84 schools in England show NO white British pupils...

[Challenger]

For all you have to do is present your negative opinion of my motives, and character, and dismiss all evidence or argument to the contrary.

Well you've not provided any evidence or argument, merely presented your negative opinion of my motives and character, while dismissing or reinterpreting any evidence or argument that was contrary to your views. So coming from you, that's rich.

 

[Correll]

We have gone over this point repeatedly.

Yes we have, and you have still failed to grasp it, preferring instead to promote your agenda

I have debunked your claims with your own words, repeatedly.

Only on your planet, in the real world, not so much.

1. Your words.


" I worked for Tarmac about that time and we found Eastern European migrant workers just as skilled as their British counterparts but they were more reliable and worked harder for the same rate of pay, hiring them was a no brainer; the free market can be a bitch to those who get complacent and lazy."


Thus, it is not about Brits NOT being willing to do the work, but about employers wanting better workers than they can get from a First World nation without increasing pay.


2. YOur words.

"Where will you get the money from? These foreign medical professionals were attracted because the NHS paid more than they earned in their home countries; raise the wages to what a native would expect and you'd bankrupt the NHS, which is cracking at the seams already. Haven't you heard, we live in an age of "austerity"."


It is not that Brits won't do the work, it's that immigrants will do it cheaper.

 

[Correll]

This is a debate you cannot lose.

Yup, when you are in the right, that's pretty much a foregone conclusion.

1. Odd the way you cut the part where I describe the reason you can't lose is because you are a dishonest prick,

2. and that you goals are to unfairly smear those you cannot best in honest debate,

3. and to change the subject from a policy that you cannot honestly defend.

And by "odd" I mean completely to be expected from a dishonest leftist partisan propagandist.


Oh, btw.

 

[Correll]

2. And yes. In 1953, Bassey signed her first professional contract, to sing in the touring variety show Memories of Jolson, a musical based on the life of Al Jolson. I guarantee there were other applicants for that job.

....and she was deemed the best applicant, so she got the job. If there was no immigration at all and this was a pure white Anglo-Saxon country, the best candidate would STILL get the job, and there would still be people with shattered dreams and ambitions.

And thus she DID "hold back native talent".

Thus there is a negligible benefit to the UK, in that Bassey was slightly better than the next to best singer,

while the cost is that one "native talent" UK citizen was denied that opportunity.


If you want to show a benefit to the UK from immigration, you have to show something good that happened to the UK, that could NOT have happened without immigration.

Showing a good singer who happens to be a child off an immigrant does NOT do that.

The UK would still have had excellent singers without immigration.

You are a riot kid. People are laughing at you. Nobody is that dumb.

Kind of begs the question what would,in your mature opinion, be "something good" ?

From the post you just "responded to", two sentences above your post, you moron.


"If you want to show a benefit to the UK from immigration, you have to show something good that happened to the UK, that could NOT have happened without immigration."


BTW, asshole, nothing in your post challenged my point about Bassey.

Shirley is a unique talent. There is no next in line. She made the world a better place. You know that she isnt a muslim dont you ?

There was someone next in line. There were other great singers.

SHe recorded a theme song for Thunderball.

Then the studio had Dionne Warwick rerecord it.

THen they decided to go with Tom Jones.

Was the world a "worse" place because Tom Jones sang the theme for Thunderball, rather than Shirley Bassey?

No.

If you want to show a benefit to the UK from immigration, you have to show something good that happened to the UK, that could NOT have happened without immigration.

 

[Correll]

For all you have to do is present your negative opinion of my motives, and character, and dismiss all evidence or argument to the contrary.

Well you've not provided any evidence or argument, merely presented your negative opinion of my motives and character, while dismissing or reinterpreting any evidence or argument that was contrary to your views. So coming from you, that's rich.

That is what is commonly known as a lie.

You opened with the claim that immigrants were needed because native born white uk citizens would not do those jobs.

I posted links showing that was not true.

You then claimed that the immigrants worked cheaper or better than the native born white uk citizens.

I pointed out that that was putting the interests of the employers over that of the more numerous workers.

You did some hemming and hawing and are now trying to change the subject.

I have asked some questions about your motivation, seeing as how your own words have debunked your original stated reason for supporting High Levels of Immigration, but you still hold to your position.

After all, if you have admitted that you know your stated reason for a position is not true, and you have,

and then you still hold to your position,

logically that demonstrates that your stated reason was not your real reason.

 

[Vagabond63]

Has the EU shown any interest in respecting the democratically expressed will of various national populations who want to protect themselves, their economy and their culture?

If these "various national populations who want to protect themselves, their economy and their culture" voted in EU elections they might be taken more seriously.

