9 - 9 - 9 for a business owner

If you've ever run a US corporation and you paid nearly 30% in corp tax, you probably had such an amazing year that you let it catch you by surprise or you were too cheap to hire a tax-pro or become one yourself.

Whatever the reason, it is your own damn fault not Bush or Obama's. I gather that our tax system drives corporate retained earnings into capitalization and salaries/bonuses.

This is why businesses don't really pay that stuff, anyways. If you think the rate is too high, you probably don't understand what's going on. If you think businesses are 'getting away' with cheating taxes, the same applies: you're not counting on the combined tax liability from employing folks, for starters.
 
That assumes that ALL items would be taxable.
For example, necessities would most likely be tax exempt. In New Jersey for instance clothing, paper goods for school and business, shoes and unprepared foods are all tax exempt.
The federal national sales tax could very likely be modeled in this way.
That pretty much trumps your idea.
One thing is clear, government cannot control an individuals money management or lack thereof. Poor people are poor not only because they earn less, but because they spend unwisely. That cannot be everyone else's problem. As a matter of fact, middle class people who have the availability of credit often fall into this very same trap of spending far more than their means currently allows. That is supposed to be our problem as well?
You're stuck in the paradigm of "10% of 10,000 is more than 10% of 100,000". It isn't
Each person is left with 90% of their money. The next thing we deal with is the "fairness argument". That's when I get a case of ADD.
The fairness argument always, at least from the point of of view of the Lef,t ends up in the realm of punishment of those who are higher earners.

I'd leave the fairness bit to little kids to concern themselves. Fairness has (and should have) little or nothing to do with determining tax policy.

While making necessities exempt would preclude starvation, taxing consumption in a consumer economy is not a good idea. Certainly, I don't advocate building policy around folks who can't account for their next meal here in the easiest place in the world to eat.

That said, a tax on goods is more inflationary while still communicating weaker demand for goods... that is a pinch that will be born by profit-margins, and ultimately by the people in the economy. All tax is like that, but sales tax is worse because it directly affects demand
Do most people pay state and city sales taxes or not?
Let's use Canada as an example for a moment. Here is a society in which Liberalism is the rule. There is a federal goods and services tax (GST) then each Province has a sales tax of it's own. Many large Canadian cities also require merchants to collect city sales taxes.
The last time I was in Montreal in 2002 the effective sales tax was around 25%. That's GST ,Provincial( in some provinces an HST or Harmonized Sales Tax) and City taxes combined.
There are poor people in Canada as well.
http://www.americantaxpolicyinstitute.org/pdf/VAT/Bird-Gendron.pdf

Most states/counties have sales tax.

Why do you keep bringing up poor people and policies from countries which don't perform like ours?

I stay away from considering broke-asses and Canada when I'm thinking about how America should be.
 
Foxy....let me try again. The reason our economy sucks has nothing to do with the statutory corporate tax rate. Your repeating the mantra, complete with the little caveat about our being just a pubic hair behid Japan , in arguing your point is disingenuous.

US corporations are friggin' exploding with profits.
No they are not. If that were the case, financial markets would be booming.
That is obviously not the case.

Corporate Profits After Tax Chart and Data

What is the 3-year change in the DJIA?
Last 5 years
http://finance.yahoo.com/echarts?s=^DJI#chart2:symbol=^dji;range=5y;indicator=volume;charttype=line;crosshair=on;ohlcvalues=0;logscale=off;source=undefined.....
This chart indicates your argument just dried up and blew away like a fart in the wind.
The DJIA in late 2006 was about 12,000. Today it is around 11,100. A drop of almost 9%.
And let us not forget much of the DJIA avg has been supported by QE I and QE II ...That was the federal reserve printing money and pumping it into the stock market to prop up prices. As a result we're paying over one dollar more for a gallon of gas than we were paying when Obama took office.
7.89% annualized rate....That bothers you? Should companies be punished for raking in such obscenity?
Please.
 
I'd leave the fairness bit to little kids to concern themselves. Fairness has (and should have) little or nothing to do with determining tax policy.

While making necessities exempt would preclude starvation, taxing consumption in a consumer economy is not a good idea. Certainly, I don't advocate building policy around folks who can't account for their next meal here in the easiest place in the world to eat.

