A lot of Atheist and agnostics just don't get it

It appears from all that they post here that they cannot perceive the Spirit that calls forth, comforts and keeps those who remain in faith and believe.

When truth is diligently sought it can open doors unimaginable.



I think that a more relative question is, What's it to you how we believe?

That same goes for those who do not believe. It is not up to me to 'change your mind' or force feed you ideology or beliefs anymore than it is up to you to try to force your ideology or beliefs on me. You are free to do whatever you wish within the boundaries of the law. As long as you are not trespassing in my space or interfering with my personal life or my children's lives have at it.


I don't have the slightest interest in what you believe, as long as you don't try to legislate it. Neither do any other atheists I know. I think you are imaging things.
 
It appears from all that they post here that they cannot perceive the Spirit that calls forth, comforts and keeps those who remain in faith and believe.

When truth is diligently sought it can open doors unimaginable.



I think that a more relative question is, What's it to you how we believe?

That same goes for those who do not believe. It is not up to me to 'change your mind' or force feed you ideology or beliefs anymore than it is up to you to try to force your ideology or beliefs on me. You are free to do whatever you wish within the boundaries of the law. As long as you are not trespassing in my space or interfering with my personal life or my children's lives have at it.


I don't have the slightest interest in what you believe, as long as you don't try to legislate it. Neither do any other atheists I know. I think you are imaging things.

Yeah but you do want to scrub religion off of everything. No crosses in town squares, no 'in God we Trust' on money or other quotations on government buildings. You want to make Government completely and Totally religion free.
 
It appears from all that they post here that they cannot perceive the Spirit that calls forth, comforts and keeps those who remain in faith and believe.

When truth is diligently sought it can open doors unimaginable.



I think that a more relative question is, What's it to you how we believe?

That same goes for those who do not believe. It is not up to me to 'change your mind' or force feed you ideology or beliefs anymore than it is up to you to try to force your ideology or beliefs on me. You are free to do whatever you wish within the boundaries of the law. As long as you are not trespassing in my space or interfering with my personal life or my children's lives have at it.


I don't have the slightest interest in what you believe, as long as you don't try to legislate it. Neither do any other atheists I know. I think you are imaging things.

Yeah but you do want to scrub religion off of everything. No crosses in town squares, no 'in God we Trust' on money or other quotations on government buildings. You want to make Government completely and Totally religion free.


You want your government to reflect religion? There is plenty of that going on in the Muslim world.
I'll make a deal with you. I won't hold political rallies in your church, and you won't preach is our schools.
 
It appears from all that they post here that they cannot perceive the Spirit that calls forth, comforts and keeps those who remain in faith and believe.

When truth is diligently sought it can open doors unimaginable.



I think that a more relative question is, What's it to you how we believe?

That same goes for those who do not believe. It is not up to me to 'change your mind' or force feed you ideology or beliefs anymore than it is up to you to try to force your ideology or beliefs on me. You are free to do whatever you wish within the boundaries of the law. As long as you are not trespassing in my space or interfering with my personal life or my children's lives have at it.


I don't have the slightest interest in what you believe, as long as you don't try to legislate it. Neither do any other atheists I know. I think you are imaging things.

Yet you seem to think you have the right to legislate what I believe and force what you desire that I will or will not do in my privately owned business enterprise.

Thank God and the United States Supreme Court that Fudgepackers United lost.

Oregon imposes gag order on Christian bakers in gay wedding case
 
Yeah but you do want to scrub religion off of everything. No crosses in town squares, no 'in God we Trust' on money or other quotations on government buildings. You want to make Government completely and Totally religion free
Absolutely. That is the best way. Check your burka, yarmulke, cross, and turban at the door of Congress.
 
It appears from all that they post here that they cannot perceive the Spirit that calls forth, comforts and keeps those who remain in faith and believe.

When truth is diligently sought it can open doors unimaginable.



I think that a more relative question is, What's it to you how we believe?

