20 week Abortion act Passes House of Reps.

[Coyote]

I just wonder if people advocating for full constitutional rights from conception have followed this train to its logical conclusions or do you stop short?

 

[Chuz Life]

If someone grabbed you at a time when you were completely unaware and they managed to connect YOUR body to their own in such a way that you would DIE if that connection were broken at any time prior to ac 9 Month time period. . . Would you or would you not have a right to that person's body for the duration of that time?

Of course, I know better than to expect a direct answer to that question. I don't know why I even try.

No. The only way I would have any "right" to another's body is by express consent.

LOL

If physically connecting your body to the body of another is NOT an expression of consent then what the fuck is it?

Having sex is not consenting to pregnancy.

Yes it is.

When you drive a car are you consenting to kill some one?

When you drive one recklessly or carelessly, you are.

Sure.

 

[francoHFW]

Doesn't sound much different from what they're doing now in effect... Grandstanding by the new bulshit GOP

 

[Coyote]

No. The only way I would have any "right" to another's body is by express consent.

LOL

If physically connecting your body to the body of another is NOT an expression of consent then what the fuck is it?

Having sex is not consenting to pregnancy.

Yes it is.

When you drive a car are you consenting to kill some one?

When you drive one recklessly or carelessly, you are.

Sure.

No you aren't. Stupidity isn't consenting to kill. No one wakes up one morning thinking "I'm going to see how many people I can run over today."

 

[Chuz Life]

LOL

If physically connecting your body to the body of another is NOT an expression of consent then what the fuck is it?

Having sex is not consenting to pregnancy.

Yes it is.

When you drive a car are you consenting to kill some one?

When you drive one recklessly or carelessly, you are.

Sure.

No you aren't. Stupidity isn't consenting to kill. No one wakes up one morning thinking "I'm going to see how many people I can run over today."

When you stupidly get drunk, get high or just acting like a dumbass punk and you get behind the wheel. . .. how does the law treat you and your act of Consent when you crash into a family of four and kill them all?

 

[Coyote]

Having sex is not consenting to pregnancy.

Yes it is.

When you drive a car are you consenting to kill some one?

When you drive one recklessly or carelessly, you are.

Sure.

No you aren't. Stupidity isn't consenting to kill. No one wakes up one morning thinking "I'm going to see how many people I can run over today."

When you stupidly get drunk, get high or just acting like a dumbass punk and you get behind the wheel. . .. how does the law treat you and your act of Consent when you crash into a family of four and kill them all?

It does not change anything.

 

[Chuz Life]

Yes it is.

When you drive a car are you consenting to kill some one?

When you drive one recklessly or carelessly, you are.

Sure.

No you aren't. Stupidity isn't consenting to kill. No one wakes up one morning thinking "I'm going to see how many people I can run over today."

When you stupidly get drunk, get high or just acting like a dumbass punk and you get behind the wheel. . .. how does the law treat you and your act of Consent when you crash into a family of four and kill them all?

It does not change anything.

When the Supreme court said during Roe that if a State established personhood for children in the womb, the case FOR abortion becomes near IMPOSSIBLE to make. . . Did they say "unless the woman did not consent to the pregnancy?"

No.

The answer is no. They didn't.

 

[Coyote]

When you drive a car are you consenting to kill some one?

When you drive one recklessly or carelessly, you are.

Sure.

No you aren't. Stupidity isn't consenting to kill. No one wakes up one morning thinking "I'm going to see how many people I can run over today."

When you stupidly get drunk, get high or just acting like a dumbass punk and you get behind the wheel. . .. how does the law treat you and your act of Consent when you crash into a family of four and kill them all?

It does not change anything.

When the Supreme court said during Roe that if a State established personhood for children in the womb, the case FOR abortion becomes near IMPOSSIBLE to make. . . Did they say "unless the woman did not consent to the pregnancy?"

No.

The answer is no. They didn't.

You were asking me my opinion. Which I gave. You are giving your opinion. A woman who uses birth control is most certainly not consenting to pregnancy any more than you consent to manslaughter when you go for a drive.

Unfortunately in your world reliable birth control would be greatly reduced.

 

[Chuz Life]

When you drive one recklessly or carelessly, you are.

Sure.

No you aren't. Stupidity isn't consenting to kill. No one wakes up one morning thinking "I'm going to see how many people I can run over today."

When you stupidly get drunk, get high or just acting like a dumbass punk and you get behind the wheel. . .. how does the law treat you and your act of Consent when you crash into a family of four and kill them all?

It does not change anything.

