Everyone, even the feminist, must admit that it takes male and female to make a child. There are very few actual reasons that people have for aborting a fetus. You can "what if" this action to death but if we are all honest the major reasons are: (1) I just do not have time to raise this child without giving up things that I want to do. (2) I just don't want to look fat. (3) I will have to give up my lifestyle of partying. Not being able to drink and or take drugs is just too much to ask. (4) Being pregnant will hurt my chances of having or finding a man. (5) My man doesn't want any children.

Perhaps it is better that a child never be born than to be raised by a parent that is so selfish. The truth is there are many men that would love to raise a child that they have conceived with a woman even though she is wishing to end the life of the fetus. Even the feminist can not say today that a woman makes a better or more neccessary parent for a child than a man. A non-sexist way to handle the matter of abortion would be that the only legal abortion would be one in which the man and woman sign off on the death of the fetus. If the man wishes to raise the child then perhaps the woman should be forced by law to finish the pregnancy. In which case the man would take charge of the child and the woman would have no claim on the child nor have any liability of child support. In a case where a woman wishes to have the child and the man wishes to abort it then she could have the child but the man would have no claim nor child support to pay. Man and woman have an equal responsibility for prevention. This is the only non-sexist way of handling a matter after all, women are just as intelligent as men and with so many birth control methods out, there is no reason why they can not also control the pregnancy. Many look at the fetus as a non-living thing. If it is a non living thing we still must admit that it took a man and woman together to create the fetus. If a man and a woman bought a house together the woman only owns half of it therefore she does not have the right to destroy it without the agreement from the other owner. To do so would be criminal and punishment would be placed on her. The woman could give or sell the man her half of the house if she does not want it or the man could give or sell her his share.

I personally do not believe that abortion is the correct thing to do. I raised my two children and will love them forever. If you don't want children don't get pregnant.

This is a terrible point. Abortion isn't like a house sale. By its very nature, the decision can only be made by one person. If you make it so the man has to consent, then you've essentially given a veto power and put all of the power in the hands of the man. If you don't have it so that the man has to consent, all the power is in the hands of the woman.

In the end, by its nature, the whole decision has to rest with one person. Not an ideal situation, but that's the way it is. As between the two people involved, it makes more sense to have the decision fall to the woman than the man.

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"There ain't no devil, there's just God when he's drunk." - Tom Waits

the reasons you gave were rediculous. there are other, truly viable reasons for getting an abortion. the fact you didnt list them shows your view is extremely biased and not worth the time of trying to debate. try to have a more open mind on the topic, then we'll talk

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sealybobo thinks im a racist right winger. RGS thinks im a braindead liberal. I wonder which one I am?

the best view is from the middle

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"I believe there are more instances of the abridgement of freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments by those in power than by violent and sudden usurpations. ... The means of defense against foreign danger historically have become the instruments of tyranny at home." James Madison

As it stands now, the veto power is placed solely in the hands of the woman. The man is completely at the mercy of the woman's whim. If a woman chooses to keep a child the man is willing to have aborted, then the man should have a legal avenue to be absolved of all responsibility for the child from that point forward. As we all know, that is not the case.

It's never going to be 50-50 fair, but it could be more fair than it is.

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“The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing” - Edmund Burke

That's not a good solution at all. That punishes the child. "Child support" is for the child, who is the only innocent party in the whole mess.

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"There ain't no devil, there's just God when he's drunk." - Tom Waits

Yep. Men should be able to "sign off" on any parental rights to be absolved of any monetary responsibilities.

The country is setup to baby women and fuck men over, however. And odumba is going to fuck them even worse by trying to pass his bullshit communist "Fair pay" nonsense. But I digress.

Get this, my brother found out after 7-8 years of paying court ordered child support and acting as the father to a kid that wasn't even his, at least accodring to the DNA. When he went in to get the court ordered removed, they basically said your screwed. He has to pay for a kid that isn't even his for 10 more years. According to the courts, he is the father.

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Barack Obama -- living proof stupidity cannot be cured and that education merely reinforces it.

I think I'll dedicate the rest of my life to crying over the raw deal that men get from society. Especially white men.

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Great advice. And if you do want children, get pregnant.

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Like every 17 year old boy who knocks up his gf won't ask her to get an abortion... then if she refuses, he wouldn't pay.

