A Positive Look at Islam

[Sky Dancer]

My contribution is loving the Sufi poets. Sufism is the mystical side of Islam. I'm close to a Sufi, who mentored me in my counseling practice.

Since we have at least six or seven Islam bashing threads here is an opportunity to look on the positive side.

1.5 billion people find something uplifting about Islam as a religion. Here is an article about Islam in Indonesia.
http://www.pbs.org/weta/crossroads/about/show_indonesia.html

Can you?

 

[Hister]

Islam=Sharia law=Barbaric

 

[THE LIGHT]

While we are at it maybe we can look at the posative side of Hitler too? Just because several million people found something uplifting about Nazism doesn't mean that it was a good thing.

I know, I shouldn't be mean to all Nazis because I am sure most were "moderate" Nazis.

 

[Hister]

While we are at it maybe we can look at the posative side of Hitler too? Just because several million people found something uplifting about Nazism doesn't mean that it was a good thing.

I know, I shouldn't be mean to all Nazis because I am sure most were "moderate" Nazis.

We could also look at the positive side of christianity, just because all priests are pedophiles doesn't mean all catholics are pedophiles. Or does it?

 

[Madeline]

Three hysterical posts to a thread meant to highlight the uplifting side of Islam. Some people will never hear a message of Godliness or peace, no matter how eloquently spoken, because they fear the speaker.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Three hysterical posts to a thread meant to highlight the uplifting side of Islam. Some people will never hear a message of Godliness or peace, no matter how eloquently spoken, because they fear the speaker.

Her fringe element of Islam is just that a very small fringe element. And even they believe Islam should be the only religion and only Government, they just take the long view and believe Islam will out last all the other religions.

 

[Quantum Windbag]

My contribution is loving the Sufi poets. Sufism is the mystical side of Islam. I'm close to a Sufi, who mentored me in my counseling practice.

Since we have at least six or seven Islam bashing threads here is an opportunity to look on the positive side.

1.5 billion people find something uplifting about Islam as a religion. Here is an article about Islam in Indonesia.
America at a Crossroads . A Different Jihad: Indonesia's Struggle for the Soul of Islam | PBS

Can you?

Are you sure that 1.5 billion people think Islam is uplifting? Couldn't some of them simply think that Islam is a means to grab power over others? And some think that Islam is not supposed to be uplifting at all, because it is simply about submission?

Even in Indonesia Muslims seem to find things to kill people over.

Jakarta, Indonesia: Al Qaeda group claims repsonsibility for bombings - Nachrichten English-News - WELT ONLINE

I would love to be positive about Islam, but it will not throw away its barbaric practice of killing people who disagree with it, including people like your Sufi friend. Maybe you should sit down and ask him how Sufism became a part of Islam.

The Hidden History of the Sufi

 

[syrenn]

My contribution is loving the Sufi poets. Sufism is the mystical side of Islam. I'm close to a Sufi, who mentored me in my counseling practice.

Since we have at least six or seven Islam bashing threads here is an opportunity to look on the positive side.

1.5 billion people find something uplifting about Islam as a religion. Here is an article about Islam in Indonesia.
America at a Crossroads . A Different Jihad: Indonesia's Struggle for the Soul of Islam | PBS

Can you?

I am very sure men find islam very uplifting. It is a world catered to their every whim.

There are many things about middle eastern culture that i find VERY uplifting. ilsam is NOT one of them.

 

[syrenn]

My contribution is loving the Sufi poets. Sufism is the mystical side of Islam. I'm close to a Sufi, who mentored me in my counseling practice.

Since we have at least six or seven Islam bashing threads here is an opportunity to look on the positive side.

1.5 billion people find something uplifting about Islam as a religion. Here is an article about Islam in Indonesia.
America at a Crossroads . A Different Jihad: Indonesia's Struggle for the Soul of Islam | PBS

Can you?

Just a side, personal experience of indonesian muslims and islam.

I am on many froums, one of them has a girl from indonesia that i like very much. Every single time she turns on her compouter, comes into chat, or participates in the threads, she puts her life in danger.

How is that for uplifting indo. islam?

 

[Barb]

My contribution is loving the Sufi poets. Sufism is the mystical side of Islam. I'm close to a Sufi, who mentored me in my counseling practice.

Since we have at least six or seven Islam bashing threads here is an opportunity to look on the positive side.

1.5 billion people find something uplifting about Islam as a religion. Here is an article about Islam in Indonesia.
America at a Crossroads . A Different Jihad: Indonesia's Struggle for the Soul of Islam | PBS

Can you?

Just a side, personal experience of indonesian muslims and islam.

I am on many froums, one of them has a girl from indonesia that i like very much. Every single time she turns on her compouter, comes into chat, or participates in the threads, she puts her life in danger.

