks?

There's a general consensus among humankind that homosexuality is immoral.
Not all people, cultures or religions throughout the ages share in this idea, just most of them.
There's also a general consensus among Christians that homosexuality is both immoral and sinful.
The reason for this is that there are several scriptures in the bible which, taken at face value, condemn homosexuality.

Now, some take the view that people are basically unintelligent, superstitious and arbitrary in how they function meaning that the near universal, cultural, timeless condemnation of homosexuality is just a useless coincidence born from superstition and ignorance.
The same people tend to believe that Christians as a group tend to be judgmental, biased and unlearned meaning that the various scriptures which supposedly condemn homosexuality have actually been misinterpreted, mistranslated and misunderstood.

As a matter rational thinking, statistics, logic, and just plain old odds, it would be pretty amazing if those people were right and there wasn't anything immoral or sinful about homosexuality. It's quite amazing that some people seem to believe against everything that this is precisely the case, that there's nothing immoral or sinful about homosexuality. I, myself cannot. I believe that homosexuals will be judge and condemned so, I warn them of the wrath to come whenever I have an willing listener. I would be remiss if I failed to do so.

There is no "general consensus" in my church that homosexuality is immoral. The exact opposite is true as we follow the teachings of Christ and find no where any mention of homosexuality in his teachings.
What is amazing is that you claim to be a follower of Christ yet make no mention anywhere in your post of him.
The last few sentences you write state your judgement of homosexuals clearly against the teachings of Christ and the foundation of Christianity. Your post is full of unsubstantiated and shot gun absurd claims of what the " general consensus of humankind" is.
Love thy neighbor and do not judge is no where to be found in any of your writings.
Accordingly, you are the one that needs to be worried about any wrath that might possibly be coming.
Govern yourself accordingly.

 

[AllieBaba]

I am kind of afraid to ask, if you do believe in the Torah, then how can you add an entire other scripture when it says

Deutronomy 4

2. Do not add to the word which I command you, nor diminish from it, to observe the commandments of the Lord your God which I command you.

The word is the Gospel as well.

 

[THE LIGHT]

My church is an accepting and open church.We do not judge anyone

you are the one that needs to be worried about any wrath that might possibly be coming.
Govern yourself accordingly.

You answer yourself so well.