That said, a tax on goods is more inflationary while still communicating weaker demand for goods... that is a pinch that will be born by profit-margins, and ultimately by the people in the economy. All tax is like that, but sales tax is worse because it directly affects demand
Do most people pay state and city sales taxes or not?
Let's use Canada as an example for a moment. Here is a society in which Liberalism is the rule. There is a federal goods and services tax (GST) then each Province has a sales tax of it's own. Many large Canadian cities also require merchants to collect city sales taxes.
The last time I was in Montreal in 2002 the effective sales tax was around 25%. That's GST ,Provincial( in some provinces an HST or Harmonized Sales Tax) and City taxes combined.
There are poor people in Canada as well.
http://www.americantaxpolicyinstitute.org/pdf/VAT/Bird-Gendron.pdf

Most states/counties have sales tax.

Why do you keep bringing up poor people and policies from countries which don't perform like ours?

I stay away from considering broke-asses and Canada when I'm thinking about how America should be.
Other posters maintain sales taxes are regressive. That seems to be the argument they use against a national sales tax.
I used Canada as an example of where VAT's can and do work.
Getting down to brass tacks( since you opened the door) how should America "be"?
 
But when it becomes far more profitable to do business elsewhere than it is to do business here, the companies, both those American born and everybody else, will go about their business elsewhere.

So ask yourself. Which is more important? The government imposing ever more expensive taxes, mandates, and regulation on American business? Or for American business to have as much freedom as possible to make profits and therefore hire and pay people here?

The political class answers that question much differently than does mainstream America. You call yourself inthemiddle. Are you really?

This argument is always a load of horse shit. It's a hypothetical that is always thrown out for propaganda purposes to raise alarms, but never comes true. Because in actuality, it's an absurdity.

Do you think that Wal-Mart will make more money by operating in the US, or less money? How about McDonald's? How about Exxon? How about AT&T? How about Darden Restaurants (parent corporation for Red Lobster and Olive Garden)? How about Gap Stores? Of course, the answer is that they are going to make more money. And if they decide to close down all US operations, they will make less money. We live in a global market where large corporations already operate in other regions. Many of them have even failed to expand into certain parts of the globe, making their current markets their venues by necessity. For example, Wal-Mart failed in China.

At the end of the day, it doesn't matter if we so over-taxed these corporations so much they each only made $10,000 in profit at the end of each year. That's still a profit they would lose if they ever decided to close down operations in the US that they would not be able to replace elsewhere.

And even if all these corporations decided to go ahead and close down, that's not going to eliminate demand in our country. You still need clothes. You still gotta eat. You still need communication. You still need gas in your car. You still want a television. As long as there is a market, there will be someone willing to do business. Mostly, it would be smaller businesses that would fill the void. And I have to be honest with you, I'm alot more interested in seeing small businesses be successful than I am any corporation because thriving small businesses are 100x more valuable to our economy than any big INC.
Every single company function you mentioned was that of products being marketed in this country. You do not take into account manufacturing and corporate headquarters. General Electric already has one foot out the door. If US corporations take their operations overseas, and they are, they can dodge US corporate taxes completely, and only pay sales taxes into state coffers.

In the end the only revenues enjoyed by the US treasury will be for their American operations unless tariffs are charged for imports. That's a sure way of raising US domestic living standards (not). Of course US employees of overseas corporations would continue to pay federal individual taxes as they already do.

Which brings to mind the best situation, which would be if corporate income taxes were completely scrapped, and income taxed entirely at the individual level. Then the best situation would exist for corporations to actually manufacture things here, and plow their corporate income into expansion, research & development, and exploration, among other growth activities in the US.
 
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You just showed massive Ignorance. Lets examine your Statement. In a Nut shell you are saying if Companies do not like the System here, they can go somewhere else.

News Flash- They are, ever heard of Out sourcing?

Try something....Go to the grocery store, pick out a few groceries, go pay for them at the register, and then ask yourself how the company is going to be able to possibly outsource the business transaction that just took place. Now, go to the barber shop and get a haircut, and ask yourself how that business transaction can possibly be outsourced. Then, go to the mechanic and get your oil changed and ask yourself how that transaction can possibly be outsourced. Outsourcing happens only in certain areas where it is possible, largely manufacturing. And the reason it happens is because the US has very poor trade policy which allows products to be imported, but prevents our products from being exported anywhere near as easily or economically.

Then you say someone else will take their place.

News Flash- No they wont, as long as we make it difficult to do business and make a Profit in the US, companies will move jobs over seas, and nobody will "Gladly make money here" Because the reason the Jobs left in the first place is it is to difficult to make money here.

