? 4 those of all faiths ....why do you think god allows...

[strollingbones]

i have a question for those of all faiths and those who have none....

why would a just and righteous god allow what is going on to go on?

why would he allow his beloved children to hate each other over beliefs in him or her?

i see people like benny hinn (the faith healer) and wonder why god doesnt strike him dead? do you ever wonder about this?

 

[p kirkes]

Sin, man's fall (corporately), God's redemption (individually), man restored (individually), then comes the end of time and eternal life for those who chose to be saved. God loves man and doesn't want the race to be lost, but we do have free will and God did not take that away or otherwise we couldn't choose to love him or not. Works for me.

 

[José]

The good, old Problem of Evil.

An all powerful, all loving God would not allow evil in His works.

If he wants to end evil and can't he's not all powerful. If he can but doesn't want to he's not all loving. Despite all the best efforts of countless generations of theologians the fact is the conundrum simply does not have a satisfactory answer.

My personal answer is that good and evil are merely abstractions that are created soon after rational beings appear on a given planet. These two concepts do not have any "external validation" IMO.

I fully understand the consequences of my belief are too frightful for most people to consider. This belief basically means there's no real difference between historical characters like Jesus and Hitler outside of the human brain.

 

[uscitizen]

i have a question for those of all faiths and those who have none....

why would a just and righteous god allow what is going on to go on?

why would he allow his beloved children to hate each other over beliefs in him or her?

i see people like benny hinn (the faith healer) and wonder why god doesnt strike him dead? do you ever wonder about this?

Benny Hinn is a hoot. What is sad is that people believe in him.

I have not reviewed the thread yet but I assume you will hear it is becuase god gives people a choice. Obey him or burn in hell for all eternity.

And judging from the bible heaven is not such a good place either. 1/3? of the angels revolted and Satan used to be in heaven as well.
War in heaven? Well I suppose that would be heaven for some...

 

[Harry Dresden]

i have a question for those of all faiths and those who have none....

why would a just and righteous god allow what is going on to go on?

why would he allow his beloved children to hate each other over beliefs in him or her?

i see people like benny hinn (the faith healer) and wonder why god doesnt strike him dead? do you ever wonder about this?

Bones....many years ago this guy i knew was into studying Religions of all kinds,told me that the reason he got from studying the very old writings,was that Lucifer called out GOD in front of their fellows, where ever it is they live,about us little old humans.....basically Lucifer said we have no integrity and if it wasnt for what God has given us,we would spit in his face if he wasnt there,and are not worth his efforts......so since all the eyes of "Heaven" were now focused on "GOD"...........still hanging with me?............and since Lucifer was not the only one who felt this way....GOD had to do something because he said that the great Majority of us Humans HAVE integrity AND ARE worth his attention.......so he said he will turn his back on us for a period of time.....and apparently Lucifer has left his Message with us and GOD had let the one called Jesus come and leave his Message with us......well here we are......the pawns in a battle of some vastly superior beings......everyone still awake?......

 

[jillian]

i have a question for those of all faiths and those who have none....

why would a just and righteous god allow what is going on to go on?

why would he allow his beloved children to hate each other over beliefs in him or her?

i see people like benny hinn (the faith healer) and wonder why god doesnt strike him dead? do you ever wonder about this?

because people are allowed free will. and that free will allows them to do not such good things. i don't think G-d is a micromanager.

or maybe he is and there's a reason for it.

 

[José]

Originally posted by jillian
because people are allowed free will. and that free will allows them to do not such good things.

So he's not an all loving God.

A totally righteous spiritual entity would not create a "soap opera", a "video game" where his creation would be allowed to opt between good and evil, kindness and cruelty.

 

[zzzz]

Do you punish your children when the disobey? Do you love them? We all all God's children yet we were born in sin. Jesus is the our Savior and only through him can you become one of the saved ones. The trials and tribulations we go through test our commitment to God. Yes many bad things happen in the world, but the world is Satan's playground and it is through him that these bad things happen. God allows this because Adam and Eve chose to violate the law and God sentenced human kind to live in Satan's world. Temptation will always exist until Jesus returns.

 

[SFC Ollie]

Without Free will and the power to choose ones destiny, there is no real life or love.

 

[jillian]

Originally posted by jillian
because people are allowed free will. and that free will allows them to do not such good things.

So he's not an all loving God.