When the Supreme court said during Roe that if a State established personhood for children in the womb, the case FOR abortion becomes near IMPOSSIBLE to make. . . Did they say "unless the woman did not consent to the pregnancy?"

No.

The answer is no. They didn't.

You were asking me my opinion. Which I gave. You are giving your opinion. A woman who uses birth control is most certainly not consenting to pregnancy any more than you consent to manslaughter when you go for a drive.

Unfortunately in your world reliable birth control would be greatly reduced.

Shows what you know.

In my world, birth control would become increasingly used and more and more effective as, without having abortion as a safety net, the demand for preventing pregnancies will increase significantly and the makers of those medicines and devices (condoms) will compete with one another to meet that demand.

 

[Issa]

I don't think that any positive comes out of the TOP, but I have to agree with them on abortion. That been said I wanna share this:


(Quran: Surah AI-Mu’minun,23:Ayat 12–14).

We (Allah) created man from a quintessence of clay. We then placed him as a nutfah (drop) in a place of settlement, firmly fixed, then We made the drop into analaqah (leech like structure), and then We changed the alaqah into amudghah (chewed like substance),then We made out of that mudghah, izam (skeleton,bones),then We clothed the bones with lahm (muscles,flesh)then We caused him to grow and come in being and attain the definitive (human)form. So, blessed be God, the best to create.

So if we arrange these stages chronologically we might come up with something like this

1. Nutfah amshaj (drop that is mixed) this stage covers the period from fertilization to implantation. This stage is further divided into: (present day germinal stage): Khalq, Taqdir, Harth.
2. Takhleeq (present day embryonic): this stage extends from the beginning of the 3rdweek until the end of the 8thweek and covers the developmental events. This stage is further divided into: Alaqah (leech-like), Mudghah (somites), Izam (skeleton) and Laham (muscles).
3. Nash”ah: (Growth) [present day Foetal stage] During this period the shaping and modelling are active,the external appearance develops in such a way that foetus becomes recognizably human.It lasts till the completion of pregnancy.It is further divided into: An-nashaa-Khalaqakha (from 9–26wks) and Al Hadana-al Rahamiya (from 26 wks to full term). This could be an apt way of classifying the various stages of human development. (3)

 

[Montrovant]

When you drive a car are you consenting to kill some one?

When you drive one recklessly or carelessly, you are.

Sure.

No you aren't. Stupidity isn't consenting to kill. No one wakes up one morning thinking "I'm going to see how many people I can run over today."

When you stupidly get drunk, get high or just acting like a dumbass punk and you get behind the wheel. . .. how does the law treat you and your act of Consent when you crash into a family of four and kill them all?

It does not change anything.

When the Supreme court said during Roe that if a State established personhood for children in the womb, the case FOR abortion becomes near IMPOSSIBLE to make. . . Did they say "unless the woman did not consent to the pregnancy?"

No.

The answer is no. They didn't.

That's not quite what the court said. Re-read the quote in your signature. If it were established that the fetus is a person under the 14th amendment, the argument for abortion would become nearly impossible to make. That doesn't mean if any state decides to pass a law saying that a fetus is a person, the USSC must now accept that as being true for all fetuses at all stages under the 14th. A state can call a fetus a person all it wants to, but unless it can establish that a fetus is a person as used in the 14th amendment, it does not fit your statement.

 

[Coyote]

No you aren't. Stupidity isn't consenting to kill. No one wakes up one morning thinking "I'm going to see how many people I can run over today."

When you stupidly get drunk, get high or just acting like a dumbass punk and you get behind the wheel. . .. how does the law treat you and your act of Consent when you crash into a family of four and kill them all?

It does not change anything.

When the Supreme court said during Roe that if a State established personhood for children in the womb, the case FOR abortion becomes near IMPOSSIBLE to make. . . Did they say "unless the woman did not consent to the pregnancy?"

No.

The answer is no. They didn't.

You were asking me my opinion. Which I gave. You are giving your opinion. A woman who uses birth control is most certainly not consenting to pregnancy any more than you consent to manslaughter when you go for a drive.

Unfortunately in your world reliable birth control would be greatly reduced.

Shows what you know.

I can only go by what I see you posting.

In my world, birth control would become increasingly used and more and more effective as, without having abortion as a safety net, the demand for preventing pregnancies will increase significantly and the makers of those medicines and devices (condoms) will compete with one another to meet that demand.

The demand is already there as is the competition. I don't think you realize that abortion is not undertaken lightly by most women nor is it cheap. Abortion is a necessary and legal safetynet.

Contraceptives have greatly improved over the years since abortion became legal...but the most effective ones still have abortive properties as a secondary protection I believe. Condoms are less effective.

