97% Climate Scientists...

[Annie]

So who are those climate scientists?

Lawrence Solomon: 75 climate scientists think humans contribute to global warming | Full Comment | National Post

Lawrence Solomon: 75 climate scientists think humans contribute to global warming
December 30, 2010 – 2:35 pm

...To their embarrassment, most of the pundits and press discovered that they were mistaken – those 2500 scientists hadn’t endorsed the IPCC’s conclusions, they had merely reviewed some part or other of the IPCC’s mammoth studies. To add to their embarrassment, many of those reviewers from within the IPCC establishment actually disagreed with the IPCC’s conclusions, sometimes vehemently.

The upshot? The punditry looked for and recently found an alternate number to tout — “97% of the world’s climate scientists” accept the consensus, articles in the Washington Post and elsewhere have begun to claim.

This number will prove a new embarrassment to the pundits and press who use it. The number stems from a 2009 online survey of 10,257 earth scientists, conducted by two researchers at the University of Illinois. The survey results must have deeply disappointed the researchers – in the end, they chose to highlight the views of a subgroup of just 77 scientists, 75 of whom thought humans contributed to climate change. The ratio 75/77 produces the 97% figure that pundits now tout.

The two researchers started by altogether excluding from their survey the thousands of scientists most likely to think that the Sun, or planetary movements, might have something to do with climate on Earth – out were the solar scientists, space scientists, cosmologists, physicists, meteorologists and astronomers. That left the 10,257 scientists in disciplines like geology, oceanography, paleontology, and geochemistry that were somehow deemed more worthy of being included in the consensus. The two researchers also decided that scientific accomplishment should not be a factor in who could answer – those surveyed were determined by their place of employment (an academic or a governmental institution). Neither was academic qualification a factor – about 1,000 of those surveyed did not have a PhD, some didn’t even have a master’s diploma.

To encourage a high participation among these remaining disciplines, the two researchers decided on a quickie survey that would take less than two minutes to complete, and would be done online, saving the respondents the hassle of mailing a reply. Nevertheless, most didn’t consider the quickie survey worthy of response –just 3146, or 30.7%, answered the two questions on the survey:

1. When compared with pre-1800s levels, do you think that mean global temperatures have generally risen, fallen, or remained relatively constant?

2. Do you think human activity is a significant contributing factor in changing mean global temperatures?

...

 

[Oddball]

Old story.

That's 97% of the "scientists" culled from carefully screened respondents.

 

[Annie]

Old story.

That's 97% of the "scientists" culled from carefully screened respondents.

I hadn't seen it, but it shows just how unscientific their pronouncements are. Should give concern to the believers, but nothing will.

 

[Baruch Menachem]

This is what makes folks so furious and what threatens the foundation of good science.

And I bet the 3% who answered no were either being sarcastic or were afraid of this kind of misuse being made of the survey.

 

[daveman]

It's easy to win if you stack the deck.

Of course, that makes you a cheater.

 

[Old Rocks]

Really stupid. Those 77 are the people who are actually actively publishing research in peer reviewed journals at present.

And here are some other numbers.
97% of climatologists say global warming is occurring and caused by humans

A new poll among 3,146 earth scientists found that 90 percent believe global warming is real, while 82 percent agree that human activity been a significant factor in changing mean global temperatures.

The survey, conducted among researchers listed in the American Geological Institute's Directory of Geoscience Departments*, "found that climatologists who are active in research showed the strongest consensus on the causes of global warming, with 97 percent agreeing humans play a role". The biggest doubters were petroleum geologists (47 percent) and meteorologists (64 percent). A recent poll suggests that 58 percent of Americans believe that human activity contributes to climate change.

"The petroleum geologist response is not too surprising, but the meteorologists' is very interesting," said Peter Doran, University of Illinois at Chicago associate professor of earth and environmental sciences who conducted the survey late last year with former graduate student Maggie Kendall Zimmerman. "Most members of the public think meteorologists know climate, but most of them actually study very short-term phenomenon."

 

[Baruch Menachem]

You frame the questions that way there is no alternative answer, unless you think the questioner is being a dick and you want to play with him.

That does not mean they endorse the weirdos who are pushing AGW. Or that they endorse the remedies put up.