A totally righteous spiritual entity would not create a "soap opera", a "video game" where his creation would be allowed to opt between good and evil, kindness and cruelty.

it doesn't have anything to do with love.

what use would people be to G-d if they were only automatons. wouldn't that kind of destroy the point of reward in the afterlife?

because if you're just doing what you're programmed to do, then what is being rewarded?

 

[Big Black Dog]

Why do you think God allows (fill in the blank). I do not know. I don't believe it's a good thing to question God. My belief is that the biggest majority of what happens to us here on Earth is God's will. We mess the rest of it up ourselves. That works for me.

 

[HUGGY]

i have a question for those of all faiths and those who have none....

why would a just and righteous god allow what is going on to go on?

why would he allow his beloved children to hate each other over beliefs in him or her?

i see people like benny hinn (the faith healer) and wonder why god doesnt strike him dead? do you ever wonder about this?

I think he is looking for more human sacrifice. Virgins in the volcano...that kinda thing...

 

[José]

Lots and lots of messages but absolutely no answer to strollingbones' questions:

why would a just and righteous god allow what is going on to go on?

why would he allow his beloved children to hate each other over beliefs in him or her?

A God who favors the freedom of his creatures to do evil over goodness itself is not the totally righteous spiritual being described in Judeo-Christian theology.

 

[Mad Scientist]

Lots and lots of messages but absolutely no answer to strollingbones' questions:

why would a just and righteous god allow what is going on to go on?

why would he allow his beloved children to hate each other over beliefs in him or her?

A God who favors the freedom of his creatures to do evil over goodness itself is not the totally righteous spiritual being described in Judeo-Christian theology.

Yeah I mean, why would God allow Islam to continue?

 

[José]

LOL, scientist.

Ask an honest question and get a smartass...

 

[Big Fitz]

i have a question for those of all faiths and those who have none....

why would a just and righteous god allow what is going on to go on?

why would he allow his beloved children to hate each other over beliefs in him or her?

i see people like benny hinn (the faith healer) and wonder why god doesnt strike him dead? do you ever wonder about this?

There are 2 main concepts here to consider.

The first is Free Will. You must have the ability to make choices free of coercion. This means that God cannot be proven conclusively like a mathematical formula or chemical experiment. If that could be done, then you could not have free will because God would be a fact like Gravity or light or the moon. No, there must be the ability to doubt. Of course He allows for circumstantial evidence, but this is not conclusive. The Bible tells that nature would cry out for his existence, yet, people could not use it as proof beyond doubt that no one could deny. This must be there to allow for you to not choose to believe in Him. So, this means that our sin and rebellion against Him must exist as well. But also promised by scripture that time for creation is limited, and that He will bring it to an end.

The question is then, why free will? Because God wants the greatest gift we as a creation could ever give him: Love. Love must be given freely for it to exist. You must also have the choice to be indifferent or even hate. You could not hate a provable creator. That would be foolhardy and therefore your love, knowing without faith, His existence would always be in question. Through this veil of doubt and faith can you express love purely for Him. He is unprovable, therefore you must choose to believe in him despite any evidence for or against. Once you believe that He exists, you must choose to love Him or hate Him ultimately. So that too must be given the choice to do that as well.

Those are the main reasons that I see we even exist and that this world is such a pall of suffering and woe of our own creation.

Now of course there is a third possible concept some believe in. Don't ask me to play research monkey, I'm just talking what some people believe here. If you're that curious, you will be able to find information I'm sure.

According to some, based on scripture and associated writings, this reality is the result of the original rebellion of Satan. It is said in some writings that Satan, once thrown down by God with a third of the angels, Lucifer as he was known then, accused God of being unjust for the punishment of Hell. To prove that He was just and righteous in all things, He created all of this reality and Earth as a test case to prove His righteousness to all creation that He was not these accusations Lucifer levelled against him. Of course, Satan decided to tamper with the test (probably forgetting God's omniscience) and tried to rig the 'program' so to speak and caused Adam and Eve to fall. Then in doing so, the prophecy of Christ came about even then that Satan's attempts would ultimately fail no matter his tampering. So, the long centuries have gone forth, as this test case of reality went forth proving God's righteousness of judgment on those who rebelled and all who followed them. In the process though, God gave Himself a greater reward than even having the Angels. He created Man in His image who loved him without proof before they even got to know Him.

This of course, has enraged Satan, some say, even further and has so decided to try and deprive God of as many people as possible, so he and his demons... angels who have fallen, to go forth and deceive every last human they can. They almost succeeded with Noah, but God ended that with the flood. And now, we are coming to the end times, according to many of the faith (a belief, of course held since the Apostles themselves of course) where the test case of Earth and all it's inhabitants has run it's course. God will end it, and the world, and take up all those who decided to love and follow Him and purge reality of all the rest who did not want Him, giving them the punishment they deserve for rebelling against him.