European countries with far more liberal policies towards birth control and sexual education have lower rates of abortions and teen pregnancies.

That is what I would aim for, not making an important right over ones body illegal.

 

[hazlnut]

The President will sign it but blood lust Democrats/Rino's, that's doubtful...

---------------------------------



Washington (CNN)The House of Representatives passed legislation Tuesday that would criminalize abortions after 20 weeks of pregnancy, with exceptions for instances where the life of the mother is at risk and in cases involving rape or incest.

The bill passed the House by a vote of 237 for and 189 against, largely on party lines.
The Pain-Capable Unborn Child Protection Act, which is similar to legislation that failed in 2013and 2015, has support from the White House this time around.


House passes ban on abortion after 20 weeks - CNNPolitics

What about the life and/or health of fetus - Down Syndrome?

What about quality of life given certain birth defects?

 

[Chuz Life]

When you drive one recklessly or carelessly, you are.

Sure.

No you aren't. Stupidity isn't consenting to kill. No one wakes up one morning thinking "I'm going to see how many people I can run over today."

When you stupidly get drunk, get high or just acting like a dumbass punk and you get behind the wheel. . .. how does the law treat you and your act of Consent when you crash into a family of four and kill them all?

It does not change anything.

When the Supreme court said during Roe that if a State established personhood for children in the womb, the case FOR abortion becomes near IMPOSSIBLE to make. . . Did they say "unless the woman did not consent to the pregnancy?"

No.

The answer is no. They didn't.

That's not quite what the court said. Re-read the quote in your signature. If it were established that the fetus is a person under the 14th amendment, the argument for abortion would become nearly impossible to make. That doesn't mean if any state decides to pass a law saying that a fetus is a person, the USSC must now accept that as being true for all fetuses at all stages under the 14th. A state can call a fetus a person all it wants to, but unless it can establish that a fetus is a person as used in the 14th amendment, it does not fit your statement.

The court used the words "near impossible." not me.

What do you suppose they were getting at?

 

[Chuz Life]

When you stupidly get drunk, get high or just acting like a dumbass punk and you get behind the wheel. . .. how does the law treat you and your act of Consent when you crash into a family of four and kill them all?

It does not change anything.

When the Supreme court said during Roe that if a State established personhood for children in the womb, the case FOR abortion becomes near IMPOSSIBLE to make. . . Did they say "unless the woman did not consent to the pregnancy?"

No.

The answer is no. They didn't.

You were asking me my opinion. Which I gave. You are giving your opinion. A woman who uses birth control is most certainly not consenting to pregnancy any more than you consent to manslaughter when you go for a drive.

Unfortunately in your world reliable birth control would be greatly reduced.

Shows what you know.

I can only go by what I see you posting.

In my world, birth control would become increasingly used and more and more effective as, without having abortion as a safety net, the demand for preventing pregnancies will increase significantly and the makers of those medicines and devices (condoms) will compete with one another to meet that demand.

The demand is already there as is the competition. I don't think you realize that abortion is not undertaken lightly by most women nor is it cheap. Abortion is a necessary and legal safetynet.

Contraceptives have greatly improved over the years since abortion became legal...but the most effective ones still have abortive properties as a secondary protection I believe. Condoms are less effective.

European countries with far more liberal policies towards birth control and sexual education have lower rates of abortions and teen pregnancies.

That is what I would aim for, not making an important right over ones body illegal.

No one has the right to violate the rights of a child with their body.

I'm surprised that we can't agree on that.

 

[xotoxi]

Exceptions for rape or incest completely ruin the argument about a fetus being a human being with constitutional rights, IMO. If you believe that it is a child being murdered, how can it matter if the child was created through rape or incest?

I do not think the law can ask its citizens to bear loads that are too great, and these two cases may easily be such, and so the decision is left to the mother.

I would limit abortion legally to the first trimester as soon as the lungs, brain and heart are functioning; the inverse of how we determine the point of the death of a person.

The lungs don't function until the baby is born and takes his first breath.

 

[Coyote]

It does not change anything.

When the Supreme court said during Roe that if a State established personhood for children in the womb, the case FOR abortion becomes near IMPOSSIBLE to make. . . Did they say "unless the woman did not consent to the pregnancy?"

No.

The answer is no. They didn't.

You were asking me my opinion. Which I gave. You are giving your opinion. A woman who uses birth control is most certainly not consenting to pregnancy any more than you consent to manslaughter when you go for a drive.

Unfortunately in your world reliable birth control would be greatly reduced.

Shows what you know.

I can only go by what I see you posting.