 

[william the wie]

Actually I know an environmental scientist completing his MS and he is so violently anti-AGW his thesis is "Global Warming is Bogus, Climate Change is Real". He is afraid that real environmental degradation is being ignored to promote this AGW crap.

 

[polarbear]

Really stupid. Those 77 are the people who are actually actively publishing research in peer reviewed journals at present.



A new poll among 3,146 earth scientists found that 90 percent believe global warming is real, while 82 percent agree that human activity been a significant factor in changing mean global temperatures.

The survey, conducted among researchers listed in the American Geological Institute's Directory of Geoscience Departments*, "found that climatologists who are active in research showed the strongest consensus on the causes of global warming, with 97 percent agreeing humans play a role". The biggest doubters were petroleum geologists (47 percent) and meteorologists (64 percent). A recent poll suggests that 58 percent of Americans believe that human activity contributes to climate change.

"The petroleum geologist response is not too surprising, but the meteorologists' is very interesting," said Peter Doran, University of Illinois at Chicago associate professor of earth and environmental sciences who conducted the survey late last year with former graduate student Maggie Kendall Zimmerman. "Most members of the public think meteorologists know climate, but most of them actually study very short-term phenomenon."

What on earth is an "earth scientist". There are only 3 sciences
1.)Mathematics
2.)Physics
3.)Chemistry
All others are self professed scientists. Of the 3,146 earth...whatever I doubt that any of them actually ever have been inside the arctic circle, least of all close to the poles.
I wonder how many of them, if polled would believe that there are entire regions of Ellesmere Island and Northern Greenland peppered with tree stumps which still have roots attached, though totally dried out. Take a wild guess why the Vikings called it "Greenland"...O.K. more precisely it was "Groenland" but I don`t have the o with the 2 dots on top on my keyboard
How many of them would believe that the international "climate research station" closest to the pole can`t measure CO2 in the atmosphere with infrared spectroscopy, though that should be easy if CO2 absorbs IR enough "to warm the planet".
We use (and so does everyone else) GLC (Gaschromathography) because with IR you can`t even measure the difference between 5 and 10% CO2 (a lethal concentration).
Why would that be...You may ask. Because normal humidity a.k.a. H2O vapor absorbs IR 100 X times more than the fractional % CO2 we do have over the entire spectral region where CO2 has a few very weak absorption bands.
How many of them would believe that a short walk from the "international climate station" there is a power plant running 6 large CAT Diesels 24/7 to also heat the "climate station".
We blow ~ 30 tonnes/day of CO2 out the exhaust stacks. But the climatologists claim that does not matter "because the wind blows most if that away".
Why don`t these "earth" whatever tell You that the entire region Ellesmere + Northern Greenland has always been a Low-precip region, not much difference other than temperature from the Sahara?
Most of the snow we do get is blown in during the winter months from the polar ice cap by winds 150+klicks. I could show you "brown" Greenland pictures from 1958, no grey actually because we have only b/w pics from then.
I posted all this in another thread here with a link to 100+ pictures I took over the years I was stationed there. If You examine these You will have no trouble making out that all the snow is always on the same mountainside, no matter which mountain you look at...because almost all is drift snow. Aside from there I lived in the Yukon. It does snow a lot there and our glaciers are doing just fine thank You...but in a low precip region where almost all snow is blown in how can you possibly relate from Sat-pics and glacier extend what the temperature trend is?
If the sand dunes in the Sahara are on average over a few decades a little lower, would You say it does`nt "snow" enough sand because of "global warming"?
Or try confront the "earth" whatever and "climate"...whatever with the Roman sea walls in Britain and ask what formed all that ice in such a short time that they are so high and far from today`s shores...they will have none of the mini ice age we just came out of due to unusual low solar activity...they try and tell You it was`nt the ocean level that dropped, but that the British Isles have "risen from the sea".
Whatever, anyway a whole lot of ice has to melt before the water is again up at where it was when these walls were constructed.
Most people have no idea what kind of b.s. they are fed by the media and "earth"... whatever...Today on CNN there is an article where one "scientist" established how global warming is forcing our Inuit population into junk food, because "of the lack of ice cover, due to global warming seal hunting is almost impossible"...
my God, is that the first time this "Scientist" has been say in Iqaluit?"
They had a MacDonald`s there since it has an airport and Social-workers from Ottawa and Toronto...and You will not find a single Inuit who would give You a big Mac for raw seal!...and the same goes for every Inuit community up there. Its not just junk food they eat, they also have a huge drug and alcohol problem since they get rather generous welfare checks. They are by far more interested what`s on Satellite TV than what may or may not be within easy rifle range from the living room window..and none of that has anything to do with how thick or thin the ice is!
Everyone of these "social workers" have a degree in "Social Science" and the Inuit did just fine before these "Scientists" showed up with huge civil servant pay checks and the bars + Restaurants Ottawa built for them in these communities. Their very presence + their lifestyle ensures that they will never run out of "work"!....But CNN publishes yet another idiotic "climate change" ramification one of the "experts" fed to their news room..
...But then I`m not an "earth"...whatever, just a Nuts and Bolts Chemical Engineer who served with the Military in the arctic and thus should keep my mouth shut when it comes to state of the art media driven propaganda science.
My God how much more stupid can this climate change "science" get?
And its always the same club they hit over Your head "94% polled agree that...blah blah"
and that is supposed to prove what?...that there are far more stupid than not quite so stupid people, sad but true, that is all You can prove with this method.