Really? So you mean to tell me that as long as there are people in the US who need food, nobody is going to be willing to grow food and sell it? You're telling me that the US lives or dies on the profits of corporations? That's a ridiculous comment. What did we do before big corporations were as rampant as they are today? We relied on small businesses alot more, that's what we did.

Nobody is making it difficult to make a profit in the US. That kind of babbling is absolute horse shit. The problem is that our culture has moved into a place where those at the top of large corporations insist that billions of dollars worth of post tax yearly profit is not enough, and demand tax breaks.

The United States of America is the best place in the world to do business, and it is a VERY FAR way from being difficult to make a profit. If a big corporation doesn't want to do business here, that's their own stupidity. And like I said, in my opinion we'll probably be better off anyway, because it will just leave room for small businesses to fill the void, and small business fuels our economy much more than large corporations ever could.


Of course there will always be service jobs, However we need the very jobs that can out sourced, to stay in the country. We need Manufacturing.

If the United States is still the best place in the world to do business, then why are so many Jobs being out sourced?

A combination of,

High Labor Costs
Heavy Regulations
one of the highest Cooperate Tax Rates in the world
and Mandates like Health Care

Mean the US is most Definitely not the Best place to do business.

We have a lot of wealth and consume a lot, which makes this a place people still do want to do business. But they don't want to make things here, They just want to sell us stuff, they don't want to employ us, and they don't want to by what were selling. Because we can't make anything Cheap.
 
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Tariffs will do 2 things possibly.

1 - Cause a war. One of the biggest reasons for the Push for world Free Trade is that before Countries fought wars over Trade Polices. We slap a bunch of Tariffs on China right now what do you think will happen? China needs us as much as we need them. They rely on us as a Market for their goods.

2 - If you make it more Expensive to make Products over seas and bring them here, and you will hurt the poor in America. The Poor Rely on Cheap Products made over seas to live a standard of Living that looks down right rich compared to most of the Worlds Poor.

2 TV's in every house, Smart Phones, Computers, Toys for their kids. Etc Etc. The Poor In America have access to affordable Goods because of our Markets access to the Cheap labor Over seas. You don't want to know how much that new TV, or that Toy Car for your kid, will cost if it was made Entirely in the US.
 
Do most people pay state and city sales taxes or not?
Let's use Canada as an example for a moment. Here is a society in which Liberalism is the rule. There is a federal goods and services tax (GST) then each Province has a sales tax of it's own. Many large Canadian cities also require merchants to collect city sales taxes.
The last time I was in Montreal in 2002 the effective sales tax was around 25%. That's GST ,Provincial( in some provinces an HST or Harmonized Sales Tax) and City taxes combined.
There are poor people in Canada as well.
http://www.americantaxpolicyinstitute.org/pdf/VAT/Bird-Gendron.pdf

Most states/counties have sales tax.

Why do you keep bringing up poor people and policies from countries which don't perform like ours?

I stay away from considering broke-asses and Canada when I'm thinking about how America should be.
Other posters maintain sales taxes are regressive. That seems to be the argument they use against a national sales tax.
I used Canada as an example of where VAT's can and do work.
Getting down to brass tacks( since you opened the door) how should America "be"?

I see. They are regressive, but folks got to realize that poor folks will always have some loophole created to stem bedlam and maintain the country's dignity.

A Canadian or Romanian example of 'working' might not apply in our economy, particularly granted consumption is the biggest factor going here. Federal taxes on intra-state commerce does not seem likely here, either.

I would throw down a big-league hijack espousing on Money's America, but it wont be anything to do with major tax system overhauls. Politicians and the voters who stir them up need to realize that most American businesses are built around the way things are... the way things are is built around American business and Americans as well. Not advisable to make such a change [that] nixes features like deductibility, etc.
 
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Every single company function you mentioned was that of products being marketed in this country. You do not take into account manufacturing and corporate headquarters. General Electric already has one foot out the door. If US corporations take their operations overseas, and they are, they can dodge US corporate taxes completely, and only pay sales taxes into state coffers.

In the end the only revenues enjoyed by the US treasury will be for their American operations unless tariffs are charged for imports. That's a sure way of raising US domestic living standards (not). Of course US employees of overseas corporations would continue to pay federal individual taxes as they already do.

Which brings to mind the best situation, which would be if corporate income taxes were completely scrapped, and income taxed entirely at the individual level. Then the best situation would exist for corporations to actually manufacture things here, and plow their corporate income into expansion, research & development, and exploration, among other growth activities in the US.