In my world, birth control would become increasingly used and more and more effective as, without having abortion as a safety net, the demand for preventing pregnancies will increase significantly and the makers of those medicines and devices (condoms) will compete with one another to meet that demand.

The demand is already there as is the competition. I don't think you realize that abortion is not undertaken lightly by most women nor is it cheap. Abortion is a necessary and legal safetynet.

Contraceptives have greatly improved over the years since abortion became legal...but the most effective ones still have abortive properties as a secondary protection I believe. Condoms are less effective.

European countries with far more liberal policies towards birth control and sexual education have lower rates of abortions and teen pregnancies.

That is what I would aim for, not making an important right over ones body illegal.

No one has the right to violate the rights of a child with their body.

I'm surprised that we can't agree on that.

No one has the right to take control of your body against your will. I'm surprised you can't see that.

 

[Chuz Life]

When the Supreme court said during Roe that if a State established personhood for children in the womb, the case FOR abortion becomes near IMPOSSIBLE to make. . . Did they say "unless the woman did not consent to the pregnancy?"

No.

The answer is no. They didn't.

You were asking me my opinion. Which I gave. You are giving your opinion. A woman who uses birth control is most certainly not consenting to pregnancy any more than you consent to manslaughter when you go for a drive.

Unfortunately in your world reliable birth control would be greatly reduced.

Shows what you know.

I can only go by what I see you posting.

In my world, birth control would become increasingly used and more and more effective as, without having abortion as a safety net, the demand for preventing pregnancies will increase significantly and the makers of those medicines and devices (condoms) will compete with one another to meet that demand.

The demand is already there as is the competition. I don't think you realize that abortion is not undertaken lightly by most women nor is it cheap. Abortion is a necessary and legal safetynet.

Contraceptives have greatly improved over the years since abortion became legal...but the most effective ones still have abortive properties as a secondary protection I believe. Condoms are less effective.

European countries with far more liberal policies towards birth control and sexual education have lower rates of abortions and teen pregnancies.

That is what I would aim for, not making an important right over ones body illegal.

No one has the right to violate the rights of a child with their body.

I'm surprised that we can't agree on that.

No one has the right to take control of your body against your will. I'm surprised you can't see that.

How is denying the woman's right to kill her Children with abortion any different from Denying her right to kill them after they stick their little heads out? It's the same bodies, same choices, same faces fingers and toes. . . Isn't it?

 

[Chuz Life]

The President will sign it but blood lust Democrats/Rino's, that's doubtful...

---------------------------------



Washington (CNN)The House of Representatives passed legislation Tuesday that would criminalize abortions after 20 weeks of pregnancy, with exceptions for instances where the life of the mother is at risk and in cases involving rape or incest.

The bill passed the House by a vote of 237 for and 189 against, largely on party lines.
The Pain-Capable Unborn Child Protection Act, which is similar to legislation that failed in 2013and 2015, has support from the White House this time around.


House passes ban on abortion after 20 weeks - CNNPolitics

What about the life and/or health of fetus - Down Syndrome?

What about quality of life given certain birth defects?

What about?

Do Children with birth defects have fewer rights than the rest of us?

 

[Coyote]

You were asking me my opinion. Which I gave. You are giving your opinion. A woman who uses birth control is most certainly not consenting to pregnancy any more than you consent to manslaughter when you go for a drive.

Unfortunately in your world reliable birth control would be greatly reduced.

Shows what you know.

I can only go by what I see you posting.

In my world, birth control would become increasingly used and more and more effective as, without having abortion as a safety net, the demand for preventing pregnancies will increase significantly and the makers of those medicines and devices (condoms) will compete with one another to meet that demand.

The demand is already there as is the competition. I don't think you realize that abortion is not undertaken lightly by most women nor is it cheap. Abortion is a necessary and legal safetynet.

Contraceptives have greatly improved over the years since abortion became legal...but the most effective ones still have abortive properties as a secondary protection I believe. Condoms are less effective.

European countries with far more liberal policies towards birth control and sexual education have lower rates of abortions and teen pregnancies.

That is what I would aim for, not making an important right over ones body illegal.

No one has the right to violate the rights of a child with their body.

I'm surprised that we can't agree on that.

No one has the right to take control of your body against your will. I'm surprised you can't see that.

How is denying the woman's right to kill her. Children with abortion and different for. Denying her right to kill them after they stick their little heads out? It's the same bodies, same choices, same faces fingers and toes. . . Isn't it?

Now you are getting into emotional "pap" as you termed it.

The issue is competing rights. No one has the right to your body but you. You seem to want to exclude women from that right.