 

[mdn2000]

Watch out for Old Crock, he is like grandpa at Thanksgiving, someone has to feed him.

 

[rdean]

This is what makes folks so furious and what threatens the foundation of good science.

And I bet the 3% who answered no were either being sarcastic or were afraid of this kind of misuse being made of the survey.

They were probably Republicans. 97% of scientists believe in "evolution". Only 6% of scientists are Republican. Who wants to bet that HALF of all Republican scientists DON'T believe in evolution?

 

[skookerasbil]

So who are those climate scientists?

Lawrence Solomon: 75 climate scientists think humans contribute to global warming | Full Comment | National Post

Lawrence Solomon: 75 climate scientists think humans contribute to global warming
December 30, 2010 – 2:35 pm

...To their embarrassment, most of the pundits and press discovered that they were mistaken – those 2500 scientists hadn’t endorsed the IPCC’s conclusions, they had merely reviewed some part or other of the IPCC’s mammoth studies. To add to their embarrassment, many of those reviewers from within the IPCC establishment actually disagreed with the IPCC’s conclusions, sometimes vehemently.

The upshot? The punditry looked for and recently found an alternate number to tout — “97% of the world’s climate scientists” accept the consensus, articles in the Washington Post and elsewhere have begun to claim.

This number will prove a new embarrassment to the pundits and press who use it. The number stems from a 2009 online survey of 10,257 earth scientists, conducted by two researchers at the University of Illinois. The survey results must have deeply disappointed the researchers – in the end, they chose to highlight the views of a subgroup of just 77 scientists, 75 of whom thought humans contributed to climate change. The ratio 75/77 produces the 97% figure that pundits now tout.

The two researchers started by altogether excluding from their survey the thousands of scientists most likely to think that the Sun, or planetary movements, might have something to do with climate on Earth – out were the solar scientists, space scientists, cosmologists, physicists, meteorologists and astronomers. That left the 10,257 scientists in disciplines like geology, oceanography, paleontology, and geochemistry that were somehow deemed more worthy of being included in the consensus. The two researchers also decided that scientific accomplishment should not be a factor in who could answer – those surveyed were determined by their place of employment (an academic or a governmental institution). Neither was academic qualification a factor – about 1,000 of those surveyed did not have a PhD, some didn’t even have a master’s diploma.

To encourage a high participation among these remaining disciplines, the two researchers decided on a quickie survey that would take less than two minutes to complete, and would be done online, saving the respondents the hassle of mailing a reply. Nevertheless, most didn’t consider the quickie survey worthy of response –just 3146, or 30.7%, answered the two questions on the survey:

1. When compared with pre-1800s levels, do you think that mean global temperatures have generally risen, fallen, or remained relatively constant?

2. Do you think human activity is a significant contributing factor in changing mean global temperatures?

...

Holy shit..........never knew that!!!


ePiC fAiL




epic fraud too..........over time, shit like this will become more and more part of the mainstream thinking. Ten years ago, people like Rush Limbaugh were saying with 100% certainty that in the future, this global warming stuff will be viewed as nothing but a fad..........an engineered fraud on the world. Just 5 years ago, the crusaders owned the debate...........not anymore. They've been exposed..........thankfully, for the rest of us.