What EU elections, as the people are not allowed to vote on such matters, that is only for the unelected eurocrats in Brussels to decide. When were you ever asked to vote on a bail out for Greece or the length of a cucumber

Can I respectfully suggest when anyone was ever asked to vote on whether they wanted their children to be forced to go to academies, or to build a hugely expensive fleet of aircraft carriers?

The European Parliament is directly elected by all EU citizens. The "unelected Eurocrats in Brussels" no longer have the power to make laws and rulings without the consent of the EUP since Maastricht in 1992. The powers of the European Parliament have increased over time and lately it has been showing signs of "independance" from national governments. Like the saying goes if you don't vote, you can't bitch about the government you get.

WRONG as the men in grey suits are the ones making the laws, the elected members just do as they are told and vote the laws in. The laws are made by unelected civil servants and unless you live in Europe you wont understand how this can happen. Maastricht has been scrapped many times over by new legislation that handed the reigns of power to the neo Marxists in control of EU departments. They say carrots must be orange and straight and we see thousands of tons being fed to the animals.

That might have been true in the 1970's but a lot has changed in the last 40 years, the Commission can only propose laws and the EU Parliament amends or rejects them. The EU Parliament appoints and can dismiss Commissioners, so the balance of power has shifted dramatically towards a far more democratic EU. In 2009, for example, the EU abolished many red-tape regulations, including those regarding the curvature of fruit and vegetables.

There are a lot of "Euromyths" put about by Right-wingers and Euroskeptics and also Left-wingers and Pro-Europeans to pursue their respective agendas.

This piece by the BBC explains some of the more whacky ones:

BBC NEWS | Europe | Guide to the best euromyths

Enjoy.

 

[Vagabond63]

As regards jobs Brits won't do, I found these interesting articles on the subject:

More foreign workers needed to do farm work unemployed and "lazy" Brits won't do

Let more immigrants into UK because Brits won't take our jobs, says

 

[Correll]

As regards jobs Brits won't do, I found these interesting articles on the subject:

More foreign workers needed to do farm work unemployed and "lazy" Brits won't do

Let more immigrants into UK because Brits won't take our jobs, says

Migrant farm workers might actually be a job so crappy that First World Citizens won't do it.

I have not heard firm numbers on how many of those are required.

It is not the huge levels of immigration we see today.


Pizza workers?

Err, Yeah. They can raise their wages, or the world can limp along with one less pizza chain.

Fuck them if they think their desire to underpay their workers is more important than the well being of the nation as a whole.

 

[Unkotare]

As regards jobs Brits won't do, I found these interesting articles on the subject:

More foreign workers needed to do farm work unemployed and "lazy" Brits won't do

Let more immigrants into UK because Brits won't take our jobs, says

Migrant farm workers might actually be a job so crappy that First World Citizens won't do it.

I have not heard firm numbers on how many of those are required.

It is not the huge levels of immigration we see today.


Pizza workers?

Err, Yeah. They can raise their wages, or the world can limp along with one less pizza chain.

Fuck them if they think their desire to underpay their workers is more important than the well being of the nation as a whole.

Are you still here pretending to be British?

 

[Correll]

As regards jobs Brits won't do, I found these interesting articles on the subject:

More foreign workers needed to do farm work unemployed and "lazy" Brits won't do

Let more immigrants into UK because Brits won't take our jobs, says

Migrant farm workers might actually be a job so crappy that First World Citizens won't do it.

I have not heard firm numbers on how many of those are required.

It is not the huge levels of immigration we see today.


Pizza workers?

Err, Yeah. They can raise their wages, or the world can limp along with one less pizza chain.

Fuck them if they think their desire to underpay their workers is more important than the well being of the nation as a whole.

Are you still here pretending to be British?

Took me a second to remember what you were about.

BTW, are you claiming, since you "aren't british" that you don't have an opinion on what we are discussing?

 

[Unkotare]

As regards jobs Brits won't do, I found these interesting articles on the subject:

More foreign workers needed to do farm work unemployed and "lazy" Brits won't do

Let more immigrants into UK because Brits won't take our jobs, says

Migrant farm workers might actually be a job so crappy that First World Citizens won't do it.

I have not heard firm numbers on how many of those are required.

It is not the huge levels of immigration we see today.


Pizza workers?

Err, Yeah. They can raise their wages, or the world can limp along with one less pizza chain.

Fuck them if they think their desire to underpay their workers is more important than the well being of the nation as a whole.

Are you still here pretending to be British?

Took me a second to remember what you were about.

BTW, are you claiming, since you "aren't british" that you don't have an opinion on what we are discussing?

I'm saying you are not British, and you should stop pretending to be.