Like I said, that is an issue of our country's imbalanced trade policies. But first, let's be honest. The reason companies manufacture elsewhere is for labor costs, not for taxation reasons. Also, a fact that many people are trying to ignore is that any wealth generated in the US, regardless of where your office is located, is taxed in the US. Also, as has been noted already in this thread, corporations that do business in foreign countries are actually paying more in foreign taxes than in domestic taxes. So the taxation argument is really done and demonstratively false. The main problem is foreign manufacturing. And that could be fixed (maybe not completely, but substantially) by applying more equal tariffs to imported goods. Why do you think Toyota has US based plants? Because it is cheaper for them to manufacture in the US (and pay their employees significantly better than many other domestic workers) than it is for them to produce elsewhere and import (and to be fair, that has more to do with the costs associated with shipping automobiles than tariffs, but I'm sure you get the idea).
 
Most states/counties have sales tax.

Why do you keep bringing up poor people and policies from countries which don't perform like ours?

I stay away from considering broke-asses and Canada when I'm thinking about how America should be.
Other posters maintain sales taxes are regressive. That seems to be the argument they use against a national sales tax.
I used Canada as an example of where VAT's can and do work.
Getting down to brass tacks( since you opened the door) how should America "be"?

I see. They are regressive, but folks got to realize that poor folks will always have some loophole created to stem bedlam and maintain the country's dignity.

A Canadian or Romanian example of 'working' might not apply in our economy, particularly granted consumption is the biggest factor going here. Federal taxes on intra-state commerce does not seem likely here, either.

I would throw down a big-league hijack espousing on Money's America, but it wont be anything to do with major tax system overhauls. Politicians and the voters who stir them up need to realize that most American businesses are built around the way things are... the way things are is built around American business and Americans as well. Not advisable to make such a change nixes features like deductibility, etc.

The present tax structure works very well and most Americans would keep it. The problem is in the spending, and the notion that in actuality all money belongs to the gubmt and that allowing folks or corporations to keep more of what they earn than the party of government decrees is effectively a "tax expenditure."Any time a loophole (or deduction) exists it does so because of a political exigency at best, and croney capitalism at worst.

Most large corporations could not care less about the corporate tax rate, because in their minds it is just something to game and their smaller competitors will be hurt more than they and their peers, thus advantaging them over less "fit" competition. In their world, "fitness" is most determined by the platoons of attorneys, interpreters of regulations, and tax accountants they keep on salary that the upstarts can't afford.

Removing the corporate income tax and eliminating as much counterproductive regulations as reasonably possible would make that situation no longer a determining requisite for the skillset of top management, but instead developing the resources ofproductivity and innovation, IMO.
 
Other posters maintain sales taxes are regressive. That seems to be the argument they use against a national sales tax.
I used Canada as an example of where VAT's can and do work.
Getting down to brass tacks( since you opened the door) how should America "be"?

I see. They are regressive, but folks got to realize that poor folks will always have some loophole created to stem bedlam and maintain the country's dignity.

A Canadian or Romanian example of 'working' might not apply in our economy, particularly granted consumption is the biggest factor going here. Federal taxes on intra-state commerce does not seem likely here, either.

I would throw down a big-league hijack espousing on Money's America, but it wont be anything to do with major tax system overhauls. Politicians and the voters who stir them up need to realize that most American businesses are built around the way things are... the way things are is built around American business and Americans as well. Not advisable to make such a change nixes features like deductibility, etc.

The present tax structure works very well and most Americans would keep it. The problem is in the spending, and the notion that in actuality all money belongs to the gubmt and that allowing folks or corporations to keep more of what they earn than the party of government decrees is effectively a "tax expenditure."Any time a loophole (or deduction) exists it does so because of a political exigency at best, and croney capitalism at worst.

Most large corporations could not care less about the corporate tax rate, because in their minds it is just something to game and their smaller competitors will be hurt more than they and their peers, thus advantaging them over less "fit" competition. In their world, "fitness" is most determined by the platoons of attorneys, interpreters of regulations, and tax accountants they keep on salary that the upstarts can't afford.

Removing the corporate income tax and eliminating as much counterproductive regulations as reasonably possible would make that situation no longer a determining requisite for the skillset of top management, but instead developing the resources ofproductivity and innovation, IMO.

I for one see it as being too big a reform.