Think about it..........the two easiest things to doctor are statistics and weather.

 

[Baruch Menachem]

This is what makes folks so furious and what threatens the foundation of good science.

And I bet the 3% who answered no were either being sarcastic or were afraid of this kind of misuse being made of the survey.

They were probably Republicans. 97% of scientists believe in "evolution". Only 6% of scientists are Republican. Who wants to bet that HALF of all Republican scientists DON'T believe in evolution?

No reputable scientist believes in anything related to his field. There are theories that fit the known facts bit than any other hypothesis. Belief is a religious expression.

Every so often Evolutionary theory gets turned on its head. Most significantly due to the discoveries in Africa between 1920 and 1960. Also due to the research of folks like Jane Goodall. Evolutionary theory today is unrecognizable as the same beast of William Jennings Bryans's day.

The 6% figure was a poll of AGW scamsters assembled at a meeting on the subject. It was not a poll of scientists in general. It was, it seems to from the evidence, a poll of religious cranks calling themselves scientists. This has been pointed out to you repeatedly.
One can not extrapolate from a poll of a cammora dubious characters and then assign belief to all persons in a class semi related, still less can you assign belief in an assertion where the question was not asked in the poll.

 

[Big Fitz]

Old story.

That's 97% of the "scientists" culled from carefully screened respondents.

did you know that 100 years ago no geologists believed in Plate Techtonics? Boy were THEY right! And 150 years ago, 100% of biologists thought Louis Pasteur was insane for saying that spontaneous generation was false and germs did not exist! What a loon that Pasteur fellow was! Thank God nobody spread those crazy coot's theories.

In the 1700's every scientist knew that fire was caused by caloric fluid, and motion could not increase temperature.

And Geez! How can we forget how Galileo's crazy little notion the Earth revolved around the sun! I mean he was so wrong that the concensus of scientific scholars of the day AND the church got him to recant THAT one for a while. Thank God for that! Atlas and the Turtle were PISSED!

 

[DiveCon]

This is what makes folks so furious and what threatens the foundation of good science.

And I bet the 3% who answered no were either being sarcastic or were afraid of this kind of misuse being made of the survey.

They were probably Republicans. 97% of scientists believe in "evolution". Only 6% of scientists are Republican. Who wants to bet that HALF of all Republican scientists DON'T believe in evolution?

No reputable scientist believes in anything related to his field. There are theories that fit the known facts bit than any other hypothesis. Belief is a religious expression.

Every so often Evolutionary theory gets turned on its head. Most significantly due to the discoveries in Africa between 1920 and 1960. Also due to the research of folks like Jane Goodall. Evolutionary theory today is unrecognizable as the same beast of William Jennings Bryans's day.

The 6% figure was a poll of AGW scamsters assembled at a meeting on the subject. It was not a poll of scientists in general. It was, it seems to from the evidence, a poll of religious cranks calling themselves scientists. This has been pointed out to you repeatedly.
One can not extrapolate from a poll of a cammora dubious characters and then assign belief to all persons in a class semi related, still less can you assign belief in an assertion where the question was not asked in the poll.

this has been pointed out to rdean several times, but he chooses to continue with his lies

 

[polarbear]

It`s not my intention to dump my opinions about these climate change theories on Y`all.
I know my limitations especially when it comes to debating. I did not major in English or political "science" nor can I twist words like a lawyer. I just so happened that I`m (was..now retired) a chemical engineer with Military service and have spent the better part of my life in the Arctic, winters @ 24 hours darkness and summers @ 24hrs blinding sunlight.
I have roamed the Arctic not just looking down from Hercs, Twin Otters and Choppers, but had both feet on the ground and even crawled into many ice caves. And dug in the gravel to feel the roots of tree stumps that pepper the landscape close to the Pole.
I took thousands of pictures, not all with the same Cam....You can grab one and sign it out and some were better than others. But I do think these pictures tell the real story what is happening at the North Pole and what is just plain B.S.
This forum has some rather awkward rules....You are not allowed to post any links till You made 15 posts. Sure I could 14 text boxes full of B.S. to qualify, but I know full well that the B.S. will be stuck in my face to "win" debates....because that`s the way this entire swindle "science" has been perpetrated since conception.
So, for now I`ll just refer to some pics which I have already uploaded to a newspaper in Germany on my personal Album. And I have to leave the "Youknowwhat" off and spell out the rest of the link, and when you re-combine the 2 & paste it in Your browser`s address bar You`ll have the picture that goes with the discussion.
F@##< ....I can`t even write hTtP,wWw with nothing else and this crap editor wraps me on the knuckles about these stupid 15 posts! What the hell is the bright idea behind that???

