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09-30-2008, 08:50 AM
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Originally Posted by KMAN  | The Fed is supposed to be looking out for Americans instead of letting this kind of shit happen. Why did they just ignore this idiotic scheme ?
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"Some men eventually stumble over the truth but they usually pick themselves up and walk on as if nothing ever happened."
-Winston Churchill
"But though there is no difference in this respect between the best demagogue and the worst, both of them having to present their cases equally in terms of melodrama, there is all the difference in the world between the statesman who is humbugging the people into allowing him to do the will of God, in whatever disguise it may come to him, and one who is humbugging them into furthering his personal ambition and the commercial interests of the plutocrats who own the newspapers and support him on reciprocal terms."
-George Bernard Shaw |
09-30-2008, 08:54 AM
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Rep Power: 14 | | Community Reinvestment Act - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Center for American Progress fellow Robert Gordon[19] noted that approximately half of the subprime loans were made by independent mortgage companies that were not regulated by the CRA and thus had no government obligation to offer credit to minorities. In the later part of the crisis, these mortgage companies made subprime loans at twice the rate of CRA banks. Another third of the major subprime lenders were regulated but had very little CRA involvement.[20] Gordon also makes the argument that the weakening of the CRA in 2004 was followed by intensified subprime lending.[20] Austrian economist Thomas DiLorenzo counters Gordon's statistic by arguing that even if half of the subprime loans were made by non-CRA companies, the CRA had still caused tens of billions in defaults on mortgages by unqualified borrowers. He further states that Gordon's statistic ignores that independent mortgage companies are middlemen who sell subprime loans to banks that are in turn regulated by the CRA.[21]
Ellen Seidman, former director of the US Office of Thrift Supervision during the Clinton administration, who also works at the New America Foundation,[22] has stated her belief that the CRA did not have an effect on the United States housing bubble.[23] She observes that CRA banks were particularly warned to make responsible investments, citing one of her own speeches as an example.[24]
[edit] References
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"The essence of the Liberal outlook lies not in what opinions are held, but in how they are held: instead of being held dogmatically, they are held tentatively, and with a consciousness that new evidence may at any moment lead to their abandonment." -Bertrand Russell |
09-30-2008, 09:03 AM
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Rep Power: 204 | | | KMAN, why don't you tell us in your own words why you think this is true.
Or you, Dillo, why don't you tell us?
I keep waiting for some Republican to find a poor black family and make them the poster boy for the meltdown of the economy.
"Do you know that Leroy and Shawana Brown are single-handedly responsible for the 700 billion shortfall in the mortgage backed securities market? Is this what you want your country to stand for? Vote for McCain/Palin and the bankers and Wall Street will be vindicated. I'm John McCain and I approve this message."
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09-30-2008, 09:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Ravi I keep waiting for some Republican to find a poor black family and make them the poster boy for the meltdown of the economy. | Why would you say such a thing? Are you implying that this mess is a matter of racial discrimination?
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09-30-2008, 09:15 AM
| | Registered User | | Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Maine
Posts: 6,442
Rep Power: 42 | | | You don't know what the fuck you're talking about, KMAN. |
09-30-2008, 09:17 AM
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Rep Power: 4 | | | care4all says that 75% of the loans defaulted on in the last 5 years were not CRA loans. That conversation hasn't concluded yet so, we'll see how it develops but in the meantime I'll accept the statement at face value.
OK, but then we must ask: how much does CRA account for the writing of mortages.
If, for example, they only comprise 5% of mortgages but account for 25% of the defaults that means a CRA is 5 times more likely to default. Again, my 5% figure is just a hypothetical.
But if CRA loans are above average defaulters it is not racist to say CRA laons are a bad idea if the lion's share of CRA loans are written to minorities. Facts are race neutral and wishing the GOP were racists does nothing but reinforce the petty bigotry in your mind that you're projecting onto the GOP.
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I support abortion because it keeps liberals from having children.
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09-30-2008, 09:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Ravi KMAN, why don't you tell us in your own words why you think this is true.
Or you, Dillo, why don't you tell us?
I keep waiting for some Republican to find a poor black family and make them the poster boy for the meltdown of the economy.
"Do you know that Leroy and Shawana Brown are single-handedly responsible for the 700 billion shortfall in the mortgage backed securities market? Is this what you want your country to stand for? Vote for McCain/Palin and the bankers and Wall Street will be vindicated. I'm John McCain and I approve this message." | You are a fucking idiot. If you can not see how MILLIONS of bad loans caused this you are not worth the time to talk to. Loans created because Government encouraged and then threatened Banks into making them. Legislation from Carter and Clinton.
Obama has as HIS financial advisor one of the people that CREATED this mess, Raines was booted out of his position because HE o'ked bad loans AND ok'ed bad reporting of said loans to cover them up.
Yup great guy to advise Obama on how to deal with a crisis he HELPED create.
McCain in 2005 tried to solve this problem and the Democrats opposed it. Bush in 2003 tried to fix this problem before it happened and again the Democrats stopped it. The same democrats now claiming with a straight face they had nothing to do with this problem.
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Facts are stubborn things, but statistics are more pliable
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I never said that you had no right to have an opinion. I just said that it was, in fact, worth nothing.
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09-30-2008, 09:33 AM
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Originally Posted by RetiredGySgt Loans created because Government encouraged and then threatened Banks into making them. | Show me.