It should be pointed out that in my experience deductibility, even (if not especially) in complicated ways is actually the brilliant part of our system, and it welcomes you to 'game' the system in specific ways which usually pay dividends to the economy. You should be ashamed running a company which hasn't flexed off retained earnings, at least in bonuses, hires and capital. You should be taxed for that fact... and that's exactly what we have now.

I think that people want our tax system to be more commonsense, but common sense has limitations.
 
None of which changes the fact that you simply can't have a tax system constructed primarily for class warfare politics, and expect that to work in the long-term economic interests of the country. That is exactly what's wrong with the current system. It's 90% aimed at political agendas, and 10% aimed at producing a desirable economic climate. It needs to be changed. Whether that's possible, with the competing ideological agendas we have, is another matter. I've already expressed my belief that the divides in this country are beyond any likelihood of being reconcilable. In any case, the traditional paradigms don't apply anymore; anyone who doesn't understand that simply does not understand this recession, or why the traditional methods of combatting it have not worked, and why a more extreme version of the same(which is what Obama advocates) won't work either. It's the economic equivalent of "fighting the last war" rather than the one you have today. Given those circumstances there's little to lose by trying a completely new approach.
 
Whoever told you that our tax system was set up to serve ideological agendas was just trying to rustle your feathers.

You should just know better than to believe that.
 
You just showed massive Ignorance. Lets examine your Statement. In a Nut shell you are saying if Companies do not like the System here, they can go somewhere else.

News Flash- They are, ever heard of Out sourcing?

Try something....Go to the grocery store, pick out a few groceries, go pay for them at the register, and then ask yourself how the company is going to be able to possibly outsource the business transaction that just took place. Now, go to the barber shop and get a haircut, and ask yourself how that business transaction can possibly be outsourced. Then, go to the mechanic and get your oil changed and ask yourself how that transaction can possibly be outsourced. Outsourcing happens only in certain areas where it is possible, largely manufacturing. And the reason it happens is because the US has very poor trade policy which allows products to be imported, but prevents our products from being exported anywhere near as easily or economically.

Then you say someone else will take their place.

News Flash- No they wont, as long as we make it difficult to do business and make a Profit in the US, companies will move jobs over seas, and nobody will "Gladly make money here" Because the reason the Jobs left in the first place is it is to difficult to make money here.

Really? So you mean to tell me that as long as there are people in the US who need food, nobody is going to be willing to grow food and sell it? You're telling me that the US lives or dies on the profits of corporations? That's a ridiculous comment. What did we do before big corporations were as rampant as they are today? We relied on small businesses alot more, that's what we did.

Nobody is making it difficult to make a profit in the US. That kind of babbling is absolute horse shit. The problem is that our culture has moved into a place where those at the top of large corporations insist that billions of dollars worth of post tax yearly profit is not enough, and demand tax breaks.

The United States of America is the best place in the world to do business, and it is a VERY FAR way from being difficult to make a profit. If a big corporation doesn't want to do business here, that's their own stupidity. And like I said, in my opinion we'll probably be better off anyway, because it will just leave room for small businesses to fill the void, and small business fuels our economy much more than large corporations ever could.


Of course there will always be service jobs, However we need the very jobs that can out sourced, to stay in the country. We need Manufacturing.

If the United States is still the best place in the world to do business, then why are so many Jobs being out sourced?

A combination of,

High Labor Costs
Heavy Regulations
one of the highest Cooperate Tax Rates in the world
and Mandates like Health Care

Mean the US is most Definitely not the Best place to do business.

We have a lot of wealth and consume a lot, which makes this a place people still do want to do business. But they don't want to make things here, They just want to sell us stuff, they don't want to employ us, and they don't want to by what were selling. Because we can't make anything Cheap.

Just a side note here. Liberals like me want to remove this mandate on businesses ( which in our case is only on those with 50 or more employees ) and institute a single payer system.

Nutters want businesses to graciously carry at least some of the health care burden to their employees...and...in the same breath...claim that American workers ask for too much in wages.

And this is because the thought that they, as individual tax payers, might be paying for someone else's blood transplant ( which they are already doing ) freaks the fuck out of them.
 