Anyway, here comes picture #1 and I wish an honest Geologist would finally come forward and tell all of us how many 1000 freeze thaw cycles it takes before entire mountain sides look like this:

community.augsburger-allgemeine.de/forum/members/bernhardb-albums-5502-sammelsurium-picture23858-sammelsurium.jpg

What..did all that happen since we have cars?

Next one is the Remus river, we go there lots of time because the fishing is pretty good.
I always preferred nosing around more and took this picture, had in mind to get an honest answer some day about this question:

community.augsburger-allgemeine.de/forum/members/bernhardb-albums-5481-noch+mehr-picture23749-noch-mehr.jpg

That river comes from a glacier just behind me from where I snapped the photo.
For how long has this glacier been melting to dig a river like that and form a sediment bank like that one on the right river bend, just before it goes into that Lake full of fish?
Did all that happen in the last 75 Years?

Next picture was taken form a little higher up same area...the "global warming melt" of arctic glaciers:

community.augsburger-allgemeine.de/forum/members/bernhardb-albums-5481-noch+mehr-picture23746-noch-mehr.jpg

That picture makes 2 things obvious at the same time. That`s not really a "melt" that is happening here...The ice is shoved by sheer force of gravity as ice into the warmer lake water and quasi dissolves...and I don`t really care where on Ellesmere Island or Greenland You look almost everywhere that`s how these glaciers are "melting".

The second thing that`s rather obvious, is how the snow that formed these glaciers came from...it does not fall from the clouds like in the Yukon or Alaska , commonly known as "It`s snowing"...no almost all of that snow is blown in by furious winds in the winter months from the polar ice cap.
To convey this a little better:
First another picture:

community.augsburger-allgemeine.de/forum/members/bernhardb-albums-5500-+hier+rumkriecht-picture23846-hier-rumkriecht.jpg

That was "in broad daylight" in the winter on our base...no at that rare time it did not storm!...but notice the rope in the background?
Most of the time You have to wear a harness and clip to that rope else no one will ever find You again, and the snow blows so thick You literally cannot !!! see the hand before Your eyes or a strobe light just a few feet in front of You!!!!
But if You happen to be so unlucky as "being trapped" above in an aircraft ~ 1000 feet agl...there is a crystall clear star studded sky.....but the time will come when the fuel beepers come on and You will have to descend into that inferno and land...that`s why the surroundings of this base is littered with wrecked aircraft from Hercs, Griffins, DC 6es and even an old Lancaster from 1958. You cant` really charter a tourist "skidder" to fly there nor would You be allowed, this always was and still is a restricted area for military use. The international "climate station" appeared in a hurry, after a horrific crash blew the cover of secrecy what is really on this base, which had either been denied or lied about that it is "weather research station" and in order that the American and Canadian Public had not been lied to a real weather station had been slapped together inside 7 days...and later been improved...and is today the "International Polar Research Station"....
But AFB Trenton and SAC Thule control who is allowed to go there and who not.

Oh yeah...here are some of the many tree stumps, these are around Fort Conger, which is where 14 men miserably died when they tried to reach the North Pole:

community.augsburger-allgemeine.de/forum/members/bernhardb-albums-5481-noch+mehr-picture23747-noch-mehr.jpg

Lots more of these all over the northern part of Greenland!