How is that for uplifting indo. islam?

But Arab women are working, just as Western women had to work, towards a better day for their sisters.

Fatema Mernissi:
[ame=http://www.amazon.com/Islam-Democracy-Fear-Modern-World/dp/0738207454]Amazon.com: Islam and Democracy: Fear of the Modern World (9780738207452): Fatima Mernissi, Fatema Mernissi: Books[/ame]

In this deeply textured philosophical analysis, Mernissi ( The Veil and the Male Elite ), a sociologist in Morocco, argues cogently that Islam has been perverted by Arab leaders who want to deny their people democracy. Mixing personal experience, Arab history, Koranic analysis and cultural references, Mernissi explores Arab fear of the West, the rise of the "media imam," the process by which the concept of freedom "has been tainted with sin" and the loopholes that allow Arab states to be seated in the United Nations without adhering to all its principles.

If you're ever lucky enough to read this book of hers, read the last chapter first.

It happened in Nishapur in Iran in the spring of A.D. 1175. A man dreamed of a world without fear, without boundaries, where you could travel very far and find yourself in the company of strangers whom you knew as you knew yourself, strangers who were neither hostile nor aggressive. It was the land of the Simorgh.

Thirty birds (women all) of thousands made it to see the Simorgh, in the poem this man (Attar) wrote, called Mantiq al-tayr (The Conference of the Birds), and they see in each other at last, and in themselves, our universality, our connection to and with each other.

I wish I had access to my files. Sky makes a good point about Sufi. People who denigrate Islam as a whole because of the most public and publicized actions of a few, as well as the cherry-picked passages of the Qur'an that the young(ish) generations both west and east use as "fundamental" (ist) teachings ignore more beneficial histories that encouraged discussion and challenge to current understanding of the edicts of Islam.

As if
As if Christianity would, or has, unhindered by secular constraint, be, or been, any less rapacious in its pursuit of dominance over societies.
And yes, as if there weren't any instances of forced atheism doing the same.

 

[syrenn]

My contribution is loving the Sufi poets. Sufism is the mystical side of Islam. I'm close to a Sufi, who mentored me in my counseling practice.

Since we have at least six or seven Islam bashing threads here is an opportunity to look on the positive side.

1.5 billion people find something uplifting about Islam as a religion. Here is an article about Islam in Indonesia.
America at a Crossroads . A Different Jihad: Indonesia's Struggle for the Soul of Islam | PBS

Can you?

Just a side, personal experience of indonesian muslims and islam.

I am on many froums, one of them has a girl from indonesia that i like very much. Every single time she turns on her compouter, comes into chat, or participates in the threads, she puts her life in danger.

How is that for uplifting indo. islam?

But Arab women are working, just as Western women had to work, towards a better day for their sisters.

Fatema Mernissi:
[ame=http://www.amazon.com/Islam-Democracy-Fear-Modern-World/dp/0738207454]Amazon.com: Islam and Democracy: Fear of the Modern World (9780738207452): Fatima Mernissi, Fatema Mernissi: Books[/ame]

In this deeply textured philosophical analysis, Mernissi ( The Veil and the Male Elite ), a sociologist in Morocco, argues cogently that Islam has been perverted by Arab leaders who want to deny their people democracy. Mixing personal experience, Arab history, Koranic analysis and cultural references, Mernissi explores Arab fear of the West, the rise of the "media imam," the process by which the concept of freedom "has been tainted with sin" and the loopholes that allow Arab states to be seated in the United Nations without adhering to all its principles.

If you're ever lucky enough to read this book of hers, read the last chapter first.

It happened in Nishapur in Iran in the spring of A.D. 1175. A man dreamed of a world without fear, without boundaries, where you could travel very far and find yourself in the company of strangers whom you knew as you knew yourself, strangers who were neither hostile nor aggressive. It was the land of the Simorgh.

Thirty birds (women all) of thousands made it to see the Simorgh, in the poem this man (Attar) wrote, called Mantiq al-tayr (The Conference of the Birds), and they see in each other at last, and in themselves, our universality, our connection to and with each other.

I wish I had access to my files. Sky makes a good point about Sufi. People who denigrate Islam as a whole because of the most public and publicized actions of a few, as well as the cherry-picked passages of the Qur'an that the young(ish) generations both west and east use as "fundamental" (ist) teachings ignore more beneficial histories that encouraged discussion and challenge to current understanding of the edicts of Islam.

As if
As if Christianity would, or has, unhindered by secular constraint, be, or been, any less rapacious in its pursuit of dominance over societies.
And yes, as if there weren't any instances of forced atheism doing the same.

There is beauty in ALL religions. There is evil in ALL religions.