RAFLMAO!

I do love the absurdity. If men got pregnant, they'd never have to ask anyone for permission to control their bodies.

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When the Founding Fathers protected our right to free speech, I think that meant we were supposed to use it.

Abu Musab Al-Zarqawi was the world's most unhinged lunatic. He's now dead. So that moves Ann Coulter up to first place - David Letterman

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51 days left http://www.backwardsbush.com/

Jullian smears:


Sexist pap.

If you don't LIKE abortions, don't have one.

I am anti-abortion. That is no secret, but I will not let that sway my point to this discussion as I am not going to advocate not having an abortion in this point.

Anyway, back to the point, if i get a girl pregnant, I become a father. Period. That is how it works. I fertilize an egg, and a baby begins to develop. I fertilized it, right? So, I am a father. As a father, I think it is my duty to provide for the child I helped to create. Yet, for some reason, that is not my role in society. Instead, I am at the mercy of the woman's will. If she decides to have the child, I am forced into child support. I agree with that. Yet, if she decides to abort, and I want to raise the child on my own), there is nothing I can do. So, in a sense, this gives the woman the power of life and purse. She not only controls the decision of whether or not the baby lives, but she controls my wallet. There is nothing I can do about that. That is wrong.

If the woman wants to have full control of the decision, then she needs to take full responsibility. The man needs to have some choice in it as some point. If the woman decides on whether or not to give birth, than the man needs to at least have some choice as to whether or not to be a father and provide money for the child support. It is as fair as it can get. (I would not deny my child anything, but that is me. I don't expect everyone to make the same choice.)

The only half-legitimate argument against this logic is to say the man made his choice when he impregnated the woman. Yet, shouldn't that go both ways? Unless she was raped, she gave it up willingly, as well. It takes two. Also, how is it you can donate to a sperm bank with monetary responsibility to a conceived child from your man-goo (while getting paid for the sperm), but not if you actually have sex. Seems like something is out of touch to me.

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"Like virtually every other liberal crusade, gun control is based on the assumption that other people lack common sense and must be controlled by the superior wisdom and virtue of the annoited." - Thomas Sowell

"I hope we once again have reminded people that man is not free unless government is limited." - Ronald Reagan

"I know no safe depository of the ultimate powers of the society but the people themselves; and if we think them not enlightened enough to exercise their control with wholesome discretion, the remedy is not to take it from them, but to inform their discretion." - Thomas Jefferson

This would be great if it were true. Child support is rarely for the child.

The above was not my intention in starting this thread. I again say I am against abortion but if it takes two to concieve a child; then they should have equal say on whether to kill the fetus. I feel the woman has equal intelligence, control of her decisions to have sex, and a greater ability to prevent pregnancy. Abortion has become a means of birth control. The woman is the sole decider of any such decision. The fetus is no more of the woman than it is the man. Just like everything else in America we should have equal say.

stivex - I'm going to petition the UN so that men can get pregnant too and we can decide whether or not we bring a child to term and whether or not we go through childbirth, either by vaginal delivery or by Caesarian section.

I'm going to do this because I totally believe in equal rights for men and women when it comes to sexual intercourse and pregnancy and childbirth.

It's only right.

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Blowhards-R-Us

That every woman should have completely control over her own womb is so obvious that I marvel anyone can make an argument against that concept.

Now many of you have brought up issues regarding child support cases where men are CLEARLY being screwed and thinking that since those laws are screwed up (and they are) that means we ought to make woman have babies they don't want.

No, what we ought to do is change those child support laws to reflect the fact that WOMAN has the sole right to have a child or not.

Now, if some woman and man accidently impregnate a woman, and that was NOT on BOTH their agendas before she got preggers:

1. The WOMAN should be able to decide whether or not to bring the child to term; AND

2. The MAN should be able to decide whether or not to be involved with that woman should she elect, over his objections, to have that child.

Obviously that concept does NOT apply to married couples.

The problem is, they can't have equal say for the reasons I stated above. In the end, the decision has to come down to one person or the other if they disagree. There's no way you can make it so they have equal say, and taking support away from the child as a result is a horrible idea and the result would be disastrous.

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"There ain't no devil, there's just God when he's drunk." - Tom Waits