And now here is a real puzzle, I wish and so do many others who made these "rings"...
There are lots of these all around SAC Thule:

community.augsburger-allgemeine.de/forum/members/bernhardb-albums-5481-noch+mehr-picture23748-noch-mehr.jpg

No there are no "Eskimos"...Inuit they are called today there. They don`t go that far north. The closest Inuit settlemnt is over 1000 miles as the crow flies south of us. We (the military) are the northernmost people on the face of this planet who live on Land at taht place...but someone made these rings...
And before anyone makes a wise crack about spotting some man made bricks in this ring...there are entire mountain sides of almost perfect bricks and shingles in all colors from red, to blue, green and brown....take a closer look at this picture, there are a lot of "bricks" and a lot of almost perfect "shingles":

community.augsburger-allgemeine.de/forum/members/bernhardb-albums-5491-raetselhaftes-picture23791-raetselhaftes.jpg

It really sucks if You cant` even show a picture, because after this I don`t have a whole lot I want to say and rather sit back to see what thoughts You guys have about this material...don`t keep me waiting too long. Soon I`m planning to move back north again..I just don`t fit in where we are at the moment and where I returning to there are no phones and no Internet, but lots of glaciers!
Oh yeah do Polar bears drown or starve when the ice melts like it did every summer for X 1000 Years?...
Does he look staved to You...I have hundreds and hundreds of such polarbear pictures, they all looked pretty healthy to me, just like that one:

.community.augsburger-allgemeine.de/forum/members/bernhardb-albums-5485-cfs+alert+canada-picture23766-cfs-alert-canada.jpg

They LOVE SWIMMING!!!
Oh Gee, almost forgot to link to the pictures which make it pretty clear how different snow deposits here ...where it hardly ever snows as people in the south understand it we have mostly "snow dunes"...I guess You could call them "drifts" but they are pretty bis drifts, which form under their own weight Ice:

community.augsburger-allgemeine.de/forum/members/bernhardb-albums-5481-noch+mehr-picture23744-noch-mehr.jpg

Notice how sparse the snow is on one side and how deep (hundreds of feet) on the "lee-side":

community.augsburger-allgemeine.de/forum/members/bernhardb-albums-5481-noch+mehr-picture23750-noch-mehr.jpg

That`s not how "Donner Pass" looks were it dumps snow in the Wintertime..
It NEVER dumps snow up in the arctic..well hardly ever and the Mountains and the landscape tell You a story that spans who knows how many thousands of years.
Now I wish I would get some honest answers from a well proven and seasoned Geologist who does`nt smoke pot, how on earth these phony rising average temperatures have anything to do with how much blowing snow is trapped by these mountains and the terrain-turbulence. Even a Geologist should know, that the "colder" the snow is the easier the wind keeps stripping it from the mountains in Greenland + Ellesmere and then You have consequently less snow left behind to form glaciers.
And that applies summer and winter...it`s not that there is no snow in theses mountains in the summer...hey when the wind kicks up in the summer in these mountains you are blinded by snow, just like in a Sahara sandstorm!
Like I said, these "climatologists" say one thing , these mountains told me all these years I watched them an entirely different story


I am getting TOTALLY annoyed by this 15 Post B.S. I got flagged over and over again and had to go over it with a fine toothcomb till I found where this idiotic editor put a {UrL} where I never asked it too and then refused my post till I finally found it.
I don`t think I will continue posting here again, as if I have don`t any better things to do than putting up with B.S. Like that...so Bye You`all
It`s been nice knowing You

 

[DiveCon]

It`s not my intention to dump my opinions about these climate change theories on Y`all.
I know my limitations especially when it comes to debating. I did not major in English or political "science" nor can I twist words like a lawyer. I just so happened that I`m (was..now retired) a chemical engineer with Military service and have spent the better part of my life in the Arctic, winters @ 24 hours darkness and summers @ 24hrs blinding sunlight.
I have roamed the Arctic not just looking down from Hercs, Twin Otters and Choppers, but had both feet on the ground and even crawled into many ice caves. And dug in the gravel to feel the roots of tree stumps that pepper the landscape close to the Pole.
I took thousands of pictures, not all with the same Cam....You can grab one and sign it out and some were better than others. But I do think these pictures tell the real story what is happening at the North Pole and what is just plain B.S.
This forum has some rather awkward rules....You are not allowed to post any links till You made 15 posts. Sure I could 14 text boxes full of B.S. to qualify, but I know full well that the B.S. will be stuck in my face to "win" debates....because that`s the way this entire swindle "science" has been perpetrated since conception.
So, for now I`ll just refer to some pics which I have already uploaded to a newspaper in Germany on my personal Album. And I have to leave the "Youknowwhat" off and spell out the rest of the link, and when you re-combine the 2 & paste it in Your browser`s address bar You`ll have the picture that goes with the discussion.
F@##< ....I can`t even write hTtP,wWw with nothing else and this crap editor wraps me on the knuckles about these stupid 15 posts! What the hell is the bright idea behind that???