That same goes for those who do not believe. It is not up to me to 'change your mind' or force feed you ideology or beliefs anymore than it is up to you to try to force your ideology or beliefs on me. You are free to do whatever you wish within the boundaries of the law. As long as you are not trespassing in my space or interfering with my personal life or my children's lives have at it.


I don't have the slightest interest in what you believe, as long as you don't try to legislate it. Neither do any other atheists I know. I think you are imaging things.

Yeah but you do want to scrub religion off of everything. No crosses in town squares, no 'in God we Trust' on money or other quotations on government buildings. You want to make Government completely and Totally religion free.


You want your government to reflect religion? There is plenty of that going on in the Muslim world.
I'll make a deal with you. I won't hold political rallies in your church, and you won't preach is our schools.

I'm Agnostic, but I don't see the harm of existing, not new, Crosses being tolerated on Public land. And getting In God We Trust off of money is going to be a hurriculane feat.
 
Yeah but you do want to scrub religion off of everything. No crosses in town squares, no 'in God we Trust' on money or other quotations on government buildings. You want to make Government completely and Totally religion free
Absolutely. That is the best way. Check your burka, yarmulke, cross, and turban at the door of Congress.
They did that in Quebec, and only the snowflakes and mooselimbs complained.
 
Yeah but you do want to scrub religion off of everything. No crosses in town squares, no 'in God we Trust' on money or other quotations on government buildings. You want to make Government completely and Totally religion free
Absolutely. That is the best way. Check your burka, yarmulke, cross, and turban at the door of Congress.
They did that in Quebec, and only the snowflakes and mooselimbs complained.
Yes, but that was generally targeted against muslims and driven by white supremacists. They went about it wrong.
 
I think that a more relative question is, What's it to you how we believe?
That same goes for those who do not believe. It is not up to me to 'change your mind' or force feed you ideology or beliefs anymore than it is up to you to try to force your ideology or beliefs on me. You are free to do whatever you wish within the boundaries of the law. As long as you are not trespassing in my space or interfering with my personal life or my children's lives have at it.

I don't have the slightest interest in what you believe, as long as you don't try to legislate it. Neither do any other atheists I know. I think you are imaging things.
Yeah but you do want to scrub religion off of everything. No crosses in town squares, no 'in God we Trust' on money or other quotations on government buildings. You want to make Government completely and Totally religion free.

You want your government to reflect religion? There is plenty of that going on in the Muslim world.
I'll make a deal with you. I won't hold political rallies in your church, and you won't preach is our schools.
I'm Agnostic, but I don't see the harm of existing, not new, Crosses being tolerated on Public land. And getting In God We Trust off of money is going to be a hurriculane feat.

For the most part, I don't give a rat's ass about either issue, but I would not want the crosses if I were Jewsish.
 
Agnostics don't assume the existence of God. But do they assume the existence of Satan?
No. The believe we mortals have no idea what is or is not going to be present after death, if anything at all.
I think every agnostic could agree that there are powers which can change and program the human mind. Even people can do it. The CIA even developed mind altering torture techniques as well as drugs. Even movies like the Manjurian Candidate feature these things. So agnostics already know that the devil exists. So The only question is then why agnostics lie enough to deny the existence of the devil. When agnostics answer that question then they can re think if God exists, don't they?
 
Yeah but you do want to scrub religion off of everything. No crosses in town squares, no 'in God we Trust' on money or other quotations on government buildings. You want to make Government completely and Totally religion free
Absolutely. That is the best way. Check your burka, yarmulke, cross, and turban at the door of Congress.
They did that in Quebec, and only the snowflakes and mooselimbs complained.
Yes, but that was generally targeted against muslims and driven by white supremacists. They went about it wrong.
They got the job done. And it has nothing to do with whites vs browns. They simply dislike mooselimbs there and don't want sheet people as cop, judges or teachers...
 