It is up to the followers to manifest what the religion truly is.

 

[mudwhistle]

Three hysterical posts to a thread meant to highlight the uplifting side of Islam. Some people will never hear a message of Godliness or peace, no matter how eloquently spoken, because they fear the speaker.

I think any religion that doesn't believe Christ was resurrected is not from God.

 

[Barb]

There is beauty in ALL religions. There is evil in ALL religions.

It is up to the followers to manifest what the religion truly is.

On this, Syrenn, we can agree.

 

[Barb]

Three hysterical posts to a thread meant to highlight the uplifting side of Islam. Some people will never hear a message of Godliness or peace, no matter how eloquently spoken, because they fear the speaker.

I think any religion that doesn't believe Christ was resurrected is not from God.

You really think divinity gives a rats ass whether you think it has the capacity to multitask?

 

[Mr.Fitnah]

Al-Ghazali, a Sufi orthodox Muslim, and follower of the Shafi’i school of Islamic jurisprudence, wrote this about jihad war and the treatment of the vanquished non-Muslim dhimmi peoples, in the Wadjiz: [4]

[O]ne must go on jihad (i.e., warlike razzias or raids) at least once a year…one may use a catapult against them [non-Muslims] when they are in a fortress, even if among them are women and children. One may set fire to them and/or drown them…If a person of the Ahl al-Kitab [People of The Book – primarily Jews and Christians] is enslaved, his marriage is [automatically] revoked…One may cut down their trees…One must destroy their useless books. Jihadists may take as booty whatever they decide…they may steal as much food as they need…

[T]he dhimmi is obliged not to mention Allah or His Apostle…Jews, Christians, and Majians must pay the jizya [poll tax on non-Muslims]…on offering up the jizya, the dhimmi must hang his head while the official takes hold of his beard and hits [thedhimmi] on the protruberant bone beneath his ear [i.e., the mandible]… They are not permitted to ostentatiously display their wine or church bells…their houses may not be higher than the Muslim’s, no matter how low that is. The dhimmi may not ride an elegant horse or mule; he may ride a donkey only if the saddle [-work] is of wood. He may not walk on the good part of the road. They [the dhimmis] have to wear [an identifying] patch [on their clothing], even women, and even in the [public] baths…[dhimmis] must hold their tongue….

Legal war (jihad) is an obligatory social duty (fard-kifaya); when one group of Moslems guarantees that it is being carried out in a satisfactory manner, the others are exempted.
The jihad becomes a strictly binding personal duty (fard-‘ain) for all Moslems who are enlisted or whose country has been [invaded] by the enemy. I

t is obligatory only for free men who have reached puberty, are endowed with reason and capable of fighting. Jihad is the best of the works of supererogation.

Abu Huraira relates that “The Prophet, when asked what was the best of all works, replied: Belief in God [and in His Prophet].– And then? someone asked him. – War for God’s cause, then a pious pilgrimage.” Abu Sa’id reports also that the Prophet, when asked who was the best of all men, replied, “He who fights for God’s cause, personally and with his goods.”… It is permitted to surprise the infidels under cover of night, to bombard them with mangonels [an engine that hurls missiles] and to attack them without declaring battle (du‘a&#8217. The Prophet attacked the Banu Mustaliq unexpectedly, while their animals were still at the watering-place; he killed the men who had fought against him and carried off the children into captivity.

It is forbidden to kill children, madmen, women, priests, impotent old men, the infirm, the blind, the weak-minded, unless they have taken part in the combat.
The chief of State decides on the fate of the men who are taken as prisoners; he can have them put to death, reduce them to slavery, free them in return for a ransom or grant them their freedom as a gift. He must choose the solution most in keeping with the common good of the Moslems.


The jizya can be demanded only from the Peoples of the Book (Ahl-al-Kitab) and from Zoroastrians (Magus), who pledge to pay it and submit to the laws of the community. The Peoples of the Book are understood to mean the Jews and those who follow the religion of the Torah, as well as the Christians and those who follow the religion of the Gospel. When People of the Book or Zoroastrians ask to pay the jizya and to submit to the laws of the community, one must grant their request, and it is forbidden to fight them.

The jizya is collected at the beginning of each year. It is set at 48 dirhems for a rich man, at 24 dirhems for a man of moderate means, and at 12 dirhems for a man of lowly estate. It cannot be demanded from children who have not reached the age of puberty, from women, helpless old men, the sick, the blind, or slaves, nor from poor people who are unable to pay it. An infidel subject to the jizya who converts to Islam is free of this obligation. When an infidel dies, his heirs are responsible for the jizya

As recorder in Kitab al-Wagiz fi fiqh madhab al-imam al-Safi'i.

