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The Real Meaning of the IRS Scandal: Anti-Rule of Law

This is a discussion on The Real Meaning of the IRS Scandal: Anti-Rule of Law within the Politics forums, part of the US Discussion category; Quote: Originally Posted by Spoonman Quote: Originally Posted by martybegan Quote: Originally Posted by Spoonman the irs has exposed themselves as nothing more than yet ...


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  #16 (permalink)  
Old 06-04-2013, 10:19 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by Spoonman View Post
Quote: Originally Posted by martybegan View Post
Quote: Originally Posted by Spoonman View Post
the irs has exposed themselves as nothing more than yet another corrupt arm of a corrupt government. how do we continue to allow government to continue to take more and more control of our lives? now healthcare is added to the pile. the irs, a joke, the FDA, a joke. all the way down the line, a joke.
The other concern is the shifting of all this from the local level to the federal level, while at the same time maintaining the state level buracracies that become simple pass along organizations, beholden to the purse string controllers at the federal level.
the federal government is on a major power grab across the board. at the same time, funding less. we feel the pinch in increased state and local taxes

That's not an accident. It's a feature of government to attempt to extend its power. The Founders were aware of this, and built in checks and balances. Unfortunately, the power grabbers have successfully undone many Constitutional protections.
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  #17 (permalink)  
Old 06-04-2013, 10:31 AM
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Quote: Originally Posted by boedicca View Post
Quote: Originally Posted by Spoonman View Post
Quote: Originally Posted by martybegan View Post

The other concern is the shifting of all this from the local level to the federal level, while at the same time maintaining the state level buracracies that become simple pass along organizations, beholden to the purse string controllers at the federal level.
the federal government is on a major power grab across the board. at the same time, funding less. we feel the pinch in increased state and local taxes

That's not an accident. It's a feature of government to attempt to extend its power. The Founders were aware of this, and built in checks and balances. Unfortunately, the power grabbers have successfully undone many Constitutional protections.
I am fully aware of that. one of the points I always argue is that what is happeneing today is a step by step, methodical dismantling of the constitution and our rights. it is being done both overtly, as in gun rights and covertly, as the IRS until it blew up. the only tool left in our bag is the vote and they know that is now ineffective because the voting block is so partisan. The one thing we should be holding steadfast on regardless of political affiliation is the erosion of our rights.
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Old 06-04-2013, 11:55 AM
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Indeed. The progressives have telegraphed repeatedly the agenda to "transform" America.

The Tea Party took this seriously, and has been targeted by the Fourth Branch.
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Old 06-04-2013, 12:00 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by boedicca View Post
Indeed. The progressives have telegraphed repeatedly the agenda to "transform" America.

The Tea Party took this seriously, and has been targeted by the Fourth Branch.
the tea party was a much needed reaction to what is going on in america. unfortunately the country was riding a very liberal wave at the time and that wave had universal support from all forms of the media. they were painted black right from the start. as in any movement, there were a few fanatical individuals who gained the lions share of the spotlight. but at the same time, the same fanatics on the left went untouched
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Old 06-04-2013, 12:05 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by boedicca View Post
Many people, including me, have noted that one of the biggest threats to our liberty is the growth of the fourth branch of government, the permanent bureaucracy. We're at the stage where the regulations created by the fourth branch significantly outnumber the laws passed by Congress...and the trend is to do end runs around Congress when the latter refuses to pass a law.

The aspect to this which is most chilling is that under such regulations, the individual usually has to prove his innocence. As we see in the current IRS scandal, the bureaucrats are able to engage in expensive and intimidating witch hunts without a shred of real evidence. This voids the Rule of Law. It's no better than organized crime.

The specific individuals in the IRS, DOJ, EPA etc abuses of power don't matter....the entire fourth branch is the problem.
We can thank FDR for threatening the Supreme Court to allow Congress to abdicate or delegate its law making powers to other agencies.
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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 06-04-2013, 04:06 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by Spoonman View Post
Quote: Originally Posted by boedicca View Post
Indeed. The progressives have telegraphed repeatedly the agenda to "transform" America.