And it has nothing to do with whites vs browns.
Oh, it absolutely did, for many of the people rallying for it. And of course, these morons couldnt distinguish between a muslim and a Sikh if their lives depended on it.
 
The notion of Jesus dying for our sins, for example. I cannot imagine seeing a god which requires someone be tortured to death as a payment engendering hope. I cannot see a god which thinks hell was a good idea as engendering hope. The idea that one is sinful for just being alive is negative. I really don't get the appeal at all. But, if you do then I am happy for you.
The full story emerges with in depth study of the cultures and histories of that time. It is a shame that today we end up with a summary of the shorthand version that you present quite well.

Erase that board, and all that has developed in the last two thousand years. You are now immersed in another culture, a culture where forgiveness of sins is attained by making a sacrifice or an offering at the Temple. The present day economy depends on this just as much as today's economy depends on fleecing the youth by pretty much mandating a college education--including a Masters Degree--for career advancement.

Like the majority of Jews in that time, you live in poverty, as the Romans have taken over your property and forced you into a serf-like servitude. You would very much like to make that offering at the Temple and have your sins forgiven...but you cannot bear to see your family go hungry.

Then along comes this itinerant preacher who says it is not Temple Offering for forgiveness of sins--it is repentance (turning away from that sin) and doing the will of God for the forgiveness of sins. Temple authorities begin to see the effect this sentiment has in loss of Temple revenue. They tell Jesus to cease and desist--that he has no authority to proclaim any such thing. Jesus tells them his authority comes from God, his Father. This incenses the authorities more, and they demand to see a sign that Jesus has been given any such authority. This would be a new covenant, and covenants include a blood (animal) sacrifice.

Jesus would not decease and desist, and he insisted his Father (with whom he was one with) gave him this authority. He would not stay silent and so the Temple authorities arranged for his death. The Covenant now had a blood sacrifice...and Jesus arose from the dead. Indeed, repentance for the forgiveness of sins was indeed the New Covenant (Testament).

And, yes, those who follow Jesus' Way of turning from sin and discerning and obeying the will of the Father can point to Jesus who died to bring this New Covenant about where their sins are indeed forgiven. Keep in mind both Jews and Christians believe it is God who forgives sins. The Jewish symbol of this was the Temple; the Christian symbol is the crucified Christ or the cross.

As far as hell...Catholic teaching is that God sends no one to hell--people choose to go there. How? First there must be a belief in God and a total rejection of who He is and the ideals He presents. Alternately, if someone has no belief in God, then it is a matter of actively choosing over and over again evil, not goodness. Since God is all good, such people have no wish to be in His presence. Hell is an absence of God, and it is a choice.

Finally, people are not sinful just for being alive. People are imperfect and they fall short of the ideal mark--that is simply human nature. We also (or most of us) have the wish to be the best we can be, to reach the ideal mark--and that is human nature, too. God calls each of us to pursue that ideal--and not to lose hope the times we fall short. Those times are readily forgiven as we try once more to reach the epitome of doing God's will on earth as it is done in heaven.

Courage and persistence cannot help but lift my spirits--and Jesus portrayed both. So did many Old Testament figures.

Actually, I was going simply on the bible - though I admit there are several versions.

I agree with your historical assessment. Jesus was a great teacher and died for it. But that does not go along with the notion that God so loved the world he gave his only begotten son or that the son died for our sins. That is basic Christian doctrine and it makes no sense unless God sent Jesus to die for our sins. I find no comfort in that thought. It is the classic case of a whipping boy - someone who takes the punishment for my actions. I find that inherently immoral.

I think you miss my point on hell. It doesn't matter if you say I choose to go to hell, God still created hell since God created all things. Which means if hell exists at all, then God clearly thought hell a good idea. Now, you can certainly say that it is not a place but that is not how it is described Revelations. If we are going to erase all that transpired in the last 2,000 years, that would include Catholic doctrine.

I am curious though. On what basis do you state that God is good? I find nothing in either the Old or New Testament to support that conclusion. Quite the contrary.
 

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