So those are some of the concepts that I have heard, understood and in some cases believe. Others are interesting possible myths will little real weight behind them. But that's faith for you... and love... and free will.

So take it in the manner of which it was offered, as enlightenment... or reject it as such.

Merry Christmas.

 

[Big Fitz]

P.S., as a Christian... I can't stand Benny Hinn either. I can't say he's a charlatan, or fraud for I don't really know about his healing powers. But he is a revolting showman who I think hurts Christianity with his histronics.

 

[José]

Fitz, at least, made an attempt to reconcile a righteous God with the existence of evil.

A failed one, IMO, but at least he tried.

 

[Big Fitz]

Fitz, at least, made an attempt to reconcile a righteous God with the existence of evil.

A failed one, IMO, but at least he tried.

Spoken like a true ignoramus.

 

[HUGGY]

i have a question for those of all faiths and those who have none....

why would a just and righteous god allow what is going on to go on?

why would he allow his beloved children to hate each other over beliefs in him or her?

i see people like benny hinn (the faith healer) and wonder why god doesnt strike him dead? do you ever wonder about this?

There are 2 main concepts here to consider.

The first is Free Will. You must have the ability to make choices free of coercion. This means that God cannot be proven conclusively like a mathematical formula or chemical experiment. If that could be done, then you could not have free will because God would be a fact like Gravity or light or the moon. No, there must be the ability to doubt. Of course He allows for circumstantial evidence, but this is not conclusive. The Bible tells that nature would cry out for his existence, yet, people could not use it as proof beyond doubt that no one could deny. This must be there to allow for you to not choose to believe in Him. So, this means that our sin and rebellion against Him must exist as well. But also promised by scripture that time for creation is limited, and that He will bring it to an end.

The question is then, why free will? Because God wants the greatest gift we as a creation could ever give him: Love. Love must be given freely for it to exist. You must also have the choice to be indifferent or even hate. You could not hate a provable creator. That would be foolhardy and therefore your love, knowing without faith, His existence would always be in question. Through this veil of doubt and faith can you express love purely for Him. He is unprovable, therefore you must choose to believe in him despite any evidence for or against. Once you believe that He exists, you must choose to love Him or hate Him ultimately. So that too must be given the choice to do that as well.

Those are the main reasons that I see we even exist and that this world is such a pall of suffering and woe of our own creation.

Now of course there is a third possible concept some believe in. Don't ask me to play research monkey, I'm just talking what some people believe here. If you're that curious, you will be able to find information I'm sure.

According to some, based on scripture and associated writings, this reality is the result of the original rebellion of Satan. It is said in some writings that Satan, once thrown down by God with a third of the angels, Lucifer as he was known then, accused God of being unjust for the punishment of Hell. To prove that He was just and righteous in all things, He created all of this reality and Earth as a test case to prove His righteousness to all creation that He was not these accusations Lucifer levelled against him. Of course, Satan decided to tamper with the test (probably forgetting God's omniscience) and tried to rig the 'program' so to speak and caused Adam and Eve to fall. Then in doing so, the prophecy of Christ came about even then that Satan's attempts would ultimately fail no matter his tampering. So, the long centuries have gone forth, as this test case of reality went forth proving God's righteousness of judgment on those who rebelled and all who followed them. In the process though, God gave Himself a greater reward than even having the Angels. He created Man in His image who loved him without proof before they even got to know Him.

This of course, has enraged Satan, some say, even further and has so decided to try and deprive God of as many people as possible, so he and his demons... angels who have fallen, to go forth and deceive every last human they can. They almost succeeded with Noah, but God ended that with the flood. And now, we are coming to the end times, according to many of the faith (a belief, of course held since the Apostles themselves of course) where the test case of Earth and all it's inhabitants has run it's course. God will end it, and the world, and take up all those who decided to love and follow Him and purge reality of all the rest who did not want Him, giving them the punishment they deserve for rebelling against him.

So those are some of the concepts that I have heard, understood and in some cases believe. Others are interesting possible myths will little real weight behind them. But that's faith for you... and love... and free will.

So take it in the manner of which it was offered, as enlightenment... or reject it as such.

Merry Christmas.

"According to some"

The weakest of all arguments. I've never used it. It would be publicly resigning myself to the public mindset. How embarrassing!