The Tea Party took this seriously, and has been targeted by the Fourth Branch.
the tea party was a much needed reaction to what is going on in america. unfortunately the country was riding a very liberal wave at the time and that wave had universal support from all forms of the media. they were painted black right from the start. as in any movement, there were a few fanatical individuals who gained the lions share of the spotlight. but at the same time, the same fanatics on the left went untouched

The permanent bureaucracy and the MSM collaborated with politicians to stall conservative participation. The country is not majority-liberal. The real wave was one of increasing government control.
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Old 06-04-2013, 04:09 PM
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Right Frelling On. Speaking Truth To Power:

"I am not here as a serf or vassal. I am not begging my lords for mercy. I’m a born free American woman, wife, mother and citizen. And I’m telling my government that you’ve forgotten your place. It’s not your responsibility to look out for my well-being, and to monitor my speech. It’s not your right to assert an agenda. Your post, the post that you occupy, exists to preserve American liberty. You’ve sworn to perform that duty. And you have faltered."

--- Wetumpka Tea Party leader Becky Gerritson

The PJ Tatler » [VIDEO] Tea Party Leader Becky Gerritson Tells IRS, Congress, Government: ?You?ve Forgotten Your Place?
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Old 06-04-2013, 04:18 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by ShootSpeeders View Post
Quote: Originally Posted by boedicca View Post
Many people, including me, have noted that one of the biggest threats to our liberty is the growth of the fourth branch of government, the permanent bureaucracy. We're at the stage where the regulations created by the fourth branch significantly outnumber the laws passed by Congress...and the trend is to do end runs around Congress when the latter refuses to pass a law.

.
It is unconstitutional for bureaucrats to write laws. The first words of the constitution after the preamble are

"All legislative Powers herein granted shall be vested in a Congress of the United States, which shall consist of a Senate and House of Representatives."

Likewise with laws written by the SCOTUS.
Bureaucrats do not write laws, they write regulations that have the same force as law. Over the last fifty to sixty years, the federal bureaucrats have written so many regulations that no one can even catelog them all.

Most large businesses now have compliance offices where people attempt to ensure that the business complies with all the regulations that affect their business. Small businesses cannot afford to do the same, and plow forward hoping they are in full compliance, but having no real sense that they are. They find out they are not, when they get a notice that some bureaucracy is fining them thousands of dollars for failure to comply with a regulation that they did not know even existed.

Obamacare has not even been implemented yet, but the regulations involving the law is already well over 19,000 pages and growing.
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Old 06-04-2013, 04:23 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by martybegan View Post
Quote: Originally Posted by Oddball View Post
Quote: Originally Posted by martybegan View Post

The other concern is the shifting of all this from the local level to the federal level, while at the same time maintaining the state level buracracies that become simple pass along organizations, beholden to the purse string controllers at the federal level.
That's been going on for decades....How do you think the .08 BAC level and the 55 mph speed limit got crammed down out throats?
Soon to be a .05 limit if the modern day prohibitionists at MADD get thier way.

Dont forget about the 21 year old drinking age as well.
....seatbelts...helmets....
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Old 06-04-2013, 04:29 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by hortysir View Post
Quote: Originally Posted by martybegan View Post
Quote: Originally Posted by Oddball View Post
That's been going on for decades....How do you think the .08 BAC level and the 55 mph speed limit got crammed down out throats?
Soon to be a .05 limit if the modern day prohibitionists at MADD get thier way.

Dont forget about the 21 year old drinking age as well.
....seatbelts...helmets....


I had to sign a pledge that I would wear my seatbelt when my parents added me to their auto insurance policy. The free market can take care of such things much better than DC.
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Old 06-04-2013, 04:29 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by Erand7899 View Post
Quote: Originally Posted by ShootSpeeders View Post
Quote: Originally Posted by boedicca View Post
Many people, including me, have noted that one of the biggest threats to our liberty is the growth of the fourth branch of government, the permanent bureaucracy. We're at the stage where the regulations created by the fourth branch significantly outnumber the laws passed by Congress...and the trend is to do end runs around Congress when the latter refuses to pass a law.

.
It is unconstitutional for bureaucrats to write laws. The first words of the constitution after the preamble are

"All legislative Powers herein granted shall be vested in a Congress of the United States, which shall consist of a Senate and House of Representatives."

Likewise with laws written by the SCOTUS.
Bureaucrats do not write laws, they write regulations that have the same force as law. Over the last fifty to sixty years, the federal bureaucrats have written so many regulations that no one can even catelog them all.

Most large businesses now have compliance offices where people attempt to ensure that the business complies with all the regulations that affect their business. Small businesses cannot afford to do the same, and plow forward hoping they are in full compliance, but having no real sense that they are. They find out they are not, when they get a notice that some bureaucracy is fining them thousands of dollars for failure to comply with a regulation that they did not know even existed.