Anyway, here comes picture #1 and I wish an honest Geologist would finally come forward and tell all of us how many 1000 freeze thaw cycles it takes before entire mountain sides look like this:

What..did all that happen since we have cars?

Next one is the Remus river, we go there lots of time because the fishing is pretty good.
I always preferred nosing around more and took this picture, had in mind to get an honest answer some day about this question:

That river comes from a glacier just behind me from where I snapped the photo.
For how long has this glacier been melting to dig a river like that and form a sediment bank like that one on the right river bend, just before it goes into that Lake full of fish?
Did all that happen in the last 75 Years?

Next picture was taken form a little higher up same area...the "global warming melt" of arctic glaciers:


That picture makes 2 things obvious at the same time. That`s not really a "melt" that is happening here...The ice is shoved by sheer force of gravity as ice into the warmer lake water and quasi dissolves...and I don`t really care where on Ellesmere Island or Greenland You look almost everywhere that`s how these glaciers are "melting".

The second thing that`s rather obvious, is how the snow that formed these glaciers came from...it does not fall from the clouds like in the Yukon or Alaska , commonly known as "It`s snowing"...no almost all of that snow is blown in by furious winds in the winter months from the polar ice cap.
To convey this a little better:
First another picture:

That was "in broad daylight" in the winter on our base...no at that rare time it did not storm!...but notice the rope in the background?
Most of the time You have to wear a harness and clip to that rope else no one will ever find You again, and the snow blows so thick You literally cannot !!! see the hand before Your eyes or a strobe light just a few feet in front of You!!!!
But if You happen to be so unlucky as "being trapped" above in an aircraft ~ 1000 feet agl...there is a crystall clear star studded sky.....but the time will come when the fuel beepers come on and You will have to descend into that inferno and land...that`s why the surroundings of this base is littered with wrecked aircraft from Hercs, Griffins, DC 6es and even an old Lancaster from 1958. You cant` really charter a tourist "skidder" to fly there nor would You be allowed, this always was and still is a restricted area for military use. The international "climate station" appeared in a hurry, after a horrific crash blew the cover of secrecy what is really on this base, which had either been denied or lied about that it is "weather research station" and in order that the American and Canadian Public had not been lied to a real weather station had been slapped together inside 7 days...and later been improved...and is today the "International Polar Research Station"....
But AFB Trenton and SAC Thule control who is allowed to go there and who not.

Oh yeah...here are some of the many tree stumps, these are around Fort Conger, which is where 14 men miserably died when they tried to reach the North Pole:



Lots more of these all over the northern part of Greenland!

And now here is a real puzzle, I wish and so do many others who made these "rings"...
There are lots of these all around SAC Thule:

No there are no "Eskimos"...Inuit they are called today there. They don`t go that far north. The closest Inuit settlemnt is over 1000 miles as the crow flies south of us. We (the military) are the northernmost people on the face of this planet who live on Land at taht place...but someone made these rings...
And before anyone makes a wise crack about spotting some man made bricks in this ring...there are entire mountain sides of almost perfect bricks and shingles in all colors from red, to blue, green and brown....take a closer look at this picture, there are a lot of "bricks" and a lot of almost perfect "shingles":

It really sucks if You cant` even show a picture, because after this I don`t have a whole lot I want to say and rather sit back to see what thoughts You guys have about this material...don`t keep me waiting too long. Soon I`m planning to move back north again..I just don`t fit in where we are at the moment and where I returning to there are no phones and no Internet, but lots of glaciers!
Oh yeah do Polar bears drown or starve when the ice melts like it did every summer for X 1000 Years?...
Does he look staved to You...I have hundreds and hundreds of such polarbear pictures, they all looked pretty healthy to me, just like that one:

They LOVE SWIMMING!!!
Oh Gee, almost forgot to link to the pictures which make it pretty clear how different snow deposits here ...where it hardly ever snows as people in the south understand it we have mostly "snow dunes"...I guess You could call them "drifts" but they are pretty bis drifts, which form under their own weight Ice:

Notice how sparse the snow is on one side and how deep (hundreds of feet) on the "lee-side":

That`s not how "Donner Pass" looks were it dumps snow in the Wintertime..
It NEVER dumps snow up in the arctic..well hardly ever and the Mountains and the landscape tell You a story that spans who knows how many thousands of years.
Now I wish I would get some honest answers from a well proven and seasoned Geologist who does`nt smoke pot, how on earth these phony rising average temperatures have anything to do with how much blowing snow is trapped by these mountains and the terrain-turbulence. Even a Geologist should know, that the "colder" the snow is the easier the wind keeps stripping it from the mountains in Greenland + Ellesmere and then You have consequently less snow left behind to form glaciers.
And that applies summer and winter...it`s not that there is no snow in theses mountains in the summer...hey when the wind kicks up in the summer in these mountains you are blinded by snow, just like in a Sahara sandstorm!
Like I said, these "climatologists" say one thing , these mountains told me all these years I watched them an entirely different story


I am getting TOTALLY annoyed by this 15 Post B.S. I got flagged over and over again and had to go over it with a fine toothcomb till I found where this idiotic editor put a {UrL} where I never asked it too and then refused my post till I finally found it.
I don`t think I will continue posting here again, as if I have don`t any better things to do than putting up with B.S. Like that...so Bye You`all
It`s been nice knowing You

hey, hang in there
the limits on posting links till after 15 posts is to give spammers a harder time, its an annoyance, but its a needed one

 

[Douger]

It's perfectly obvious to anyone but dumb fucking brainwashed murkins.
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kp4ASr43e1I&feature=related[/ame]

 

[Douger]

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UcWpkWBX04E&feature=related[/ame]

 

[polarbear]

Hey THAAAAANK YOUUUUU! for doing that...just came back here to add a few more of my "picture ghosts"....and noticed what You did here for me!
You know I`m the kind of guy who goes fishing with a shotgun and buckshot, that`s how patient I am!

And thats what You see when You get there in the Summer and look out the window when the Command Pilot says hey guys buckle up we`re gonna touchdown in a few seconds...
The ENTIRE approach is littered like that:

augsburger-allgemeine.de/forum/members/bernhardb-albums-5481-noch+mehr-picture23758-noch-mehr.jpg

I guess that`s why "climatologists" rather look at Sat-pics in a city down south than go there to see for themselves.
Do polar bears starve when it`s "warm" near the pole?

community.augsburger-allgemeine.de/forum/members/bernhardb-albums-5510-alltagsbilder-picture23918-alltagsbilder.jpg

A stray "climatologist" might well be an easy snack...no they look just as well fed on and off the ice...and that is in the summer too..else it would be dark no matter what the time of day...it`s on the permanent ice pack:

community.augsburger-allgemeine.de/forum/members/bernhardb-albums-5502-sammelsurium-picture23860-sammelsurium.jpg

And that is at the exact geographic North Pole...also in the summer:

community.augsburger-allgemeine.de/forum/members/bernhardb-albums-5502-sammelsurium-picture23862-sammelsurium.jpg

Only You can`t see the "Pole" You have to bring Your own...is it warm there in Midsummer,...?... Hell no!:

community.augsburger-allgemeine.de/forum/members/bernhardb-albums-5502-sammelsurium-picture23861-sammelsurium.jpg

And that what this Base really was and still is:

community.augsburger-allgemeine.de/forum/members/bernhardb-albums-5503-damals+und+heute-picture23864-damals-und-heute.jpg

A listening post...only we have much fancier "gadgets" today...the one at the South Pole is pretty well the same thing...it`s a tid for tad "sister station".
All "Mil-sats '" are on "polar Orbits" They up- and download there with a very tight "footprint".

Was there more "precip" or snow in 1958 than today...No it was then also officially classified as a "desert area"...so where does that leave "global warming"...????...:

community.augsburger-allgemeine.de/forum/members/bernhardb-albums-5503-damals+und+heute-picture23865-damals-und-heute.jpg

Spammers, O.K. I understand now...I guess it was for far too long my job to yell at the ranks...Sorry folks, we`re civilians now,...I`m recently retired and have yet to learn to adjust to that!