 

[mudwhistle]

Three hysterical posts to a thread meant to highlight the uplifting side of Islam. Some people will never hear a message of Godliness or peace, no matter how eloquently spoken, because they fear the speaker.

I think any religion that doesn't believe Christ was resurrected is not from God.

You really think divinity gives a rats ass whether you think it has the capacity to multitask?

That's not the point. What we think or better yet Believe is what is important.

As in any religion faith is the number one issue.

I suppose you're gonna say I'm mindless and God doesn't give a rat's ass what I think.

Well at least you admit he exists.

That's progress I suppose.

 

[Barb]

I think any religion that doesn't believe Christ was resurrected is not from God.

You really think divinity gives a rats ass whether you think it has the capacity to multitask?

That's not the point. What we think or better yet Believe is what is important.

As in any religion faith is the number one issue.

I suppose you're gonna say I'm mindless and God doesn't give a rat's ass what I think.

Well at least you admit he exists.

That's progress I suppose.

Not "progress," Mud, as I've always admitted the idea of divinity.
Its people I have a problem with; their limitations on and limited conceptions of the divine that I find hard to accept.
I'm totally okay NOT knowing.
I'm completely okay with the idea that dad, or mom, or it doesn't like me or my "group" best, but that he, or she, or it likes me ENOUGH.
AND that he, or she or it likes everyone else too.
I especially like the last one, because guess what, that includes you too, and I'm pretty sure that, within your interactions with the people you actually interact with, you're a good person too, and that you honestly mean well.
Your heart is good. Perception? That is subjective. I think subjectivity catches up eventually. So don't be a hater, because I don't hate you.

 

[Obamerican]

I think any religion that doesn't believe Christ was resurrected is not from God.

You really think divinity gives a rats ass whether you think it has the capacity to multitask?

That's not the point. What we think or better yet Believe is what is important.

As in any religion faith is the number one issue.

I suppose you're gonna say I'm mindless and God doesn't give a rat's ass what I think.

Well at least you admit he exists.

That's progress I suppose.

"BELIEVE" doesn't make you right, just indoctrinated. Saying your religion is right makes all other religions "wrong". That is NOT right!

 

[mudwhistle]

You really think divinity gives a rats ass whether you think it has the capacity to multitask?

That's not the point. What we think or better yet Believe is what is important.

As in any religion faith is the number one issue.

I suppose you're gonna say I'm mindless and God doesn't give a rat's ass what I think.

Well at least you admit he exists.

That's progress I suppose.

Not "progress," Mud, as I've always admitted the idea of divinity.
Its people I have a problem with; their limitations on and limited conceptions of the divine that I find hard to accept.
I'm totally okay NOT knowing.
I'm completely okay with the idea that dad, or mom, or it doesn't like me or my "group" best, but that he, or she, or it likes me ENOUGH.
AND that he, or she or it likes everyone else too.
I especially like the last one, because guess what, that includes you too, and I'm pretty sure that, within your interactions with the people you actually interact with, you're a good person too, and that you honestly mean well.
Your heart is good. Perception? That is subjective. I think subjectivity catches up eventually. So don't be a hater, because I don't hate you.

Well first of all it's wrong to assume someone with a differing opinion hates you.

Second...trying to put me into some group or class of people is a bit presumptive. You don't know me from Adam so I think you might want to suspend judgment until you know for sure where exactly I'm coming from...and you'll never really know that if you insist on acting like your smarter then me. I don't feel the need to explain myself till you drop the condescending tone you seem to exude. You assume from reading one sentence that you can read me and that's where you're wrong again.

Thirdly....my perceptions are usually fairly close to actuality. For example....you're intelligent and of course you think you're intelligent...and because of this you like showing your intelligence to anyone who will listen to you. I on the other hand I don't think I'm the smartest person in the room even though I'm also not the dumbest. However I think I'm a decent person most of the time. We all have our shortcomings unfortunately. Mine is a quick temper which as I age is getting less and less. You on the other will most likely remain kind of stuck up for the rest of your life.

No offense.

Maybe we can have a beer together sometime when you get over yourself.

 

[mudwhistle]

You really think divinity gives a rats ass whether you think it has the capacity to multitask?

That's not the point. What we think or better yet Believe is what is important.

As in any religion faith is the number one issue.

I suppose you're gonna say I'm mindless and God doesn't give a rat's ass what I think.

Well at least you admit he exists.

That's progress I suppose.

"BELIEVE" doesn't make you right, just indoctrinated. Saying your religion is right makes all other religions "wrong". That is NOT right!

Well....Muslims think theirs is the only true religion....and they also think no other should exist.

I however feel other religions have a right to exist but feel that Jesus is the truth and the light. Does that make me wrong?

Whom do you support more...me or them? If them...well that makes no sense at all.