Obamacare has not even been implemented yet, but the regulations involving the law is already well over 19,000 pages and growing.


When there is a regulation for everything, we are all guilty until proven innocent.
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Old 06-04-2013, 04:51 PM
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Quote: Originally Posted by boedicca View Post
Quote: Originally Posted by Erand7899 View Post
Quote: Originally Posted by ShootSpeeders View Post

It is unconstitutional for bureaucrats to write laws. The first words of the constitution after the preamble are

"All legislative Powers herein granted shall be vested in a Congress of the United States, which shall consist of a Senate and House of Representatives."

Likewise with laws written by the SCOTUS.
Bureaucrats do not write laws, they write regulations that have the same force as law. Over the last fifty to sixty years, the federal bureaucrats have written so many regulations that no one can even catelog them all.

Most large businesses now have compliance offices where people attempt to ensure that the business complies with all the regulations that affect their business. Small businesses cannot afford to do the same, and plow forward hoping they are in full compliance, but having no real sense that they are. They find out they are not, when they get a notice that some bureaucracy is fining them thousands of dollars for failure to comply with a regulation that they did not know even existed.

Obamacare has not even been implemented yet, but the regulations involving the law is already well over 19,000 pages and growing.


When there is a regulation for everything, we are all guilty until proven innocent.
And, when we are all guilty, the government has control of us all. They can bankrupt us at will, and they will whenever they feel the need. The vast majority of us do not even have the means necessary to fight the federal government is court. They will own us.

Supreme Court Rules For Idaho Couple In EPA Battle - ABC News

“The EPA used bullying and threats of terrifying fines, and has made our life hell for the past five years,” Mike Sackett said in a statement. ”It said we could not go to court and challenge their bogus claim that our small lot had ‘wetlands’ on it. As this nightmare went on, we rubbed our eyes and started to wonder if we were living in some totalitarian country. Now, the Supreme Court has come to our rescue, and reminded the EPA – and everyone – that this is still America, and Americans still have rights under the Constitution.”

The Sacketts were lucky they had the resources necessary to fight the EPA for 5 years, and finally get to the Supreme Court.
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Old 06-04-2013, 05:19 PM
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boedicca gives orders to the Illuminati boedicca gives orders to the Illuminati boedicca gives orders to the Illuminati boedicca gives orders to the Illuminati boedicca gives orders to the Illuminati boedicca gives orders to the Illuminati boedicca gives orders to the Illuminati boedicca gives orders to the Illuminati boedicca gives orders to the Illuminati boedicca gives orders to the Illuminati boedicca gives orders to the Illuminati
Quote: Originally Posted by Erand7899 View Post
Quote: Originally Posted by boedicca View Post
Quote: Originally Posted by Erand7899 View Post

Bureaucrats do not write laws, they write regulations that have the same force as law. Over the last fifty to sixty years, the federal bureaucrats have written so many regulations that no one can even catelog them all.

Most large businesses now have compliance offices where people attempt to ensure that the business complies with all the regulations that affect their business. Small businesses cannot afford to do the same, and plow forward hoping they are in full compliance, but having no real sense that they are. They find out they are not, when they get a notice that some bureaucracy is fining them thousands of dollars for failure to comply with a regulation that they did not know even existed.

Obamacare has not even been implemented yet, but the regulations involving the law is already well over 19,000 pages and growing.


When there is a regulation for everything, we are all guilty until proven innocent.
And, when we are all guilty, the government has control of us all. They can bankrupt us at will, and they will whenever they feel the need. The vast majority of us do not even have the means necessary to fight the federal government is court. They will own us.

Supreme Court Rules For Idaho Couple In EPA Battle - ABC News

“The EPA used bullying and threats of terrifying fines, and has made our life hell for the past five years,” Mike Sackett said in a statement. ”It said we could not go to court and challenge their bogus claim that our small lot had ‘wetlands’ on it. As this nightmare went on, we rubbed our eyes and started to wonder if we were living in some totalitarian country. Now, the Supreme Court has come to our rescue, and reminded the EPA – and everyone – that this is still America, and Americans still have rights under the Constitution.”

The Sacketts were lucky they had the resources necessary to fight the EPA for 5 years, and finally get to the Supreme Court.

That's the point. It's much easier to intimidate the tax serfs into just toiling away and paying their "fair share" when the serf masters have Big Clubs.
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