Try something....Go to the grocery store, pick out a few groceries, go pay for them at the register, and then ask yourself how the company is going to be able to possibly outsource the business transaction that just took place. Now, go to the barber shop and get a haircut, and ask yourself how that business transaction can possibly be outsourced. Then, go to the mechanic and get your oil changed and ask yourself how that transaction can possibly be outsourced. Outsourcing happens only in certain areas where it is possible, largely manufacturing. And the reason it happens is because the US has very poor trade policy which allows products to be imported, but prevents our products from being exported anywhere near as easily or economically.



Really? So you mean to tell me that as long as there are people in the US who need food, nobody is going to be willing to grow food and sell it? You're telling me that the US lives or dies on the profits of corporations? That's a ridiculous comment. What did we do before big corporations were as rampant as they are today? We relied on small businesses alot more, that's what we did.

Nobody is making it difficult to make a profit in the US. That kind of babbling is absolute horse shit. The problem is that our culture has moved into a place where those at the top of large corporations insist that billions of dollars worth of post tax yearly profit is not enough, and demand tax breaks.

The United States of America is the best place in the world to do business, and it is a VERY FAR way from being difficult to make a profit. If a big corporation doesn't want to do business here, that's their own stupidity. And like I said, in my opinion we'll probably be better off anyway, because it will just leave room for small businesses to fill the void, and small business fuels our economy much more than large corporations ever could.


Of course there will always be service jobs, However we need the very jobs that can out sourced, to stay in the country. We need Manufacturing.

If the United States is still the best place in the world to do business, then why are so many Jobs being out sourced?

A combination of,

High Labor Costs
Heavy Regulations
one of the highest Cooperate Tax Rates in the world
and Mandates like Health Care

Mean the US is most Definitely not the Best place to do business.

We have a lot of wealth and consume a lot, which makes this a place people still do want to do business. But they don't want to make things here, They just want to sell us stuff, they don't want to employ us, and they don't want to by what were selling. Because we can't make anything Cheap.

Just a side note here. Liberals like me want to remove this mandate on businesses ( which in our case is only on those with 50 or more employees ) and institute a single payer system.

Nutters want businesses to graciously carry at least some of the health care burden to their employees...and...in the same breath...claim that American workers ask for too much in wages.

And this is because the thought that they, as individual tax payers, might be paying for someone else's blood transplant ( which they are already doing ) freaks the fuck out of them.

Actually, that is not what 'freaks the fuck out of them'. It is the fact that in countries that have a single payer system, it is a clusterfuck. Not rocket science, and jack shit to do with not wanting to pay for other people.... although, I don't see why I should pay for some fat fuck who drinks too much, takes drugs, and lives like a pig. I just don't. Nor do I see why I should pay for infertility treatment for others, or abortion (which is against my religion), and a whole host of other 'life style choices'. But that's what we would end up with.
 
Tariffs will do 2 things possibly.

1 - Cause a war. One of the biggest reasons for the Push for world Free Trade is that before Countries fought wars over Trade Polices. We slap a bunch of Tariffs on China right now what do you think will happen? China needs us as much as we need them. They rely on us as a Market for their goods.

2 - If you make it more Expensive to make Products over seas and bring them here, and you will hurt the poor in America. The Poor Rely on Cheap Products made over seas to live a standard of Living that looks down right rich compared to most of the Worlds Poor.

2 TV's in every house, Smart Phones, Computers, Toys for their kids. Etc Etc. The Poor In America have access to affordable Goods because of our Markets access to the Cheap labor Over seas. You don't want to know how much that new TV, or that Toy Car for your kid, will cost if it was made Entirely in the US.
And why are labor costs so much here? :eusa_shhh:
 
Tariffs will do 2 things possibly.

1 - Cause a war. One of the biggest reasons for the Push for world Free Trade is that before Countries fought wars over Trade Polices. We slap a bunch of Tariffs on China right now what do you think will happen? China needs us as much as we need them. They rely on us as a Market for their goods.

2 - If you make it more Expensive to make Products over seas and bring them here, and you will hurt the poor in America. The Poor Rely on Cheap Products made over seas to live a standard of Living that looks down right rich compared to most of the Worlds Poor.

2 TV's in every house, Smart Phones, Computers, Toys for their kids. Etc Etc. The Poor In America have access to affordable Goods because of our Markets access to the Cheap labor Over seas. You don't want to know how much that new TV, or that Toy Car for your kid, will cost if it was made Entirely in the US.
And why are labor costs so much here? :eusa_shhh:

Because America is No. 1! American workers are the best in the world....bar none. Yeeeeeehaaawwwww! Where's my gaddamned flag lapel pin? I need to represent.
 

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