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09-30-2008, 09:36 AM
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Originally Posted by HoleInTheVoid care4all says that 75% of the loans defaulted on in the last 5 years were not CRA loans. That conversation hasn't concluded yet so, we'll see how it develops but in the meantime I'll accept the statement at face value.
OK, but then we must ask: how much does CRA account for the writing of mortages.
If, for example, they only comprise 5% of mortgages but account for 25% of the defaults that means a CRA is 5 times more likely to default. Again, my 5% figure is just a hypothetical.
But if CRA loans are above average defaulters it is not racist to say CRA laons are a bad idea if the lion's share of CRA loans are written to minorities. Facts are race neutral and wishing the GOP were racists does nothing but reinforce the petty bigotry in your mind that you're projecting onto the GOP. | You obviously don't know the answer to your questions and yet you are perfectly happy blaming this entire mess on CRAs.
Why?
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09-30-2008, 09:37 AM
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Rep Power: 14 | | | Center for American Progress fellow Robert Gordon[19] noted that approximately half of the subprime loans were made by independent mortgage companies that were not regulated by the CRA and thus had no government obligation to offer credit to minorities
Do you guys realize this means it was not CRA's effect that did this guys?
It was how the loans were made profitable by the Gramm leach Blialey act by allowing them to be packaged with other loans and securites and resold at a profit and avoiding the end results of their failure.
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"The essence of the Liberal outlook lies not in what opinions are held, but in how they are held: instead of being held dogmatically, they are held tentatively, and with a consciousness that new evidence may at any moment lead to their abandonment." -Bertrand Russell |
09-30-2008, 09:42 AM
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Originally Posted by RetiredGySgt You are a fucking idiot. If you can not see how MILLIONS of bad loans caused this you are not worth the time to talk to. Loans created because Government encouraged and then threatened Banks into making them. Legislation from Carter and Clinton.
Obama has as HIS financial advisor one of the people that CREATED this mess, Raines was booted out of his position because HE o'ked bad loans AND ok'ed bad reporting of said loans to cover them up.
Yup great guy to advise Obama on how to deal with a crisis he HELPED create.
McCain in 2005 tried to solve this problem and the Democrats opposed it. Bush in 2003 tried to fix this problem before it happened and again the Democrats stopped it. The same democrats now claiming with a straight face they had nothing to do with this problem. | you're missing it, completely....goes deeper... It's Still Not CRA | New America Blogs
the lenders NOT COVERED by CRA made 75% of the subprime, risky loans, then sliced and diced them, and sold them off, masked in different forms, like MBS's....mortgage backed securities....while the regulatory and rating agencies turn a blind eye...and rating agencies were rating these MBS's as top of the line investments, which they were not....  |
09-30-2008, 09:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Ravi You obviously don't know the answer to your questions and yet you are perfectly happy blaming this entire mess on CRAs.
Why? | You're a retard.
I said twice my number was aan example/hypothetical.
How does asking a question indicate a desire for anything?
Now I am somewhat skeptical that A) 25% of all mortgages written under the CRA and if they are B) they are legitmate in accordance letter/spirit of the law. In other words: people gaming the system to get a break they don't need/couldn't qualify for.
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I support homosexuality because it keeps liberals from breeding.
I support abortion because it keeps liberals from having children.
I support public education because it keeps liberal children pliable, unthinking and easily lead.
I support euthanasia because old sick liberals aren't worth paying for.
I support welfare because liberals will not eat if they displease me.
How do you like me now? |
09-30-2008, 09:52 AM
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Originally Posted by HoleInTheVoid care4all says that 75% of the loans defaulted on in the last 5 years were not CRA loans. That conversation hasn't concluded yet so, we'll see how it develops but in the meantime I'll accept the statement at face value.
OK, but then we must ask: how much does CRA account for the writing of mortages.
If, for example, they only comprise 5% of mortgages but account for 25% of the defaults that means a CRA is 5 times more likely to default. Again, my 5% figure is just a hypothetical.
But if CRA loans are above average defaulters it is not racist to say CRA laons are a bad idea if the lion's share of CRA loans are written to minorities. Facts are race neutral and wishing the GOP were racists does nothing but reinforce the petty bigotry in your mind that you're projecting onto the GOP. | no hole, i said 75% of the subprime mortgages made to borrowers the past 5 years, were made by lenders that were not covered by CRA legislation...they were UNREGULATED....and not required to accomodate the lower income borrowers or small business owners or women which the CRA covers.
note!
75% of the loans made the past 5 years....
some are using a figure of 50%, but that is a figure from statistics up to 2004, i believe, and does not include the push these institutions not covered by CRA have had the past few years.... |
09-30-2008, 09:58 AM
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Originally Posted by Ravi KMAN, why don't you tell us in your own words why you think this is true.
Or you, Dillo, why don't you tell us?
I keep waiting for some Republican to find a poor black family and make them the poster boy for the meltdown of the economy.
"Do you know that Leroy and Shawana Brown are single-handedly responsible for the 700 billion shortfall in the mortgage backed securities market? Is this what you want your country to stand for? Vote for McCain/Palin and the bankers and Wall Street will be vindicated. I'm John McCain and I approve this message." | It happened because the banks realized the government would bail them out if they got into trouble... and that is exactly what our government is trying to do... when there is no risk of failure, this happens. | | Thread Tools | | | | Display Modes |  Linear Mode | 
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